Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? (Is invest 90L)

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DanieleItalyRm
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Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? (Is invest 90L)

#1 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:51 pm

Extratropical low over Canaries Islands, was isolated and acquired tropical characteristics and warm air in the center by nortwest Africa..

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Last edited by cycloneye on Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Locked thread as is invest 90L
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#2 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:02 pm

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#3 Postby Hurricane Jed » Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:16 pm

Is it for certain this is subtropical? Could this become Arlene?
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#4 Postby HURAKAN » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:09 pm

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Another interesting system in the NE Atlantic
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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#5 Postby cycloneye » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:51 pm

Sandy,I say very interesting.

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#6 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:32 pm

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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#7 Postby Florida1118 » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:44 pm

Is there a met that could clear this up? We need your help as always :P
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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#8 Postby cycloneye » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:55 pm

A much closer view.

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#9 Postby HURAKAN » Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:44 pm

It may look like a subtropical system, but I would think that given the location, time of the year, coverage of the convection and time it has lasted, it's far from tropical. I had a conversation with a hurricane expert, I reserve to say the name for obvious reasons, and that person expressed how difficult it was sometimes to distinguish between a non-tropical cyclone and a subtropical cyclone in these cases. Some of these systems have characteristics that make them look like a tropical or subtropical cyclone, including tight cores in strong ones, but they're still non-tropical cyclones.

If I had to bet with this system, I would bet it's still non-tropical. Satellite images can be very misleading sometimes.
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Re:

#10 Postby Hurricane Jed » Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:53 pm

HURAKAN wrote:It may look like a subtropical system, but I would think that given the location, time of the year, coverage of the convection and time it has lasted, it's far from tropical. I had a conversation with a hurricane expert, I reserve to say the name for obvious reasons, and that person expressed how difficult it was sometimes to distinguish between a non-tropical cyclone and a subtropical cyclone in these cases. Some of these systems have characteristics that make them look like a tropical or subtropical cyclone, including tight cores in strong ones, but they're still non-tropical cyclones.

If I had to bet with this system, I would bet it's still non-tropical. Satellite images can be very misleading sometimes.


Kinda like the medicanes that form in the Mediterranean or polar lows?
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Re: Re:

#11 Postby HURAKAN » Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:55 pm

Hurricane Jed wrote:Kinda like the medicanes that form in the Mediterranean or polar lows?


Polar lows are non-tropical, no question about that, but yes, they usually have a tight core and can have the appearance of tropical cyclones. I think some of the Medicanes may have been tropical or subtropical. I would love to see someone fund some research on the Medicanes.
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#12 Postby HURAKAN » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:18 pm

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Re: Re:

#13 Postby Hurricane Jed » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:37 pm

HURAKAN wrote:
Hurricane Jed wrote:Kinda like the medicanes that form in the Mediterranean or polar lows?


Polar lows are non-tropical, no question about that, but yes, they usually have a tight core and can have the appearance of tropical cyclones. I think some of the Medicanes may have been tropical or subtropical. I would love to see someone fund some research on the Medicanes.


As would I. This is a supposed tropical cyclone that formed in the Mediterranean in January of 1995. It intrigues me to no end.



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#14 Postby HURAKAN » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:34 pm

Air temp:

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Water temp:

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Dew point:

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Based on these observations, it's non-tropical.
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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#15 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:02 am

I think, if this system moved front coast of south Carolina, would be called subtropical system.

You remember unnamed January 2010?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYjzOawj ... r_embedded

or Invest92 Jun 2009?
http://forum.meteonetwork.it/meteorolog ... zorre.html
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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#16 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:14 am

I think it will dissipate in the next hours..

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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#17 Postby HURAKAN » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:28 am

DanieleItalyRm wrote:I think, if this system moved front coast of south Carolina, would be called subtropical system.

You remember unnamed January 2010?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYjzOawj ... r_embedded

or Invest92 Jun 2009?
http://forum.meteonetwork.it/meteorolog ... zorre.html


Satellite images are just one tool to help determine if the system is tropical or not. But it's very imperative to look at the sea-surface temperatures, environmental temperatures, dew points, etc, to determine if the core is tropical or not. It's possible that a system like that could become tropical or subtropical near the South Carolina coast thanks to the Gulf Stream, but the Canary Current is the complete opposite, which doesn't help in cyclogenesis.
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#18 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:15 pm

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Re: Subtropical storm over Canary Islands ? §

#19 Postby tolakram » Thu Mar 10, 2011 7:50 am

Cool looking storm, but I don't think it has very many, if any, tropical characteristics.

Looking at the MIMIC-TPW loop you can see that very little low level moisture is associated with this storm.

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This tells me that there just isn't anything "tropical" about it.
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#20 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:28 am

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