Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
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Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
What storms that were replacement names were more destructive than the names that they replaced?
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Juan ‘03 —> Joaquin ‘15
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- Category5Kaiju
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Dean and Dorian
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
A less well-known one: Carol and Camille - or alternatively, Carla and Camille.
The name Carol was on the naming list during the very first hurricane season when human names were used - the 1953 season. Back then, the plan was that the same naming list would be used every single year, so Carol was used for two consecutive seasons, 1953 and 1954. Carol 1953 was a Cat 5 CV storm with minimal impacts, but Carol 1954 struck Long Island and New England as a Cat 3. After the 1954 season, Carol, Edna and Hazel were retired - the first three retired names in the Atlantic. (note 1)
The plan was to only retire hurricane names for 10 years, after which they would be eligible for use again. By the 1960s, four rotating naming lists were established. So after Carla was retired in 1961, Carol was again chosen to replace Carla in 1965 since it's now eligible for use. As you might have guessed, even though Carol 1965 was just an OTS storm, the use of Carol sparked public confusion and uproar from the research community who were still producing papers on Carol 1954.
In January 1969, the National Hurricane Research Laboratory asked the naming committee to permanently retire Carol, Edna and Hazel, which was approved. (note 2) So Carol was gone from the 1969 list, but they needed a new C name at the last minute. NHRL's Dr Miller suggested the name Camille, named after Camille Hope who, as you might have guessed, was the daughter of John Hope. At that time, Miller was supervising her for a high school research project. AFAIK, this is the only time that a storm name was chosen for an actual person.
We all know what happened after that. Ironically, the name Camille was retired after that one usage, and Camille was much stronger than Carol 1954, Carol 1965 and Carla 1961. (Even though Camille didn't directly replace Carla, in some sense Carla was the most recent retirement-worthy C storm on that naming list and part of the reason why Camille entered the list.)
Notes:
1) It was also decided after 1954 that different naming lists should be used every year (though the decision wasn't made soon enough to prevent the confusion of Alice June 1954 vs Alice December 1954, but that's a whole different story).
2) Despite the permanent retirement of Carol, Edna and Hazel, the name Edna somehow entered the 1972 naming list again (I can't find any sources on why that happened). Fortunately, it didn't matter since the 1972 season only used 4 names.
The name Carol was on the naming list during the very first hurricane season when human names were used - the 1953 season. Back then, the plan was that the same naming list would be used every single year, so Carol was used for two consecutive seasons, 1953 and 1954. Carol 1953 was a Cat 5 CV storm with minimal impacts, but Carol 1954 struck Long Island and New England as a Cat 3. After the 1954 season, Carol, Edna and Hazel were retired - the first three retired names in the Atlantic. (note 1)
The plan was to only retire hurricane names for 10 years, after which they would be eligible for use again. By the 1960s, four rotating naming lists were established. So after Carla was retired in 1961, Carol was again chosen to replace Carla in 1965 since it's now eligible for use. As you might have guessed, even though Carol 1965 was just an OTS storm, the use of Carol sparked public confusion and uproar from the research community who were still producing papers on Carol 1954.
In January 1969, the National Hurricane Research Laboratory asked the naming committee to permanently retire Carol, Edna and Hazel, which was approved. (note 2) So Carol was gone from the 1969 list, but they needed a new C name at the last minute. NHRL's Dr Miller suggested the name Camille, named after Camille Hope who, as you might have guessed, was the daughter of John Hope. At that time, Miller was supervising her for a high school research project. AFAIK, this is the only time that a storm name was chosen for an actual person.
We all know what happened after that. Ironically, the name Camille was retired after that one usage, and Camille was much stronger than Carol 1954, Carol 1965 and Carla 1961. (Even though Camille didn't directly replace Carla, in some sense Carla was the most recent retirement-worthy C storm on that naming list and part of the reason why Camille entered the list.)
Notes:
1) It was also decided after 1954 that different naming lists should be used every year (though the decision wasn't made soon enough to prevent the confusion of Alice June 1954 vs Alice December 1954, but that's a whole different story).
2) Despite the permanent retirement of Carol, Edna and Hazel, the name Edna somehow entered the 1972 naming list again (I can't find any sources on why that happened). Fortunately, it didn't matter since the 1972 season only used 4 names.
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
While Andrew was never as powerful a storm as Allen was, it was far more destructive.
And yeah, Ida has the potential to be far worse than Isabel.
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And yeah, Ida has the potential to be far worse than Isabel.
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- Category5Kaiju
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
With this I curse, I am willing to bet that next year, Ian is going to be a powerful Cat 4/5 hurricane that completely dwarfs Igor in impacts.
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Category5Kaiju wrote:With this I curse, I am willing to bet that next year, Ian is going to be a powerful Cat 4/5 hurricane that completely dwarfs Igor in impacts.
Will it be worse than Ivan, though?
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Isabelle < Ida
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
InfernoFlameCat wrote:Isabelle < Ida
Agree. While Ida might not be as meteorologically interesting as the Cat 5 annular Isabel, its impacts seem to be far worse and it had a more explosive RI phase too.
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
I remember this thread from long ago. Safe to say Ian is going to be a much worse storm, holistically, than Igor.
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Unless explicitly stated, all information covered in my posts is based on my opinions and observations. Please refer to a professional meteorologist or an accredited weather research agency otherwise, especially if serious decisions must be made in the event of a potentially life-threatening tropical storm or hurricane.
Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Category5Kaiju wrote:With this I curse, I am willing to bet that next year, Ian is going to be a powerful Cat 4/5 hurricane that completely dwarfs Igor in impacts.
Jeez that aged scarily well.
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I am only a meteorology enthusiast who knows a decent amount about tropical cyclones. Look to the professional mets, the NHC, or your local weather office for the best information.
I am only a meteorology enthusiast who knows a decent amount about tropical cyclones. Look to the professional mets, the NHC, or your local weather office for the best information.
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Category5Kaiju wrote:With this I curse, I am willing to bet that next year, Ian is going to be a powerful Cat 4/5 hurricane that completely dwarfs Igor in impacts.
You had to do it eh.
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Goal: to become a registered expert over tropical and subtropical cyclones.
Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
So what's next? Idalia becoming worse than Irma?
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Teban54 wrote:So what's next? Idalia becoming worse than Irma?
No no, 2023 will give us a surprise by pausing the I curse, with Idalia being a nothing burger in the open Atlantic. But then comes Harold, a high end Cat 5 that hits Miami head on and makes Andrew look like a baby
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Category5Kaiju wrote:With this I curse, I am willing to bet that next year, Ian is going to be a powerful Cat 4/5 hurricane that completely dwarfs Igor in impacts.
I really feel ashamed for saying this. I'm genuinely sorry.
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Category5Kaiju wrote:Teban54 wrote:So what's next? Idalia becoming worse than Irma?
No no, 2023 will give us a surprise by pausing the I curse, with Idalia being a nothing burger in the open Atlantic. But then comes Harold, a high end Cat 5 that hits Miami head on and makes Andrew look like a baby
Watch the I curse be beat out completely. Gert turns into a nightmarish colossus of a hurricane, meanwhile, Idalia forms for 6 hours near the Azores and disappears
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And it all comes tumbling down, tumbling down, tumbling down...
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And I just keep letting me down, letting me down, letting me down...
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Teban54 wrote:So what's next? Idalia becoming worse than Irma?
Yeah we don’t want to see Harold, Idalia, or Margot, or god forbid Katia be worse than the storms they replaced.
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Re: Storms that were worse than the name they replaced
Tekken_Guy wrote:Teban54 wrote:So what's next? Idalia becoming worse than Irma?
Yeah we don’t want to see Harold, Idalia, or Margot, or god forbid Katia be worse than the storms they replaced.
I can already imagine the comparisons if Katia becomes Katrina 2.0...
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