MED: (Sub)Tropical Cyclone over the Mediterranean Sea

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MED: (Sub)Tropical Cyclone over the Mediterranean Sea

#1 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:07 am

The second INVEST of this summer over the Mediterranean sea moved to east. probably it dissipate in the next 24h. Sea surface +26°C.

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#2 Postby Nightwatch » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:40 am

Where can i Follow tropical weather in the Mediterranean?
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Re:

#3 Postby RL3AO » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:52 am

Nightwatch wrote:Where can i Follow tropical weather in the Mediterranean?


You're probably on it right now. :lol:
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#4 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:53 am

you will not be able to follow tropical weather in the Mediterranean, does not exist a chase..
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#5 Postby KWT » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:59 am

These systems often seem to form in the same sorta way as the N.Atlantic systems you get sometimes in the autumn, colder air aloft which helps to increase the lapse rates enough to allow a warm cored system to form.

some people will say they are polar lows, and indeed some may well be, but some are IMO way too well defined to be anything other then real Tropical Cyclones.
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Re:

#6 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:15 am

KWT wrote:These systems often seem to form in the same sorta way as the N.Atlantic systems you get sometimes in the autumn, colder air aloft which helps to increase the lapse rates enough to allow a warm cored system to form.

some people will say they are polar lows, and indeed some may well be, but some are IMO way too well defined to be anything other then real Tropical Cyclones.


Right! polar low? ignorance.. many of these systems are the same as Vince, Grace or Karl, same formation, same latitude, same time of year.. are the same thing.
But in this case only a INVEST for me..
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#7 Postby Chacor » Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:58 am

It's not an "INVEST" since there is no agency officially putting out an ATCF file on it. More of an "area of interest". Would prefer if we did not (mis)use the term "INVEST" in this case.
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#8 Postby SEASON_CANCELED » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:03 am

Hurricanes have happened in the med. before. It is extremely rare but they do happen.

Like Brazil gets them every one inawhile.
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Re: Mediterranean: second Invest

#9 Postby Category 5 » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:10 am

Who tagged this an invest if I may ask? Last I checked no agency tags invests in this region.
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#10 Postby CrazyC83 » Tue Aug 30, 2011 7:23 pm

What would they call it if officially declared one, 90M?
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#11 Postby Cryomaniac » Tue Aug 30, 2011 7:30 pm

CrazyC83 wrote:What would they call it if officially declared one, 90M?


Who knows, they seem to have settled on Q for the S.Atlantic.
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#12 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Aug 30, 2011 7:50 pm

Im Sorry I thought invest it was a simply: "The designation of a system as an invest does not correspond to any particular likelihood of development of the system into a tropical cyclone;"
But if a hurricane is formed we must say that it is not if it is not followed by the NHC, CPHC, or JTWC? This is wrong we have eyes to see.. They will never follow the mediterranean systems.
Distrurbance is more correct? "A discrete tropical weather system of apparently organized convection -- generally 100 to 300 nmi in diameter -- originating in the tropics or subtropics, having a nonfrontal migratory character, and maintaining its identity for 24 hours or more."
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Re: Mediterranean: second Invest

#13 Postby Category 5 » Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:29 pm

Yeah Invest is an official term so we can't use that here.

Met systems are interesting, would love to see research done on them.
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#14 Postby KWT » Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:27 am

I'm sure if one really developed and smahsed into somewhere like Rome and caused alot of damage it'd get alot of attention, then that maybe whats needed to get things going, abit like Catrina in the S.Atlantic.
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#15 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:18 am

KWT wrote:I'm sure if one really developed and smahsed into somewhere like Rome and caused alot of damage it'd get alot of attention, then that maybe whats needed to get things going, abit like Catrina in the S.Atlantic.


in October 1996 this cyclone (call in italy mediterranean hurricane CORNELIA) produced floods, damages and 3 deads.. the wind exceded 140 km/h over Eolian islands:

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In this summer, Another interesting disturbance (or like TD) occured over the central Adriatic Sea on 5 July (26°C sea surface); it's derived from a convectiv vortex over central italy:
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And on 30 July over 25°C sea surface; it's derived from a well organizated convectiv complex over Balearic sea :

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In August a probably TC occured over Black sea over 25°C sea surface:
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#16 Postby Chacor » Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:24 am

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/PS/TROP/tdpositions.html
http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/PS/TROP/2011/bu ... chive.html

SAB's Dvorak fix page now has a section for Mediterranean systems, which is a step forward. This came into effect yesterday:
http://www.weather.gov/dm-cgi-bin/chgsh ... -11.06.txt
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#17 Postby KWT » Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:39 am

Well thats interesting, perhaps this is the first step of the global agencies in taking seriously the potenial of the Med to produce at least TS/STS systems, if not the odd hurricane now and then.
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#18 Postby DanieleItalyRm » Tue Sep 13, 2011 12:33 pm

Im very happy !! ;-)

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Last edited by DanieleItalyRm on Tue Sep 13, 2011 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#19 Postby AJC3 » Tue Sep 13, 2011 12:40 pm

DanieleItalyRm wrote:Im very happy ;-)


This is good! Please continue your excellent job of keeping the board informed about Mediterranean cyclones.

Ciao dagli Stati Uniti! :-)
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Re: Mediterranean: Second "medcane"

#20 Postby apocalypt-flyer » Tue Sep 13, 2011 4:47 pm

It's funny, a friend of mine is doing a seminar talk on exactly the 'Tropical Systems in the Mediterranean Sea? Yes/No' issue in a couple of weeks. Gonna be interesting to see which papers she's going to refer to.
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