Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

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Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#1 Postby EquusStorm » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:03 am

WARNING: EXTREMELY LONG POST BECAUSE I HAVE NO LIFE

The discussion about Camille's intensity based on tree damage renewed my curiosity and prompted a long web search for tree damage comparisons in intense worldwide landfalling systems, spending the afternoon focused on that hurricane then branching off to dozens of others. Found some interesting photos to compare, and it only further strengthens my beliefs that despite major variation in species, the overall level of tree damage can be used to roughly separate intense storms from truly violent storms. Though very far from perfect, it's interesting for sure. Because hurricanes are much easier to estimate and measure by satellite, observations, and reconnaissance, tree damage isn't that useful to determine intensity, but could be perhaps used to discern between, say, areas of 140mph wind and areas of 180mph wind in an observation-poor area.

There are two consistent signs of increasingly severe intensity: debarking and complete stripping of foliage. The escalation is very similar to what we see from intense tornadoes. Defoliation can begin at very low intensity, but a complete defoliation and stripping of bark by debris and wind seems to be characteristic of extremely strong hurricanes. Uprooting of trees isn't difficult; even a moderate wind can push over trees in shallow soil given time. A long duration of winds that increase fairly slowly can uproot many trees, as the persistent wind eventually works the root ball out of the soil; this can be seen in many videos of hurricane winds, with trees leaning more and more before being uprooted. Trees can certainly snap in lower intensity, especially those with rot or weak wood (in the US, I see a lot of pines, maples, and old decaying oaks snap off) but a widespread snapping of a significant percentage of trunks seems to require either significantly higher winds, or a rapid and sharp increase in velocity. The species in question is a major determining factor as well. Notably from satellite and aerial views, massive swaths of forest denuded of foliage and much bark, giving a distinct dull brown and grey appearance, is a feature that certainly is a hallmark of a truly violent storm, as Irma and Maria starkly reminded us last year.

Those aren't solid rules, subject to species, gusts, duration, soil condition, and topography, but seem to work a lot of the time; am certainly open to debate on it as it's a subject I find fascinating. With that said, individual examples of intense landfalling storms to test these and compare. Am largely limiting to storms that have struck forested regions and ones of which decent resolution photos were avaliable. Mostly Atlantic focused, but please feel free to add others where relevant in any basin!

Please let me know if I need to remove any links if I am not allowed to use said links.

1935 LABOR DAY HURRICANE, FLORIDA KEYS - The Florida Keys were certainly not a forested landscape in 1935, but I'm including it here anyway just due to sheer absurd intensity - without a question whatsoever the most intense US hit in recorded history. Palm trees are extremely resilient to damage, but as can be seen in one of the few photos showing lower level vegetation, defoliation and the stark white of snapped shrub stems can be faintly discerned in the background. This could certainly be surge damage, but we know that surface winds in this hurricane were absolutely tremendous.

HURRICANE JANET 1955, NORTH BELIZE/QUINTANA ROO - Janet is seemingly forgotten today, but at the time was one of the strongest on record in the basin AND one of the strongest landfalls at an estimated 175mph. The few damage photos avaliable at the landfall location suggest extreme intensity, with massive structural damage and virtually no standing trees. Given that many trees here would be resilient palms, I have no doubt that Janet was, as indicated by official landfall intensity, one of the most violent in the basin.

HURRICANE FLORA 1963, HAITI - It is understandably not super easy to find photographs from Haiti in past decades, but this photo seems to confirm that this extraordinarily deadly storm was also very intense at initial landfall. Estimated sustained winds were 145mph; tree damage is extensive, with apparent debarking and severe defoliation of the tropical hardwoods seen in the photo, but with few decent sized twigs or branches stripped. For the most intense storms, you'll see all but the largest branches stripped off. Nevertheless, winds here were extremely destructive and perhaps even slightly underestimated.

HURRICANE CAMILLE 1969, MISSISSIPPI - One of the most intense US hits by pressure, and along with the Galveston hurricane and the Labor Day hurricane the most destructive storm surge until Katrina, Camille was a historic and devastating storm. But based on available photos of even the heart of the landfall location, tree damage was surprisingly minor, casting doubt on the 175mph+ winds supposedly accompanying the extremely low pressure. The Mississippi coast is characterized by live oaks and longleaf/slash pines. In extremely intense storms, live oaks tend to be defoliated and partly surge-debarked (but almost never uprooted) and pines with a majority of standing trunks snapped and shredded into a jumbled mess of logs (a la Hugo and Frederic) But unless the worst of the tree damage was not photographed, tree damage was curiously light after Camille. Even in areas with the most extreme surge pines seemed to stand without even so much as broken branches even right along the coast where surface winds would have been highest. This can be noted in a number of photographs. Even structural damage seemed light away from the surge zone. Live oaks were damaged, but few were stripped of all small branches which can again be seen even in the heart of the worst surge where wind should be highest (note gas station canopy nearly intact, which are usually obliterated past 150mph, as seen in Charlie and various tornadoes) Indeed, even at the surge-obliterated Richelieu Apartments, site of the urban legend of the 'hurricane party', green healthy undamaged live oaks lined the slab. I saw far worse live oak damage after the much weaker Katrina, in the same areas. To be fair, some photos show rather more significant defoliation and branch snapping of hardwoods and others show pines that have certainly snapped but this was clearly very concentrated and the vegetation damage is vastly less severe than was observed in Andrew, an area with a number of species in common (live oak and slash pine, mainly) with which an accurate comparison can be made. Perhaps category five winds did occur, but they would have had to have been extremely limited in scope and not represented by any photographs I can find online. Surge, though, caused cataclysmic structural damage on the Mississippi coast despite the odd lack of severe wind damage. Due to its pressure at landfall and measured winds well offshore it's undoubtedly the most impressive northern Gulf hurricane to strike on record, vying with only Katrina.

HURRICANE DAVID 1979, DOMINICA - Violent and deadly Hurricane David struck the Dominican Republic as a high end category five storm, a landfall from which I can't find online photos, but a few days prior it also made a historic and devastating high end category four hit to Dominica; their worst disaster until Erika and Maria. Wide swaths of snapped and shredded trees were evident were evident on the mountainous island, to go with extensive structural damage. A color photo shows just how devastating the forest damage was; the overall ratio of downed trees makes me suspect winds may have even been higher than estimated especially in geographically enhanced locations. Some of the more impressive Caribbean tree damage before 2017.

HURRICANE FREDERIC 1979, ALABAMA - Frederic was not an especially high end hurricane at landfall, but serves as a good comparison standard for Gulf Coast hits. Bellingrath Gardens in Mobile kept a record of the extensive damage to its tree canopy; live oaks here had branch damage and no doubt were trimmed back; the photos seem to be after the new recovery flush of foliage has sprouted from the trunk and remaining branches. A significant percentage of trees in any group being snapped or uprooted suggests a rather strong storm in this region; a gust to 145 mph was recorded on the Dauphin Island bridge, which seems to go well with observed very significant softwood tree damage. In fact longleaf pine damage just east of the eyewall, in Mobile County, seems as significant as if not more so than the tree damage caused by supposedly much more intense Camille a decade earlier in the exact same forest type; tree damage is thus not infallible, assuming the official records are perfectly correct.

HURRICANE GILBERT 1988, QUINTANA ROO - Gilbert and Camille are estimated to be tied for second most intense landfall in the Atlantic (900mb, after the 892mb of the 1935 Labor Day storm) but unlike Camille, the aftermath of Gilbert is poorly documented, at least online these days. This site has some of the only damage photos I've found and it's definitely harder to tell tree damage in these photos despite the supposed violent intensity of landfall. I note defoliated tropical hardwoods, which seems to be an indicator of at least fairly strong intensity but nothing groundbreaking, and defoliated palms, which is much more significant. I would love to see some more photos from Gilbert.

HURRICANE HUGO 1989, PUERTO RICO/SOUTH CAROLINA - Hugo is rightfully well-known for its devastation throughout South Carolina, but remember that it also had very severe impacts in Puerto Rico beforehand. A USGS page shows the devastation at Luquillo Experimental Forest there; violent northerly winds, sustained up to 120mph with much higher gusts, shredded, debarked, and debranched wide swaths of trees on exposed slopes. I suspect extreme gusts and perhaps mesovortices in some of these areas, as the tree damage is very high end and it would not be shocking if gusts reached into the category five range on some of these slopes. Caribbean National Forest suffered very severe damage as well with some estimates that up to a third of trees were lost there. Damage in the Virgin Islands was very severe as well; tree damage is a bit hard to tell, but some resemblance to the vegetation damage from Irma/Maria is evident as it seems clear that most mature trees were knocked over or largely defoliated. Clearly a devastating Caribbean hit, but damage in South Carolina was extensive as well ; comparisons can be made to the Gulf storms with the large percentage of pines lining the coast; a large percentage of pines snapped off with few standing in the hardest hit areas, seems to be a good indicator of a low end category four; Hugo's sustained winds of 135mph causing this level of softwood damage lines up very well with the corresponding EF scale range for such, interestingly. Given what we see in tornadoes and other hurricane landfalls, approaching 140-150mph would snap off nearly every softwood; 110-120mph would leave a large percentage standing.

HURRICANE ANDREW 1992, SOUTH FLORIDA - Andrew clearly caused the most intense vegetation damage in the mainland United States in the era of color photography. Its damage to both softwoods and hardwoods outside of the Florida Keys, Puerto Rico, and perhaps Guam is unprecedented. Most photos focused on the extreme widespread structural devastation by winds gusting in excess of 170mph but even in that photo, vegetation damage is evident; many trees are standing, but they are completely defoliated and some seem to be partly debarked, indicated by much lighter colors instead of normally darker bark. This complete defoliation is evidence of the extreme winds in Andrew. Other photos make the debarking much clearer; the stark whitish appearance of the remaining outer branches is something almost never seen in the US outside of tornadoes. Even the normally very hurricane tolerant mangrove forests in this very tropically vegetated tip of the US were absolutely devastated and denuded clearly showing the violence of the winds. All forest types in this ecologically unique area suffered very high end damage. This was true even in urban areas. Tree damage and home damage line up differently with hurricanes than with tornadoes due to the lack of general vertical winds in hurricanes (outside of mesovortices) which would explain how structures can survive next to obliterated trees, as a lot of tornadic structural damage is debatably due to their vertical accelerations. Regardless, Andrew's damage is extremely high end.

HURRICANE INIKI 1992, KAUAI, HI - The US was devastated once more shortly after Andrew as powerful Hurricane Iniki struck Hawaii shortly thereafter. Making landfall in Kauai with winds of 145mph, it is the strongest hurricane on record to have ever hit Hawaii. Its winds line up well with the damage caused; large trees that still stood were shorn of foliage and most branches, and in other areas, there was significant debarking of tropical hardwoods. All over the island tree damage was very severe and forest canopies were torn apart. Given the intensities of other storms to strike Hawaii, it's amazing how intense a strike Iniki was. Nothing else comes quite close.

HURRICANE LUIS 1995, ST MAARTEN/ETC - Considering how destructive Luis's hit was on St Maarten and surrounding islands, it's interesting that there are not that many online resources showing the tree damage caused. This page shows the extreme structural damage and low-resolution tree damage in the backgrounds; the color of the hillside and the shape of the standing trees visible there and on this page makes it clear though that the wind damage was very high end. Significant defoliation is evident. Even very strong coconut palms had their crowns ripped out; this is rather hard to achieve. Sustained winds peaked at 150mph with higher gusts; that is certainly evident with the level of tree damage.

CYCLONE ZOE, 2002, TIKOPIA ISLAND Going to the Southern Hemisphere now, Cyclone Zoe caused shockingly violent vegetation damage on small Tikopia Island. Zoe was for a time the most intense known Southern Hemisphere tropical cyclone, with a pressure of 890mb and one-minute sustained winds of 180mph. Near peak intensity, it stalled just offshore the island, nearly sweeping it clean of vegetation with wind gusts likely over 200mph and near 40 foot waves. The degree of coastal vegetation damage on Tikopia Island is, along with Winston, perhaps among the worst EVER recorded and photographed as a result of a tropical cyclone, being more reminiscent of an EF4
tornado - indeed, the winds certainly gusted near or in that range for a rather long period of time. The entire island was shorn of living foliage and nearly every tree left standing was utterly debarked but remarkably no one on the island died. This is certainly a textbook example of the level of vegetation damage that a higher end category five equivalent storm can bring.

HURRICANE CHARLEY 2004, FLORIDA - Fast-moving, rapid-strengthening, sneak-attack Charley is an very rare example of a storm whose main impact is wind instead of water; it joins Andrew in that category. Charley caused very severe tree and structural damage all the way across peninsular Florida, and tree damage certainly supports its 150mph landfall wind estimate; on the short list of the stronger landfalls on US record, no doubt. Rapidly intensifying storms tend to cause more inland wind damage than those that are weakening, as seen by both Andrew and Charley; this sort of tree and sign damage was no doubt widespread. In waterfront areas especially, a large percentage of trees were defoliated or snapped in a ratio significantly higher than most weaker storms. The fast moving small storm's rapid wind acceleration littered the ground with shredded branches and destroyed tree canopies to the level that only a higher end storm is able to. In the core of its path the majority of trees were snapped off and defoliated, with some evidence of debarking and its tree damage in Florida is perhaps only rivaled by Andrew. More photos exist of its structural damage than tree damage, but those looking at Charley damage photos will easily be able to tell just how severe the tree damage was as well. It seems almost forgotten now after the other devastating hurricanes of 04 and 05, but Charley's damage was frighteningly high end. and certainly indicative of a much higher wind speed than the US usual of low to mid category three impact.

HURRICANE IVAN 2004, GRENADA - Ivan devastated the Alabama coast and western Florida panhandle with high seas and surge, but most of its wind damage in the US wasn't especially high end, with stands of pines damaged mostly by salt intrusion rather than the wind, which seemed to remain below the threshold for widespread snapping at least from what I observed on the Alabama coast. Wind damage seemed to be concentrated into its first landfall, on the island of Grenada, when it was a much higher end category three. Here, the telltale browns and greys of widespread major defoliation and light debarking indicate winds could easily have gusted into the category four range; though it seems that tropical forests might be a bit easier to defoliate at slightly lower speeds, Ivan devastated the island.

HURRICANE EMILY 2005, QUINTANA ROO - It's a bit hard to find info on Emily given all else that happened in 2005, but the few photos I can find suggest some defoliation at least.

HURRICANE KATRINA 2005, MISSISSIPPI - Even though Katrina is estimated to have weakened to a category three by its Mississippi landfall, it caused a lot of category four-esque severe tree damage right on the coast, in fact far more impressive tree damage than Camille; however, most of it was due to the immense storm surge, which debarked a lot of trees, snapped some due to sheer water pressure and debris load from flaoting disintegrating house chunks, and defoliated a lot of trees in the following days due to massive saltwater intrusion. No doubt it was very impressive though - most trees adjacent to the coast were defoliated and some were snapped and while a lot of it was due to water, there is no doubt very high gusts int he category four range probably occurred. The degree of live oak defoliation is extremely impressive but I am not sure how much was due to wind and how much was due to surge; most of these short but wide spreading trees were largely underwater during the height of the surge, which surely didn't help matters. The surge damage combined with the high wind was immense but it's worth noting that even in areas with near total structural devastation, many pine trees do remain standing despite others haing snapped off. This adds credence to the theory that surge and salt damage caused more tree damage than wind, though gusts certainly did cause severe damage. But in areas even closer to the eyewall with different surge configurations, even areas of pines largely stood with little damage. These much younger trees are very flexible, yes, but it's an interesting comparison; like Camille, Katrina's legacy was surge.

HURRICANE DEAN 2007, QUINTANA ROO - Upon my visit to ground zero a decade after Dean's landfall, it's clear that the forests around the cruise port of Costa Maya are rather young. That's largely because Dean flattened nearly everything but the coconut palms. This road, seen here after Dean, was revegetated quite nicely by last year (I need to find my photos) but it's quite clear by the complete defoliation that winds were intense. The landfall intensity of 175mph did quite a good deal of shredding and debarking the vegetation in this area, an otherwise sparsely populated coastline of native fishing villages. The palms made it out alright but hardwoods were devastated in one of the most intense Atlantic landfalls on record. A thread here shows a couple photos of the aftermath at the largely destroyed cruise port before they rebuilt the entire thing. Look at the vegetation in the wilderness behind the port - a whole sea of brown, where the entire forest was swept clean of vegetation. This is pretty consistent with other 175mph landfalls in the basin; ecologically devastating for a while.

HURRICANE FELIX 2007, NICARAGUA - Somewhat forgotten in the aftermath of Dean, the second category five Caribbean landfall in just a manner of weeks was nonetheless extremely destructive. Available photos show structural and severe tree damage, but I am not sure how far from the core of category 5 winds they were taken. Damage was near complete in some areas, and the ecological damage was very serious as whole forests were moved down. Near 100% loss of standing timber is a good hallmark for storms of this intensity; Felix coming in with 175mph winds.

HURRICANE GUSTAV 2008, PINAR DEL RIO, CUBA - Gustav has severe impact on the US Gulf Coast, but perhaps fewer remember just how intense it was when it crossed Cuba. With actually measured sustained winds just under 155mph, and an almost unprecedented 211mph gust at a height of 33ft, one could consider this officially category four storm as a category five landfall in Cuba. It was extremely strong. The damage at Pinar del Rio made a strong case for the validity of Gustav's frightening intensity; this stock photo is supposedly from near Gustav's area of peak intensity in Cuba, taken months after the storm. If legitimate, the level of vegetation damage and debarking is incredible. Legitimate or not, though, Gustav is known to have caused major tree and crop damage, but few photos are available for it OR Paloma in November, which also caused significant damage. More likely legitimate Gustav photos show extensive defoliation.

SUPERTYPHOON HAIYAN 2013, PHILIPPINES - Haiyan's November 2013 Philippine strike is widely regarded as the strongest modern landfall on record in world history by wind speed and I would be inclined to agree. Haiyan's structure was absolutely breathtaking even for being in the world's most prolific high end cyclone making basin. Gusts almost certainly reached 200mph; given the massive jumble of debris that was once a town, it's hard to disagree. Tall skinny resilient palms survived pretty well but practically every other tree was shredded, defoliated and debarked, very indicative of extremely high winds. [url=default/files/styles/inline_all/public/aerial_Binuluanguan_Haiyan_610.jpg]The stark light colors of debarked stems[/url] were prevalent all over the landfall region. This sort of high end tree damage corresponds fairly well to violent tornado wind speeds in the level of debarking. All evidence seems to confirm the storm's extreme landfall intensity.

CYCLONE PAM, 2015, VANUATU Cyclone Pam, one of the most intense South Pacific cyclones on record, passed through Vanuatu at its peak, with one-minute sustained winds of 175mph. Damage on many of the islands was very severe. Photos indicate destroyed coconut palms, a difficult feat suggesting extreme intensity, and the telltale grey scar of denuded hillsides full of shredded stripped trunks, yet another hallmark of very severe intensity.

HURRICANE JOAQUIN 2015, BAHAMAS - Joaquin is another storm seemingly lost in the fray, except during the brief time it threatened the US and when its sinking of the El Faro came to light. But Joaquin, the strongest baroclinically initiated hurricane on record, was a very impressive and very destructive storm in the Bahamas. Near complete defoliation and a large percentage of downed trees was a common scene on Crooked Island, very evident of long duration category four winds. Remember that there are very few deciduous trees in the tropics.

HURRICANE PATRICIA 2015, MEXICO - The most intense Western Hemisphere hurricane on record, of almost unfathomable intensity over open water, Patricia shocked us all in its incredible explosive intensification to well into EF5 tornado territory. Patricia managed to weaken 65mph and STILL made landfall as a high end category four, the most intense on East Pacific record with winds estimated at 150mph. The tiny area of peak winds missed most populated areas, but caused extreme damage in its narrow swath. The telltale hillsides of denuded stripped leaning trees ubiquitous to at least high end category four landfalls was present. Tree and structural damage certainly verified. On the coast, tree damage reached its peak, with scarcely a single tree containing leaves or bark besides the palms. Very, very intense.

CYCLONE WINSTON, 2016, FIJI Extraordinarily violent Winston is the strongest and most intense known modern Southern Hemisphere storm, and one of the most intense landfalls ever in the entire world. With an estimated pressure of 884mb and sustained winds near 180mph, it is only surpassed by a few. Understandably, damage was tremendous. The defoliation and debarking of wide swaths of trees makes the storm's extreme intensity very clear. In the areas under the eyewall, near complete debarking and shredding of standing trees and the stripping of most branches easily equates the damage to what one would see in a high end EF4 tornado, or even greater; no doubt wind gusts were easily in this range.

CYCLONE FANTALA 2016, SEYCHELLES Continuing the trend of highly destructive Southern Hemisphere storms in recent years, Fantala holds the record for highest sustained winds in the SW Indian Basin (180mph) and passed near some of the Seychelles islands near peak. Gusts probably neared 200mph on some of the closest islands; the twisting and snapping of swaths of palms is extremely impressive, something rarely seen. Other trees were defoliated and shorn of many branches, and other areas of forest were reduced to mostly branchless, partially debarked, denuded snags- which as we've seen is characteristic of EF4-5 tornadoes AND category five hurricanes and their equivalents.

HURRICANE MATTHEW 2016, HAITI - It's easy to forget since Matthew caused major damage in the southeastern US, but Matthew had a very deadly and destructive impact on Haiti beforehand. Matthew struck the island with sustained winds of 150mph; that winds were easily this high is quite evident by snapped and largely defoliated coconut palms on the coast - which honestly takes a LOT of wind. Even a bit inland, defoliation and near complete hardwood branch loss makes it clear that sustained winds and gusts were certainly high end with this hurricane in Haiti.

HURRICANE HARVEY 2017, TEXAS - In the midst of the flooding, Harvey's brief wind damage a few days prior fell by the wayside. But tree damage was not especially high end from what I've seen; defoliation of live oaks by wind is definitely indicative of at least a high category three, and clearly there was significant branch and canopy loss but the damage doesn't seem to be especially high end - and that lines up well with landfall winds being on the low end of category four.

HURRICANE IRMA 2017, MANY LOCALES - Irma is where vegetation damage from intense hurricanes really came to the forefront, with shots of brown completely denuded hillsides displaying some of the most violent tropical cyclone tree damage ever caught on camera, at least in the Northern Hemisphere. In fact the sheer 100% defoliation, debarking, and shredding of virtually every piece of vegetation is a real candidate for the most utterly complete vegetation destruction from any tropical cyclone on modern record; with reconnaissance-confirmed sustained winds of 180mph making direct hits on these islands, it's not surprising, as Irma is by far the strongest storm recorded to have ever hit this area. Tree loss was nearly complete even in built-up areas. And even coastal palms were denuded and barely recognizable; dense forests were so thoroughly debarked and all trace of greenery removed that they seemed more akin to wildfire burned areas than hurricane-ravaged locales. The tree loss in ares where the storm made landfall at peak are probably as absolutely total as it is possible to be in a tropical cyclone and very much akin to EF5 tornado tree damage. Look it up; it's uncanny. Even in the Florida Keys, when the storm had lost much of its punch and was down to a low end category four, tree loss was significant with severe defoliation and snapping or debarking of many trees. Irm's tree damage is virtually unprecedented.

HURRICANE MARIA 2017, DOMINICA/PUERTO RICO - And yet a couple weeks later, here we were again. Despite the immense devastation of Maria's category five landfall on Dominica, and category five level tree damage, a photo comparison shows that there IS a slight difference from Irma's, and that the higher sustained winds in Irma caused a slightly higher level of tree damage than in Maria. Trees in Dominica were shredded and debarked, but with many more trunks standing, naked as they are. Tree damage is immense and clearly category four to five level but there's a bit of green left near ground level vegetation; more than can be said for Irma's victims. Large swaths of trees were still denuded and shorn of much bark and many of their branches, though. Lush forests were reduced to wasteland, shredded and debarked ruin; but still, more trunks remained standing even though the damage only looks slightly less total because of comparing it to recent Irma. In Puerto Rico, once the storm weakened slightly to a high end category four, tree damage in may areas seemed to follow suit; here, trees are partially debarked and tangled all over the ground, but you can see some trees and a lot of ground level vegetation that is still quite green. With Irma at peak, nothing green remained, and very few tree snags stood.

So there we have it. We can see it's far from perfect as there are storms that seem to have caused a bit more tree damage than the winds suggested (Hugo in Puerto Rico and Ivan in Grenada, for example) and others that based on the photos I could find caused less (Camille, Ivan's US landfall, some that I just didn't list altogether) but it's still interesting. For example, to see in photos that 175mph winds will do pretty much the exact same level of defoliation and shredding in basically any forest of any sort around the globe, whether it be in the South Pacific, Caribbean, or Florida, and that it's pretty amazing seeing such destroyed forests near homes still mostly standing - so much difference in a hurricane versus tornado wind.

I could be wrong on a lot of things to please correct me. None of this of course is very professionally scientific but I figured putting photos next to the landfall winds and comparing would be a fun project, so there, I made a big dumb contribution. Have fun with it or mock it or delete it and send me angry emails, but now I'mma sleep
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#2 Postby Chris90 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:40 am

Thanks for posting, that was an interesting read, I like your analysis.
You mentioned in your Gilbert section you would love to see more photos. I don't have a photo, but I've got a link to video. The beginning of the video is from the eyewall in Playa del Carmen, and the end of the video is showing the damage afterwards. Its got some good shots of vegetation damage.
Link: https://youtu.be/GGSyAmkDmxI
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#3 Postby BatzVI » Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:44 am

Very good read...however, you might want to research Hurricane Marilyn 1995 in St. Thomas, Virgin Islands. Our island was devastated by that storm and tree damage actually looked about the same as after Irma last year. Took a very long time for the vegetation to recover.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#4 Postby EquusStorm » Thu Sep 13, 2018 7:20 pm

Very ironic you mention Marilyn; I actually was going to add Marilyn to go along with Luis because I came across a few photos that showed extreme tree damage perhaps just as bad Luis caused, but ultimately the post was so long and it was so late in the night I missed out on adding a few and Marilyn was one I put on the to-do-later short list; I'll go back and add her in when I get a chance as that damage clearly does belong. Marilyn, like Hugo, caused Caribbean tree damage that makes me think gusts may have been higher than officially measured when compared to known wind gusts and their associated damage to similar forest types.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#5 Postby SconnieCane » Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:27 am

2014's Hurricane Odile might be worth a look, as well. Strangely I'd never even heard of this storm until I was browsing iCyclone's website just now. It appears to have been an extremely rare major landfall on the Baja Peninsula, a direct hit on Cabo and been rather an Andrew/Charley-like wind machine (although not quite as intense as either, the wind damage to their hotel and adjacent buildings is very impressive).

It looks like he never got around to writing the "Hell Breaking Loose" section of the summary, but check out the video and PDF links to get an idea of what happened during the height of the storm.

http://www.icyclone.com/chases/odile-2014.html
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#6 Postby Ubuntwo » Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:00 pm

Very interesting article I read on the impact of Andrew on foliage in Elliott Key and more specifically Pseudophenix sargentii. This is a very rare palm, and within Florida its native population is limited to just Elliott key (the palm grows incredibly slowly, and as a result it is hard to cultivate so many were stolen). Elliott Key is the site of the first landfall of Andrew, and its 165 MPH sustained winds and surge devastated the population. Most of the older individuals were snapped and some of the younger ones were washed away or were killed by saltwater inundation. This brought the population down to only 28, and the rest of the article discusses the heavy reintroduction efforts.

http://www.palms.org/principes/1995/vol39n1p5-13.pdf
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#7 Postby 1900hurricane » Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:06 pm

How about tree damage in intense landfalling hurricanes of the present?

 https://twitter.com/EarthUncutTV/status/1041150314542358533


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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#8 Postby EquusStorm » Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:25 pm

Odile is a great candidate! I forgot how strong it was at landfall, will look up some photos. The palm document is fascinating, as a tree nerd as well that's absolutely the kind of thing I love to read, so thank you for that! I didn't realize that palm was as rare as it was.

Mangkhut... wow, yeah, that's definitely super high end and judging by its landfall presentation I was kinda afraid it was gonna do that. Unfortunately it definitely did. Another obvious add; will do some looking into it and add it this weekend!
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#9 Postby MGC » Mon Sep 17, 2018 3:25 pm

Good reading. Katrina defoliated all the deciduous trees near my home best that I can recall. The ones that were blown over kept some of their leaves as I recall. It didn't take very long for the trees to rebloom though, perhaps a couple of weeks. Most of the trees that were uprooted were oak. Live oaks all remained standing but lost some branches. There is a grove of pine behind me, some were blown over but none snapped. The younger pines did well, I guess they don't have a large area for winds to blow them over. Now over in Bay Saint Louis, where intense convection was located near Katrina's eye wall, I did observe large pines snapped several feet off the ground. No doubt winds were much stronger there than at my place in Pass Christian. Parts of my neighbor's roof did end up in my back yard. I think using trees is a good method to estimate wind intensity.....MGC
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#10 Postby PTPatrick » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:24 am

regarding Camille, Landsea wrote paper on just the question of what the real landfall strength was. Despite there not being a lot of great pics of defoliated trees and whatnot, it does indeed appear that it was likely around a 150 knts or 170 mph give or take. Unlike every other major to strike the Northern gulf coast in the recent record that weakened at landfall, Camille is believed to have strengthened some right before landfall.

I do believe the core of that wind was probably very limited to an area that was decimated by surge. Trees under 20-30 feet of water wont show much wind damage if they were not beat down by waves and surge. We know the effects accross the coast decreased quickly although Pascagoula recorded cat 1 wind with Camille and that likely ended around Mobile County somewhere.

https://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/full/1 ... 14-00137.1
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#11 Postby terstorm1012 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:02 pm

This is a really well done and well-researched post. Thank you.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#12 Postby EquusStorm » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:44 pm

Thanks for the detail and insight! I visited the MS coast about a year later and got about that same impression, it did seem quite impressive even after a year of tree recovery. Didn't get as far as Bay St Louis as the bridge was still out iirc and we didn't want to detour that far, but yeah, I suspect easy category four gusts there from all I've heard.

I won't argue with experts on Camille's intensity, as I have no legitimate claim to know any better than them, but I really do wish photo-documentation was better; that I haven't ever found any photos suggesting anything over 130-140mph doesn't mean the photos don't exist, or it could easily mean that the worst was simply not photographed. Documentation in the 60s is honestly pretty iffy even in the US. I would certainly believe that there was a super narrow corridor of extreme winds in the eastern eyewall, being an extremely tightly wound storm, but I have yet to find any photos from this area, which would have undoubtedly been hard to access from all the damage TO be able to take photos. Deep surge would probably indeed keep trees from snapping down low but 160mph+ winds easily shred and debark all of the above-water exposed portions of softwoods and this isn't evident in any available photos I've seen; I would LOVE to find some photos from where the eastern eyewall came ashore though! If anyone finds some PLEASE share them because I'd love to compare 160-175mph tree damage in Mississippi with similar winds in the deep tropics. All of the photos I have found are based on structural and tree damage seem to be in the 100-140mph zone probably east of the eyewall.

Thank you! I have a list of about a dozen more I'm going to try to add in this weekend. I would love to add more typhoons into the list but online pre-1990s documentation in most non-Atlantic basins is iffy.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#13 Postby PTPatrick » Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:48 pm

Quite honestly after watching so many weaken at landfall over the years it a question I had started to ask myself the same question.

We know from better instrumentation that there Are precious few storms where there is any wind actually measured on land that matches what is observed by recon and rigs over water. When they do it’s usually a storm that is in a deepening phase, such as storms passing over south florida or landing in south texas(Katrina in Miami , Andrew, charley ,etc.)

North moving majors into the northern gulf cost just usually do not mix down their worst wind onto land, period.

My conclusions after the landsea paper had come out was that Camille very likely arrived at the shore at the bottom end of a cat 5. The pressure was just too low to discount that possibility. But your obervstaions are accurate...the documented cat 5 wind damage has always been a little hard to find and certainly not fitting of the 190mph it was originally rated at. It’s more than likely that it started to weaken slightly again over the sound and the 160 mph was limited to water and sand bars and that she had trouble mixing that down to the surface by then. And even real cat 4 damage could have been limited to a small area at the beach in a narrow area leaving mostly cat 3 damage in a wider area. I think that based on stories and family recounting damage...I would guess much of Harrison county received cat 3 damage except the far west towns. My mother experienced Camile in West Ocean springs (probably cat 2) and said it was terrifying until she experienced Frederic’s eye wall at the state line, when she felt the house would come down.

I have no doubt that Camille’s overrating as a high cat 5 at landfall in the history books Killed many people in Mississippi in Katrina. But more than anything it is testament to the futility of the Saffir Simpson scale with what we know about storms now and how they behave.

I wish data was better, from Pass Christian at the time, but I guess it’s just something we may never know.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#14 Postby EquusStorm » Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:08 pm

Totally agreed. I bet if we had measurements just off the surface on the MS coast or just offshore we'd have seen terrifying speeds, just perhaps not translated as well to the actual land surface except as you said right on the coast in a tiny swath or on sandbars. Wind/pressure relationships aren't ideal at all times but I'd find it hard to believe one would get sub-910 out of anything but a category five of some degree in this basin. I would still say Camille probably could have easily led to category five winds right on the coast or just above the surface, but it'd not be on the super high end, as the former thoughts of sustained 190/gusts 220+ (despite the pressure not being far from what one would expect from that) doesn't match anything observed except the surge, which after Katrina we know doesn't take absurdly high sustained winds at landfall since that's a very surge prone coast and it built up with both storms' extreme offshore intensity. But I'm just speculating :D

Still probably Mississippi's most terrifying strike ever in the way of winds despite Katrina's surge being higher.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#15 Postby Shell Mound » Tue Sep 18, 2018 7:04 pm

Based on radar imagery, Camille struck Waveland, MS, with a concentric eyewall structure: an inner eye diameter of ~10 n m and an outer of ~30 n m.

Observations

Dennis Pass, Garden Island Bay, LA (Freeport Sulphur Company) – 941 mb/27.80" (corrected minimum pressure) coincident with "lull" of 25-30 knots (estimated winds) in moat ~9 n m W of inner eyewall
Saint Stanislaus (College), Bay St. Louis, MS – 945 mb/27.90" (estimated? minimum pressure) in eye, unknown calibration and instrument
Bay St. Louis, MS (Breath Lane, near intersection of US-90 and N Beach Road) – 909 mb/26.85" (corrected minimum pressure) by log and instrument, 904 mb/26.70" (estimated minimum pressure) in eye by recollection
Bay St. Louis, MS (not same location as the other readings) – 897 mb/27.50" (estimated? minimum pressure), presumably in eye
Pass Christian, MS – 919 mb/27.15" (corrected minimum pressure) in eastern inner eyewall
Gulfport, MS (SS Alamo Victory) – 969 mb/28.60" (corrected minimum pressure) in Gulfport Harbor, ~9 n mi E of Bay St. Louis
Biloxi, MS – 986 mb/29.12" (corrected minimum pressure) ~17 n mi E of Gulfport reading
~26 n m E of Waveland, MS – 29.28"/992 mb (corrected minimum reading)

Sources: A, B, C, D, E

Quotes

...near 1815 UTC 17 August, an Air Force dropsonde in the eye recorded a 901-mb pressure. ... A review of the sonde data (Fig. SB1) indicates that the 850-mb geopotential height was 692 m. This is inconsistent with a 901-mb surface pressure based on comparison to other aircraft data and dropsondes. ... Based upon the three methods, a central pressure of about 919 mb is estimated for 1800 UTC 17 August for Camille, with a derived intensity of 135 kt. AMS article (source A), pp. 374-5

Two pressures were measured at or near the time of eye passage in Bay St. Louis, 909 and 904 mb (26.85 and 26.70 inches), and a pressure in the eyewall was measured in Pass Christian, 919 mb (27.15 inches). The estimated distance between the 909 and 904 mb readings and the center of the eye is 3-4 nm; that is to say, it was on the eastern edge of the small eye (which had a 10 nm diameter, suggesting a radius of maximum winds of 6-8 nm). The estimated distance between the Pass Christian eyewall pressure reading and the center of the eye is 7 nm. – Source B


Based on the data, Camille does appear to have exhibited a steep pressure gradient at landfall, as the pressures, according to the sources, were mostly corrected readings. Over a distance of ~26 n m, pressures dropped roughly 88 mb—from 992 mb at the periphery to 904 mb in the eye. The 909-mb reading occurred inside the RMW but coincided with strong winds, as the observer left his house at this time, given that the roof blew away. Calmer conditions arrived shortly afterward, during which the observer measured 904 mb at a nearby, intact structure.
Last edited by Shell Mound on Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#16 Postby Chris90 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:48 pm

Since Katrina and Camille are being discussed I just want to share a link real quick. It is to a PDF file that discusses the intensity of wind gusts dependant upon having the right convective conduit. It looks at Katrina, Dennis, and Rita. It's a really quick read, only 4 pages, and I found it interesting, so maybe others will too.
https://ams.confex.com/ams/pdfpapers/108816.pdf
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#17 Postby PTPatrick » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:19 pm

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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#18 Postby PTPatrick » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:31 pm

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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#19 Postby Shell Mound » Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:23 pm

Shell Mound wrote:Based on radar imagery, Camille struck Waveland, MS, with a concentric eyewall structure: an inner eye diameter of ~10 n m and an outer of ~30 n m.

Observations

Dennis Pass, Garden Island Bay, LA (Freeport Sulphur Company) – 941 mb/27.80" (corrected minimum pressure) coincident with "lull" of 25-30 knots (estimated winds) in moat ~9 n m W of inner eyewall
Saint Stanislaus (College), Bay St. Louis, MS – 945 mb/27.90" (estimated? minimum pressure) in eye, unknown calibration and instrument
Bay St. Louis, MS (Breath Lane, near intersection of US-90 and N Beach Road) – 909 mb/26.85" (corrected minimum pressure) by log and instrument, 904 mb/26.70" (estimated minimum pressure) in eye by recollection
Bay St. Louis, MS (not same location as the other readings) – 897 mb/27.50" (estimated? minimum pressure), presumably in eye
Pass Christian, MS – 919 mb/27.15" (corrected minimum pressure) in eastern inner eyewall
Gulfport, MS (SS Alamo Victory) – 969 mb/28.60" (corrected minimum pressure) in Gulfport Harbor, ~9 n mi E of Bay St. Louis
Biloxi, MS – 986 mb/29.12" (corrected minimum pressure) ~17 n mi E of Gulfport reading
~26 n m E of Waveland, MS – 29.28"/992 mb (corrected minimum reading)

Sources: A, B, C, D, E

Quotes

...near 1815 UTC 17 August, an Air Force dropsonde in the eye recorded a 901-mb pressure. ... A review of the sonde data (Fig. SB1) indicates that the 850-mb geopotential height was 692 m. This is inconsistent with a 901-mb surface pressure based on comparison to other aircraft data and dropsondes. ... Based upon the three methods, a central pressure of about 919 mb is estimated for 1800 UTC 17 August for Camille, with a derived intensity of 135 kt. AMS article (source A), pp. 374-5

Two pressures were measured at or near the time of eye passage in Bay St. Louis, 909 and 904 mb (26.85 and 26.70 inches), and a pressure in the eyewall was measured in Pass Christian, 919 mb (27.15 inches). The estimated distance between the 909 and 904 mb readings and the center of the eye is 3-4 nm; that is to say, it was on the eastern edge of the small eye (which had a 10 nm diameter, suggesting a radius of maximum winds of 6-8 nm). The estimated distance between the Pass Christian eyewall pressure reading and the center of the eye is 7 nm. – Source B


Based on the data, Camille does appear to have exhibited a steep pressure gradient at landfall, as the pressures, according to the sources, were mostly corrected readings. Over a distance of ~26 n m, pressures dropped roughly 88 mb—from 992 mb at the periphery to 904 mb in the eye. The 909-mb reading occurred inside the RMW but coincided with strong winds, as the observer left his house at this time, given that the roof blew away. Calmer conditions arrived shortly afterward, during which the observer measured 904 mb at a nearby, intact structure.

Anyway, in light of this evidence, I think that Camille was probably a Cat-5 hurricane at landfall in MS, given a) the tight pressure gradient, b) reliable documentation of corrected pressure readings, c) the smaller-than-average inner RMW, d) forward speed vs. radius of outermost closed isobar (ROCI), and e) the likelihood that storm surge submerged most trees and structures in the path of the inner RMW. Note that the eastern eyewall of the inner RMW impacted Pass Christian, MS, which measured some of the highest peak surge values. Unsurprisingly, the area would have been underwater during the period of peak winds. In any case, those peak winds would have been confined to a small area along the immediate shoreline. Overall, Camille was likely 145 to 150 knots at landfall, in accordance with the reanalysis. The available imagery fails to show extreme wind damage, owing to the effects of surge.
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Re: Tree Damage in Intense Landfalling Hurricanes of the Past

#20 Postby EquusStorm » Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:49 pm

Oh man thanks for those Camille docs, I actually stayed up way later than I should have yesterday reading all of them in fascination. Would certainly make sense, I guess it's honestly hard to even compare it since it's pretty much unprecedented intensity-wise in the northern Gulf. Not that it's good at all for those in its path for Camille to happen in any era by ANY means, but this stuff would've been so much easier to pin down exactly had Camille happened very recently with more imagery, reports, measurements, etc, and a few instruments survived the intense conditions. I think we're at all we will ever honestly know about its landfall.

The Gulf gusts article is very interesting! It's very intriguing how much the winds vary vertically based on so many different factors, had never read that one so thanks for sharing!
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