CNN Meteorologist: Manmade Global Warming Theory 'Arrogant'

[Sanibel]

Antarctica is now in on it too and at an increasing rate (but don't worry because it is all natural and think about the source):




http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32985250/ns/us_news-environment/

[lurkey]

Never said the melting was linear and it could increase in the future. Perhaps Greenland will be able to support farming again in the future before the cold returns.....MGC

MGC, did you know it was warm enough in England at one time to grow grapes for wine. . . . apparently the quality was good because the French were ticked off about of the lack of diminished trade. .

[x-y-no]

Never said the melting was linear and it could increase in the future. Perhaps Greenland will be able to support farming again in the future before the cold returns.....MGC

MGC, did you know it was warm enough in England at one time to grow grapes for wine. . . . apparently the quality was good because the French were ticked off about of the lack of diminished trade. .

There are over 350 vineyards in England and 17 in Wales now.

[lurkey]

Never said the melting was linear and it could increase in the future. Perhaps Greenland will be able to support farming again in the future before the cold returns.....MGC

MGC, did you know it was warm enough in England at one time to grow grapes for wine. . . . apparently the quality was good because the French were ticked off about of the lack of diminished trade. .

There are over 350 vineyards in England and 17 in Wales now.

At point, though it got too cold to grow grapes in England. So is the wine any good?

[SaskatchewanScreamer]

What's even more amazing, than England growing grapes there, is that there is a Vineyard now in Saskatchewan (and we get much colder than Medieval England ever got).

http://www.cypresshillswinery.com/

Most people I've heard from find it to be surprisingly good:
http://www.tidingsmag.com/wine/new-worl ... hewan.html
http://www.airforums.com/forums/blogs/b ... inery-441/

However, to be fair, the grapes grown in Europe and California can only take temperatures of -20 degrees Celsius (we can hit that in October). The grape vine roots here have to handle temperatures down to -40.

However if we keep having warm winters I can see them growing the California vines as well.

Personally I think their grape wine stands up to many of the California wines I've tried (however I'm not a connoisseur . Their chokecherry wine is fantastic btw and we buy a case of it every trip.

[Dionne]

While I don't know much about grapes.....I am personally witnessing my wife grow papayas outdoors at 32N latitude. I would have bet money it wasn't possible.

[MGC]

We are growing grapfruit here on the MS coast. Sure it is getting warmer the past couple of decades but it is natural....keep on shining sun!.......MGC

[Sanibel]

Global Surface Temperature Was Second Warmest For September
ScienceDaily (Oct. 18, 2009) — "The combined global land and ocean surface temperature was the second warmest September on record, according to NOAA’s National Climatic Data Center in Asheville, N.C. Based on records going back to 1880, the monthly National Climatic Data Center analysis is part of the suite of climate services NOAA provides.

NCDC scientists also reported that the average land surface temperature for September was the second warmest on record, behind 2005. Additionally, the global ocean surface temperature was tied for the fifth warmest on record for September".

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 140633.htm

Getting awful quiet in here...

[Sanibel]

More "arrogance" verifying:


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-0 ... -melt.html



.

[Florida1118]

Uggghhhhh this is the oldest debate in the history of meteorology! And really, were not going to find out in any short period of time.

[Sanibel]

Tell that to the arctic ice mass.

[Sanibel]

Record low Arctic ice:


http://www.earthtimes.org/climate/arcti ... imum/1359/

[RL3AO]

Yet the Antarctic remains within normal levels. Couldn't one argue this might have something to do with the North Pacific and North Atlantic being in a natural warm phase?



All I'm saying is people like to ignore the Antarctic when it doesn't fit their POV.

[SaskatchewanScreamer]

Which large industrial country sends it's CO2, etc over the Antarctic?

[Sanibel]

I don't have the links right now but I've read articles saying Antarctica is losing ice too. Haven't you seen the articles about ice calving-off Antarctica in big chunks???

Ah, read about Texas lately?

[Sanibel]

"Freakish weather disasters — from the sudden October snowstorm in the Northeast U.S. to the record floods in Thailand — are striking more often. And global warming is likely to spawn more similar weather extremes at a huge cost, says a draft summary of an international climate report obtained by The Associated Press.

The final draft of the report from a panel of the world's top climate scientists paints a wild future for a world already weary of weather catastrophes costing billions of dollars.
The report says costs will rise and perhaps some locations will become "increasingly marginal as
places to live."

The report from the Nobel Prize-winning Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change will be issued
in a few weeks, after a meeting in Uganda. It says there is at least a 2-in-3 probability that climate extremes have already worsened because of man-made greenhouse gases.

This marks a change in climate science from focusing on subtle changes in daily average temperatures
to concentrating on the harder-to-analyze freak events that grab headlines, cause economic damage
and kill people. The most recent bizarre weather extreme, the pre-Halloween snowstorm, is typical of the damage climate scientists warn will occur — but it's not typical of the events they tie to global warming.

"The extremes are a really noticeable aspect of climate change," said Jerry Meehl, senior scientist at the National Center for Atmospheric Research. "I think people realize that the extremes are where
we are going to see a lot of the impacts of climate change."

Weather Underground meteorology director Jeff Masters, who wasn't involved in the study, said in the United States from June to August this year, blistering heat set 2,703 daily high temperature records, compared with only 300 cold records during that period, making it the hottest summer in the U.S.
since the Dust Bowl of 1936."

[jasons2k]

I didn't see this posted here - interesting stuff:

WASHINGTON (AP) — A prominent physicist and skeptic of global warming spent two years trying to find out if mainstream climate scientists were wrong. In the end, he determined they were right: Temperatures really are rising rapidly.

The study of the world's surface temperatures by Richard Muller was partially bankrolled by a foundation connected to global warming deniers. He pursued long-held skeptic theories in analyzing the data. He was spurred to action because of "Climategate," a British scandal involving hacked emails of scientists.

Yet he found that the land is 1.6 degrees warmer than in the 1950s. Those numbers from Muller, who works at the University of California, Berkeley and Lawrence Berkeley National Lab, match those by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration and NASA.

He said he went even further back, studying readings from Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Jefferson. His ultimate finding of a warming world, to be presented at a conference Monday, is no different from what mainstream climate scientists have been saying for decades.

What's different, and why everyone from opinion columnists to "The Daily Show" is paying attention is who is behind the study.

One-quarter of the $600,000 to do the research came from the Charles Koch Foundation, whose founder is a major funder of skeptic groups and the tea party. The Koch brothers, Charles and David, run a large privately held company involved in oil and other industries, producing sizable greenhouse gas emissions.

Muller's research team carefully examined two chief criticisms by skeptics. One is that weather stations are unreliable; the other is that cities, which create heat islands, were skewing the temperature analysis.

"The skeptics raised valid points and everybody should have been a skeptic two years ago," Muller said in a telephone interview. "And now we have confidence that the temperature rise that had previously been reported had been done without bias."

Muller said that he came into the study "with a proper skepticism," something scientists "should always have. I was somewhat bothered by the fact that there was not enough skepticism" before.

There is no reason now to be a skeptic about steadily increasing temperatures, Muller wrote recently in The Wall Street Journal's editorial pages, a place friendly to skeptics. Muller did not address in his research the cause of global warming. The overwhelming majority of climate scientists say it's man-made from the burning of fossil fuels such as coal and oil. Nor did his study look at ocean warming, future warming and how much of a threat to mankind climate change might be.

Still, Muller said it makes sense to reduce the carbon dioxide created by fossil fuels.

"Greenhouse gases could have a disastrous impact on the world," he said. Still, he contends that threat is not as proven as the Nobel Prize-winning Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change says it is.

On Monday, Muller was taking his results — four separate papers that are not yet published or peer-reviewed, but will be, he says — to a conference in Santa Fe, N.M., expected to include many prominent skeptics as well as mainstream scientists.

"Of course he'll be welcome," said Petr Chylek of Los Alamos National Lab, a noted skeptic and the conference organizer. "The purpose of our conference is to bring people with different views on climate together, so they can talk and clarify things."

Shawn Lawrence Otto, author of the book "Fool Me Twice" that criticizes science skeptics, said Muller should expect to be harshly treated by global warming deniers. "Now he's considered a traitor. For the skeptic community, this isn't about data or fact. It's about team sports. He's been traded to the Indians. He's playing for the wrong team now."

And that started on Sunday, when a British newspaper said one of Muller's co-authors, Georgia Tech climate scientist Judith Curry, accused Muller of another Climategate-like scandal and trying to "hide the decline" of recent global temperatures.

The Associated Press contacted Curry on Sunday afternoon and she said in an email that Muller and colleagues "are not hiding any data or otherwise engaging in any scientifically questionable practice."

The Muller "results unambiguously show an increase in surface temperature since 1960," Curry wrote Sunday. She said she disagreed with Muller's public relations efforts and some public comments from Muller about there no longer being a need for skepticism.

Muller's study found that skeptics' concerns about poor weather station quality didn't skew the results of his analysis because temperature increases rose similarly in reliable and unreliable weather stations. He also found that while there is an urban heat island effect making cities warmer, rural areas, which are more abundant, are warming, too.
Among many climate scientists, the reaction was somewhat of a yawn.

"After lots of work he found exactly what was already known and accepted in the climate community," said Jerry North, a Texas A&M University atmospheric sciences professor who headed a National Academy of Sciences climate science review in 2006. "I am hoping their study will have a positive impact. But some folks will never change."

Chris Field, a Carnegie Institution scientist who is chief author of an upcoming intergovernmental climate change report, said Muller's study "may help the world's citizens focus less on whether climate change is real and more on smart options for addressing it."

Some of the most noted scientific skeptics are no longer saying the world isn't warming. Instead, they question how much of it is man-made, view it as less a threat and argue it's too expensive to do something about, Otto said.

Skeptical MIT scientist Richard Lindzen said it is a fact and nothing new that global average temperatures have been rising since 1950, as Muller shows. "It's hard to see how any serious scientist (skeptical, denier or believer — frequently depending on the exact question) will view it otherwise," he wrote in an email.

In a brief email statement, the Koch Foundation noted that Muller's team didn't examine ocean temperature or the cause of warming and said it will continue to fund such research. "The project is ongoing and entering peer review, and we're proud to support this strong, transparent research," said foundation spokeswoman Tonya Mullins.

http://news.yahoo.com/skeptic-finds-now ... 16605.html

[SaskatchewanScreamer]

Regarding the Eastern Canadian Arctic which I know gets a pretty direct hit from all kinds of sources.....

Canada's Top Ten Weather Stories for 2011

8. Arctic sea ice near record low

A drastic drop in ice levels in the Arctic threatened the life of animals and the people who rely on them in the northernmost parts of Canada.

This summer alone, Canada's largest ice shelf split into two pieces and another is now nearly gone, tearing away some three billion tonnes of ice from the northern coastline.

One of Canada's top climatologists made a point of mentioning that the Arctic is a major source of coolant for the earth.....hmmm re the I always wanted to raise horses on our farm

Lord help us all if it continues.

[jasons2k]

Interesting article about a supposed halt in warming due to decreased solar activity and other factors:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... again.html

[Sanibel]

Sun Cycle and Global Warming:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Sf_UIQYc20


.