Texas Winter 2014-2015

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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3181 Postby Ntxw » Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:30 pm

More importantly, the Euro has a low around 32F Jan 24th for KAUS... :D

wxman57 wrote:
Ntxw wrote:No talk of the Euro? That storm is a major winter storm for Texas!

850mb temps are plenty cold, trowel and 32-35F near the surface.


Yet another big Texas snow storm from the EC? How did y'all enjoy the last few? I believe 6+ inches of snow turned into a very cold rain with a few sleet pellets mixed in. I'm in control now! I've burned off those nasty clouds and will start heating things up around here!


You told us yourself and I clarified. It wasn't the model output itself, it had questionable profiles but the maps made by the services that didn't have the correct algorithms. I suppose those maps would fare better if it was all snow and not some mixed bag. One or the other is much easier to decipher with a simple ratio as long as the column is sufficiently cold from top to bottom.
Last edited by Ntxw on Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3182 Postby wxman57 » Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:34 pm

I'm thinking winter of '85-'86 (that's 1985-86). We hit 92 degrees that February...
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#3183 Postby TexasStorm » Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:44 pm

Too bad Vegas will not let you bet on winter model runs 10 days out. I would become a bookie real quick and retire off my millions.
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3184 Postby Ntxw » Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:49 pm

Look at the Euro ENS. That is one mean trough machine you will ever see. Amazing how consistent it is at 500mb. The Eastern half of the US is going to get locked into Polar Vortex talk. Deep anomalous cold air down the plains first then cold pools in the Northern Plains and Lakes. This for an ENS mean...watch the OP guidance show something crazy the deeper we get into next week if you want a sample, view the Euro control. Natural gas spike is no joke.

Stuff pinwheeling in the southwest, that is a block ahead of it. 1985 not 1986 :wink:
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3185 Postby Brent » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:13 pm

Oh boy... FWD:


A STRONG COLD FRONT...POSSIBLY OF ARCTIC ORIGIN IS FORECAST BY
MEDIUM RANGE MODELS TO MOVE THROUGH THE AREA TUESDAY NIGHT INTO
WEDNESDAY. BOTH THE GFS AND EURO WANT TO DETACH STRONGER SHORTWAVE
ENERGY ALOFT ACROSS THE SOUTHERN ROCKIES AND SOUTHWEST U.S...WITH
THE NEW 12Z EUROPEAN MODEL STRONGER THAN THE GFS. INCREASING
SOUTHWEST FLOW ALOFT SHOULD TAP INTO RICH TROPICAL PACIFIC MOISTURE
IN THE MID LEVELS WITH MODIFIED GULF MOISTURE RIDING OVER THE
FRONTAL INVERSION WED NIGHT THROUGH THURS NIGHT PERIOD. WE HAVE
MAINTAINED ONLY A CHANCE FOR A COLD RAIN DURING THIS PERIOD DUE TO
UNCERTAINTIES ON SYSTEM TIMING/STRENGTH AND MOISTURE/TEMP PROFILES
THROUGH THE ATMOSPHERE. CONFIDENCE WILL LIKELY REMAIN LOW UNTIL
THIS SYSTEM GETS BETTERS SAMPLED IN FUTURE UPPER AIR RUNS.

OVERNIGHT THURSDAY AND FRIDAY LOOKS CHILLY. IN ADDITION...THE EURO
LIFTS A MUCH STRONGER TROUGH ACROSS THE AREA VERSUS THE GFS WITH A
HIGHER THREAT FOR POSSIBLE WINTER PRECIPITATION...LIKELY IN THE
FORM OF SNOW. AGAIN...IT IS WAY TOO EARLY TO ACCURATELY ASSESS
THIS SYSTEM AND WE WILL CONTINUE TO AWAIT CLEARER DETAILS TO PRESENT
THEMSELVES AS WET GET CLOSER TO THE EVENT.
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3186 Postby Portastorm » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:19 pm

Interesting comments from the Climate Prediction Center today in its 8-14 day forecast discussion:


8-14 DAY OUTLOOK FOR JAN 23 - 29 2015

DESPITE THE AFOREMENTIONED UNCERTAINTY DURING THE 6-10 DAY PERIOD, THE WEEK-2
FORECAST IS ISSUED WITH FAIRLY HIGH CONFIDENCE. MODEL AGREEMENT REMAINS GOOD
WITH RESPECT TO THE EVOLUTION OF THE RIDGE OVER FAR WESTERN NORTH AMERICA,
WHICH IS FORECAST TO ALLOW MORE ARCTIC AIR TO INFLUENCE THE CONUS WITH TIME.
THE 528 DM HEIGHT LINE LOCATED OVER THE GREAT LAKES IN THE MANUAL BLEND FINDS
ITS ORIGIN OVER THE ARCTIC OCEAN, A SURE SIGN OF AN ANOMALOUSLY COLD PATTERN.
IN FACT, THE FORECAST PATTERN BEARS MANY SIMILARITIES TO THE EXTREME COLD
PERIODS THAT HAVE OCCASIONALLY IMPACTED PARTS OF THE CONUS OVER THE PAST TWO
WINTERS.


THE ENSEMBLE MEANS ARE IN FAIRLY GOOD AGREEMENT ON THIS PATTERN, THOUGH SOME
UNCERTAINTY REMAINS WITH RESPECT TO TEMPERATURES OVER THE NORTHERN ROCKIES. THE
GFS REMAINS FARTHER EAST WITH THE MEAN RIDGE POSITION OVER WESTERN NORTH
AMERICA, AND SO HAS A MILDER SOLUTION OVER THAT REGION. HOWEVER, THE ECMWF AND
CANADIAN ENSEMBLES ARE IN GOOD AGREEMENT ON A COLDER SOLUTION WITH A RIDGE
CENTERED FARTHER WEST, SIMILAR TO THE DISAGREEMENT IN THE 6-10 DAY PERIOD. HERE
AGAIN THE ECMWF SOLUTION IS FAVORED, SINCE IT HAS GOOD SUPPORT FROM THE
TELECONNECTIONS, ANALOGS, AND THE CANADIAN ENSEMBLES.


THE PRECIPITATION OUTLOOK IS GENERALLY DRIER ACROSS MUCH OF THE CONUS COMPARED
TO THE 6-10 DAY PERIOD, DUE TO SOME EASTWARD PROGRESSION RESULTING IN ANOMALOUS
NORTHERLY FLOW ACROSS MOST OF THE CONUS. SOME SLIGHT PROBABILITIES FAVORING
ABOVE-MEDIAN PRECIPITATION ARE INDICATED OVER THE IMMEDIATE EAST COAST
EXTENDING TO SOUTHWEST TEXAS BASED ON THE FORECAST POSITION OF THE MEAN FRONTAL
ZONE.

THE OFFICIAL 8-14 DAY HEIGHT PROG CONSISTS OF: 10% OF TODAY'S 0Z GFS ENSEMBLE
MEAN CENTERED ON DAY 11, 20% OF TODAY'S 6Z GFS ENSEMBLE MEAN CENTERED ON DAY
11, 50% OF TODAY'S 0Z EUROPEAN ENSEMBLE MEAN CENTERED ON DAY 11, AND 20% OF
TODAY'S 0Z CANADIAN ENSEMBLE MEAN CENTERED ON DAY 11


FORECAST CONFIDENCE FOR THE 8-14 DAY PERIOD IS: ABOVE AVERAGE, 4 OUT OF 5, DUE
TO GOOD AGREEMENT ON THE OVERALL PATTERN, OFFSET SLIGHTLY BY MODEL DISAGREEMENT
NEAR THE ROCKIES.

FORECASTER: STEPHEN BAXTER
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#3187 Postby TeamPlayersBlue » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:21 pm

Lol, wow, that guy is going for it. If it digs or shows the same system again, then it will REALLY have my attention. My buddy and i were looking at snow tires for while in Colorado but not in Texas! If it snows just before we get there, im ok with that. Not into driving 40 MPH for 8 hours through snow
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3188 Postby CYCLONE MIKE » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:23 pm

wxman57 wrote:
Ntxw wrote:No talk of the Euro? That storm is a major winter storm for Texas!

850mb temps are plenty cold, trowel and 32-35F near the surface.


Yet another big Texas snow storm from the EC? How did y'all enjoy the last few? I believe 6+ inches of snow turned into a very cold rain with a few sleet pellets mixed in. I'm in control now! I've burned off those nasty clouds and will start heating things up around here!



:lol:

I know over here in south LA we are still digging out from the day 10 cat 5 superstorm blizzards the GFS and the multiple snowstorms the euro has given us this winter, its been brutal. Instead of generators all the home depots and lowes are stocked with snow blowers. I have already burned one up using it so much :roll:

And glad to see Portastorm has seen the light. I wouldn't take that bet either. Just like hurricane season, the cold is always 2 weeks away
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3189 Postby Brent » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:25 pm

Ooh they're favoring the Euro. :lol:
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3190 Postby Ntxw » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:26 pm

CYCLONE MIKE wrote:And glad to see Portastorm has seen the light. I wouldn't take that bet either. Just like hurricane season, the cold is always 2 weeks away


This has not been true in Texas. This is the coldest January thus far we have seen in almost 30 years. Portastorm's KAUS is nearly -10F below normal for the month.

Image
Last edited by Ntxw on Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3191 Postby orangeblood » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:27 pm

Ntxw wrote:Look at the Euro ENS. That is one mean trough machine you will ever see. Amazing how consistent it is at 500mb. The Eastern half of the US is going to get locked into Polar Vortex talk. Deep anomalous cold air down the plains first then cold pools in the Northern Plains and Lakes. This for an ENS mean...watch the OP guidance show something crazy the deeper we get into next week if you want a sample, view the Euro control. Natural gas spike is no joke.

Stuff pinwheeling in the southwest, that is a block ahead of it. 1985 not 1986 :wink:


Yep, we've seen this time and time again Ntxw...when you see such an anomalous look from the ensembles that far out, IT MEANS BUSINESS!! And usually its the Polar Vortex knocking on the doorstep...both Euro ENS and GFS now show the coldest air in the Northern Hemisphere from the surface to 500 MB draped across the Midwest later this month.... AKA Polar Vortex. Magnitude of the Greenland Block will dictate how long it pinwheels around the Great Lakes - sending Arctic High after Arctic High down into the plains...both control runs show the coldest HP coming down at the end of the run. But the two before that one are incredibly cold :cold: :cold:
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3192 Postby wxman57 » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:33 pm

Ntxw wrote:More importantly, the Euro has a low around 32F Jan 24th for KAUS... :D
You told us yourself and I clarified. It wasn't the model output itself, it had questionable profiles but the maps made by the services that didn't have the correct algorithms. I suppose those maps would fare better if it was all snow and not some mixed bag. One or the other is much easier to decipher with a simple ratio as long as the column is sufficiently cold from top to bottom.


I don't think it was the algorithms, as the EC had temps well above freezing (mid to upper 40s) for most of the way up to 10,000 ft while forecasting 3" of snow in the Lower RGV last event. It had the snow developing in above-freezing air and falling through above-freezing air for those 3" accumulations.
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3193 Postby Ntxw » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:36 pm

wxman57 wrote:I don't think it was the algorithms, as the EC had temps well above freezing (mid to upper 40s) for most of the way up to 10,000 ft while forecasting 3" of snow in the Lower RGV last event. It had the snow developing in above-freezing air and falling through above-freezing air for those 3" accumulations.


But the euro output doesn't have depictions of snow or ice just temps and qpf. The maps we see and use are based on human interpretations.
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#3194 Postby gboudx » Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:48 pm

Steve McCauley still beating the drum, lightly but let's see if it gets louder.

However, late next week (i.e., by Thursday) a major storm system will be moving into Texas and promises to bring a wide variety of precipitation to the state - from snow and ice to heavy thunderstorms. How much of all this will affect north Texas (i.e., whether we get a little or a lot) is still way too soon to predict, but it is certainly something we will be talking about over the days to come!
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#3195 Postby BrokenGlassRepublicn » Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:07 pm

As far as I'm concerned, we are officially on Bear Watch.
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#3196 Postby Ntxw » Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:30 pm

More fun maps from the 18z GFS

Image
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3197 Postby Brent » Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:38 pm

GFS looks like a big snowstorm too!

Image
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Re:

#3198 Postby Ralph's Weather » Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:44 pm

Ntxw wrote:More fun maps from the 18z GFS

Image


The models are not set on the exact time frame, but somewhere around the 23rd it looks like there could be a widespread winter storm across the state. If it is closer to the 22nd I am not sure the cold will be entrenched well enough for widespread snow. If it is closer to the 24th it could be a big time snow producer with the cold having a chance to deepen. Any later and I think we will start to lose out on moisture.
Another thing is if it all comes out at once or if part continually hangs out over the Southwest like they sometimes do just sending off pieces every so often.
Last edited by Ralph's Weather on Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3199 Postby WeatherNewbie » Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:45 pm

CYCLONE MIKE wrote:
wxman57 wrote:
Ntxw wrote:No talk of the Euro? That storm is a major winter storm for Texas!

850mb temps are plenty cold, trowel and 32-35F near the surface.


Yet another big Texas snow storm from the EC? How did y'all enjoy the last few? I believe 6+ inches of snow turned into a very cold rain with a few sleet pellets mixed in. I'm in control now! I've burned off those nasty clouds and will start heating things up around here!



:lol:

I know over here in south LA we are still digging out from the day 10 cat 5 superstorm blizzards the GFS and the multiple snowstorms the euro has given us this winter, its been brutal. Instead of generators all the home depots and lowes are stocked with snow blowers. I have already burned one up using it so much :roll:

And glad to see Portastorm has seen the light. I wouldn't take that bet either. Just like hurricane season, the cold is always 2 weeks away


It's been very cold in much of Texas since NYE, so not sure where the 2 weeks away comment is coming from...
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Re: Texas Winter 2014-2015

#3200 Postby Stormnut » Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:48 pm

Thats just his shtick. Every single post he makes is crying foul on the models.
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