Vets or Current Military:Weigh In

[Arizwx]

Good Evening,
If I may comment briefly,My 14 yr old middle son has had quite a time of it as of late.2 weeks ago,he was diagonosed with a brain Tumor,Pituitary.Thank God the tests revealed it Benign and very treatable.His Prognosis is for a full recovery even if surgery is indicated!I am most grateful for those of you that I have chosen to share this with,who offered sincere concern and prayers.They were answered.
On Tuesday morning I was summons to the Hospital,where He(Christopher)
had taken VERY ill.Flu symptoms of extreme type from Lower GI to Fever had rendered his BP to a low of 52!3 Bags of Saline and some TLC,along with the excellent care of the staff at Northwest Hospital stablized him and he is now at home,weak...but he will recover nicely.He's a tough SOB like his Daddy!Again,I thank those that were sincerely concerned.I finally got some shut eye after being up for 2 days with him.I came home to return to this BB,to see the cybergenerals on the loose.
I did some thinking and thought it may be appropriate for those of us that have served,or are serving to wiegh in as it were.A perspective I beleive may be of great value to those that may benefit from those experienced in such matters.There are,within your midst an amazing cache of experieced Vets,Reserve and those with Current Status.AZSkyMan,AslKahuna,AZSnowman,Streetsoldier,WxRisk,FreekyWxchick,Quacky,etc.I know I missed many,and I apologize.Here is YOUR chance to share.This also includes family or close friends that were/are affected.YOUR perpectives are of great value!
Last Sunday,I missed church Services for the first time in quite awhile.It was unavoidable.I had assisted our Pastor,at his request to do as I am proposing.That is,he wanted information.How and Why or What.Really anything to calm the fears and anxieties of the congregation,as we have a substantial Military population here,and many Families have loved ones 'In Theatre'He concluded with a small ceremony.He knew well,my background as a Naval Officer in SEASIA.He knew full well,the political strife of the era,as he is 57.He knew full well that many Nam Vets were did not come home under optimal circumstances.He knew well the broken souls.He decided to have every Nam vet stand in Church.Stand and be counted.Stand and be proud.Stand to an ovation that lasted nearly 5 minutes.Stand Tall.It was 30+ yrs later..but never too late.I was not there.
I did not stand,as I was MIA that Sunny Sunday Morning.I heard this through my ex wife.She was there.She told me she layed a flower for me on the seat next to her..where I used to sit before our seperation.She said..'DJ..You were there too".
Later that afternoon,My 12 yr old came by with a package..wrapped.I thought it a belated Birthday gift.It was not.It was a special package.In a velvet US NAVY box.There,lay my Gold Wings..
that had been awarded to me at a cermony at the White Houses' Rose Garden,1976.I had not seen these Wings in many years.I always wondered where they were.Apparently,my Mother had sent them to CJ(my ex)back in 82 when we were newlyweds.She also had my Tropical Whites starched and neatly folded with her Wedding Dress,which she put away JUNE,1982.My wings had been with the Dress and Uniform.
At least,she had found it appropriate to return them to me..and my youngest son,Colin as Messanger.How appropriate.I was most grateful.
Therefore,I have done some thinking.It seems I buried for many years much of my experience until recently.Major life changes and a War have a way of affecting people that way.One cannot move forward until the past is put in perspective,and put away in a journal of the mind and soul.
That said,we IMHO have many perpectives of value in these perilous times.I beleive we may 'wiegh in' with some analysis and commentary that may prove useful to those that may be curious,yet are uncomfortable in asking with regard to how this war is being prosecuted...or the outcome and repercussions as you see it,years later.Here then is our chance to stand tall.
~Be Well and Safe.
BTW,anyone here is welcome to participate in this thread.I only ask that you be polite and respectful..and direct commentary or questions on topic.Here is YOUR chance to learn just as my Pastor did.
Than You& God Bless America!

[streetsoldier]

This happened on a Veteran's Day Sunday service, about 6-7 years ago; the pastor asked all of the veterans in the congregation to rise and be recognized. Most were older WW II vets, and slowly rose to their feet, almost ashamed at the attention...I stood up sharply, at USAF attention, thumbs at the seams of my trousers, even to hearing my heels "clickl" resounding within the hushed church.

Later, my wife asked me "How could you embarrass me that way, in front of all those people?"

"Embarrass"? I have never answered her...it is beyond explanation, save for those who ARE still proud of the United States of America, and the opportunity to have served it as best they could.

[Arizwx]

This happened on a Veteran's Day Sunday service, about 6-7 years ago; the pastor asked all of the veterans in the congregation to rise and be recognized. Most were older WW II vets, and slowly rose to their feet, almost ashamed at the attention...I stood up sharply, at USAF attention, thumbs at the seams of my trousers, even to hearing my heels "clickl" resounding within the hushed church.

Later, my wife asked me "How could you embarrass me that way, in front of all those people?"

"Embarrass"? I have never answered her...it is beyond explanation, save for those who ARE still proud of the United States of America, and the opportunity to have served it as best they could.

SS,
When a Minister of God requests,within his House of God,in THESE United States of America,it is an integral meaningful requirement of the service of the Community to be thankful and respectful.Without the Defense of our Nation and her values,there may not have beeen any houses of Worship left to freely express.One Nation Under God.
Therefore,it is beyond my comprehension,that anyone could have possibly felt 'embarrassed'.
This sort of behaviour is unacceptable to me.As at-odds as CJ and I have been,she respected my Service and those that attended with HONOR.
Those that choose not to have no clue of the meaning of the word 'Gratitude' or 'Humility',both of which,IMO are reqirements for spiritual well being.
I salute you Sir!

[blizzard]

I would be embarrased to ask a veteran that question. Stand proud and be counted. I have no heart wrenching story to tell, or any combat stories, but i will always stand tall and proud of my service to this great country. I will not let anyone put our service members down. I will stand tall for them right now in this countries time of needing them.

Proud service to the United States of America
US Army
1984-1990
25th Infintry division (Hawaii)
45th support group (Hawaii)
3rd Armored cavalry regiment (Ft. Bliss, TX, currently Ft. Collins, CO)

GOD BLESS THE USA

[streetsoldier]

As to the conduct of this war...what I have seen is at least some of my fellow citizens who are so much into the concept of "instant gratification" (too many PlayStations?) that they immediately berated our President, our Chief of Staff, and our men and women in harm's way, despite the historical rapidity and planning so very carefully prepared and superbly executed...14 days in, and we are within howitzer range of Baghdad?

Our munitions are on a technological level I could never have dreamed possible 30 years ago; our troops are fit, well-trained and proven in fire, YET have the mercy and concern for the people we have gone 8,000 miles to liberate, feeding them, safeguarding them and their homes and shrines, delivering medicine, water, etc. under the most brutal of conditions against a regime which obeys no law but their own greed and sadistic "pleasures".

Those who so VIOLENTLY proclaim "peace" in demonstrations...intellectually lazy, blissfully unaware of the lessons of Munich, 1939, and funded by the remnants of a long dead and discredited socio-economic-political system have been seen in our streets. Some even dusting off the old Viet Cong and Soviet flags their fathers and mothers ranted under a generation or two ago, still "rebels"..without a clue.

Yet, we stand...move forward...the harvest is assured. It is not mine to dissect the political arena...it IS mine to do whatever I can to support those who, today, follow in the footsteps I left behind in a jungle, and they found in sand.

[Arizwx]

I would be embarrased to ask a veteran that question. Stand proud and be counted. I have no heart wrenching story to tell, or any combat stories, but i will always stand tall and proud of my service to this great country. I will not let anyone put our service members down. I will stand tall for them right now in this countries time of needing them.

Proud service to the United States of America
US Army
1984-1990
25th Infintry division (Hawaii)
45th support group (Hawaii)
3rd Armored cavalry regiment (Ft. Bliss, TX, currently Ft. Collins, CO)

GOD BLESS THE USA

Indeed many are still uncomfortable asking questions.I agree.Last spring,my 16 yr old had an assignment from his History class to contact at least 5 Vets..and ask a series of 16 questions.He asked my assistance,knowing my concern for privacy and respect.However,as we began to go through the questions,I found them quite respectful,meaningful and well written.I introduced him to a Staff Sgt(Marine '71-73) that was a nieghbor of ours..a transplant from New Jersey.
His name is Ray.A strapping engaging handsome man,married and happy.
We talked until the wee hours of the morning in his workshop working on his prized Harley..and I saw him take my son aside and tell him..'Your Daddy has not told you the half of it..I know what he went through,and all I can say Son,is be proud..very proud.'I am grateful to Ray.I am grateful we live in a Nation,where a Father and Son and a Nieghbor can get together in a Garage on a warm Spring eve and be honest and giving.
That is a sweet slice of America.I was also invited to his Class to give a non Politically Correct overview of what I experienced..the sounds,smells,feelings.It was the 'Incredible Feeling of Lightness' that I felt afterward.
I decided to get 'deep' and introduce my son to my Tailor,here in Tucson.His name is 'Tam'.He is a Naturalized citizen of the US now..a former South Vietnamese national from a western Province.He was a Major in the South Vietnamese Army,our Allies.He,along with His family in the waning days of the war,were taken captive by NVM.He was a 'prize',and was to be made an 'example of'.ALL of his Family was imprisoned,tortured,raped and executed.Tam was liberated in 1986,a mere 92 lbs and near Death.He came to Tucson,where his infant child had been taken to to live with an American family in 1975.Tam came here,recalimed his daughter and married a So Viet Nurse,working in Tucson.They are wonderful people.He corresponds with me now...and he on occasion,hugs me,all 5'5 of him!My son was VERY impressed by his humility.This is the learning curve,I believe missing in many factions of today's society.

This thread is not about a Hero's combat Warstories.I will leave that to Col Oliver North.This is about perspective to those that have been 'behind the scenes' in any capacity...to enlighten hopefully,what it means to wear the Uniform and perform a Duty,and the insight such experience can afford.Streetsoldier has done just that with his second entry above.Well done Bill!
I salute you Sir!

[sunny shine]

It is sad that these veterans would not rise and be commended because they felt ashamed, much less even hesitate. Proud of you for that streetsoldier.

I was told by a Vietnam Vet that when the troops returned home from Vietnam they were spat on, cursed and everything else. The United States did not support them nor did they welcome them home. Made those men feel ashamed they had fought for this country. I believe some of that still affects our veterans to this day! When you go to an anti war protest you will not see the faces of these fine veterans amongst them. If you go to a rally for the troops crowd you will see many veterans standing proud behind our military. Supporters of this war are being deemed the "Silent Majority" but now we are starting to show our true colors and that is RED WHITE AND BLUE!!

[streetsoldier]

To any and all serving or retired soldiers, sailors, airmen, Marines, Coast Guardsmen and merchant mariners who served, this thread is for and about YOU; it is deserving of your attentions, and I would encourage your responses...tell it like it is, was, or will be.

[sunny shine]

Sorry streetsoldier... I did not know I was not supposed to be here.

[streetsoldier]

sunny shine,

These are for YOU (and the rest of our "family" too; what profit it that only the vets tell their stories, if none come in to be edified?

Storm2K, come on down!

[sunny shine]

Oh okay! I look forward to reading the stories. God Bless You Sir. (SALUTE)

[Arizwx]

sunny shine,

These are for YOU (and the rest of our "family" too; what profit it that only the vets tell their stories, if none come in to be edified?

Storm2K, come on down!

Again,
This thread is not intended to take a walk down Memory Lane...Hell Style.
War Stories are for barstools and grandkids.
This is intended to be informative.Much as if one would seek a Doctor's advice when ill,a Pilot in the case of an Air accident or an Attroney if one needs legal input,etc.It's about hands on experience,and lessons learned,applied and shared.
In no way do I wish to force an issue or make Vets or those of Active Status feel as if they should bare the brunt of unpleasantries.
For example.How many here would understand the way that seperate Branches of our Armed Forces interact both exclusively and inclusively and the mind boggling logistics?AslKahuna for instance,a man with 30+yrs of Military Met experience,most likely had 'my six'(my back) even though he was Air Force in the Phillipines...I an F-4B Navy Jockey far away in the South China Sea and Gulf of Tonkin during Typhoon season.This is still very relevant.The Sandstorm that plagued our offensive,is a grand example.With major improvements in technology,we(they)saw it coming..
from Russia!That's correct,a massive Retrograding Low Pressure system.
These are just some examples of 'how it works'..and each integral parts to a mosaic of Power and prowess that gives US the major advantage!You won't see much of that on FoxyNews!
I trust our braintrust therefore..weighs in.

[petal*pusher]

(Streetsoldier.....my heart salutes you!)

My two oldest brothers were in the Navy at the start of the Viet Nam war. Both served there; both have Purple Hearts. The oldest was put in as a hospital corpman and transferred to the Marine division. His letters home were horrific to us, but he truly believed in what he was doing. There was another Michigan soldier working with him........everyone thought they were brothers because of the red hair, height, and mannerism. My brother Larry took a bullet. Thinking he was dead, the sniper who shot him quickly cut off the hospital corpman insignia........$500.00 reward! It was his friend Archie who carried him to the waiting helicoptor. During my brothers recuperation stay in Japan, Archie came home to Detroit to get married. Our family recieved an invitation! The church was almost filled when we arrived.........except for an entire row near the front. As Archie stood waiting for his bride all of us were overcome! The only tears in that church were from our row........we had never even seen him before, but our tremendous gratitude was overwelming. They were later reunited in the battlefield........still keep in touch.

Glad the subject of teachers came up here. I was always impressed that my own childrens intructors did what they could to encourage students to study this war. A few years ago, as we took our Horticulture students on a bus to view the city parks here (we would be in charge of planting them in the spring) one stop was at our Memorial Park. The kids and I were gabbing about plants when suddenly we were standing right in front of Lenawee County's granite memorial to the Viet Nam war. Looking up, the names of 4 friends jumped out at me.........without warning, my legs buckled and I found myself in tears. The kids lifted me up and hugged me....then each other....then me again! I sincerely think learning opportunities surround us and this was a valuable one for them......and ME! Many young people have more respect for Viet Nam Vets than what people realize!

Only one more thing.......I promise!

Yesterday's gathering in Adrian at the Court House of those in support of our troops was F-A-N-T-A-S-T-I-C !!!!! Several hundred people lined the curbs for 2 blocks.....waving flags and signs. Passing vehicles.....almost ALL of them, honked their horns in support. A lump in my throat came when a young man saluted as he passed. This show of support was followed a half hour later by a small group of about 20 waving "Peace" signs.........I drove by; no horns were honking.

Thanks so much for letting me remember.........I know my memories are nothing like so many of you...............p

[Stephanie]

DJ -

First of all, let me say, I hope that your son gets well soon and I am so thankful that that tumor was found to be benign!

That was a wonderful, caring thing your ex-wife did for you at the church and sending your son over with your wings. Do not feel sorry that you were not at the church! Everyone I'm sure understood completely as to why you could not attend.

Lastly, I have been learning alot from our "vets" here on this board and I appreciate the history and knowledge that you all possess and share with us. Thank you and I'll look forward to reading your posts here regarding your stances on this war.

[Arizwx]

(Streetsoldier.....my heart salutes you!)

My two oldest brothers were in the Navy at the start of the Viet Nam war. Both served there; both have Purple Hearts. The oldest was put in as a hospital corpman and transferred to the Marine division. His letters home were horrific to us, but he truly believed in what he was doing. There was another Michigan soldier working with him........everyone thought they were brothers because of the red hair, height, and mannerism. My brother Larry took a bullet. Thinking he was dead, the sniper who shot him quickly cut off the hospital corpman insignia........$500.00 reward! It was his friend Archie who carried him to the waiting helicoptor. During my brothers recuperation stay in Japan, Archie came home to Detroit to get married. Our family recieved an invitation! The church was almost filled when we arrived.........except for an entire row near the front. As Archie stood waiting for his bride all of us were overcome! The only tears in that church were from our row........we had never even seen him before, but our tremendous gratitude was overwelming. They were later reunited in the battlefield........still keep in touch.

Glad the subject of teachers came up here. I was always impressed that my own childrens intructors did what they could to encourage students to study this war. A few years ago, as we took our Horticulture students on a bus to view the city parks here (we would be in charge of planting them in the spring) one stop was at our Memorial Park. The kids and I were gabbing about plants when suddenly we were standing right in front of Lenawee County's granite memorial to the Viet Nam war. Looking up, the names of 4 friends jumped out at me.........without warning, my legs buckled and I found myself in tears. The kids lifted me up and hugged me....then each other....then me again! I sincerely think learning opportunities surround us and this was a valuable one for them......and ME! Many young people have more respect for Viet Nam Vets than what people realize!

Only one more thing.......I promise!

Yesterday's gathering in Adrian at the Court House of those in support of our troops was F-A-N-T-A-S-T-I-C !!!!! Several hundred people lined the curbs for 2 blocks.....waving flags and signs. Passing vehicles.....almost ALL of them, honked their horns in support. A lump in my throat came when a young man saluted as he passed. This show of support was followed a half hour later by a small group of about 20 waving "Peace" signs.........I drove by; no horns were honking.

Thanks so much for letting me remember.........I know my memories are nothing like so many of you...............p

Thank YOU so much,
For Weighing In!This is exactly(repsonses like yours') what I had intended,when I concieved the idea.
I have roots in Michigan.My Grandfather,a Politician from Detroit and later Dearborn and Grosse Pointe.My Father,a native Detroiter.I spent many summers in Michigan as a lad from Detroit to Mackinac Island... my first Pro Baseball Game that I attended at 4 yrs old with my Grandfather was Tiger Game at then Briggs Stadium,and later Tiger Stadium.Al Kaline,Rocky Colavito,'Stormin' Norman Cash,Mickey Mantle,Roger Merris,Whitey Ford and Yogi Berra in tow.My,the joy!I am still a Tiger fan at heart!Even though,as you know I am from the SF Bay Area,and my Giants and Niners are #1!My parents had a 5 Acre Summer Home & property at Lake Angelus,MI about 35mi NW of Detroit when I was overseas.There is also an Observatory there wher emy father would teach me about the heavens.I recall beautiful 'Weeping Willows' on cool July eves and the Jet boats silently cruising the sunsets after a full day of waterskiing.This is where I learned to waterski as a young buck,taught by a Cypress Gardens,Fla. pro.Ah,the memories.
Speaking of Flowers..I recall attending the Tulip Festival at Holland,MI on the West Coast of Michigan and of course the lovely Arboretums of Belle Isle in Detroit and The Gardens of Cranbrook Institute in Bloomfield Hills!
So many of us during those War Years depended on Ball Games on the Sqwak Boxes.It was our connection to 'home'.Armed Forces Radio..and 'Good Morning Vietnam!'.
I was saddened to hear of the horrific treatment of your young Corpsman!
Off limits per Geneva Accords...but you see..the same disrespect in Iraq still exists even today.
I Salute YOU as well this Sunny Thursday Morn!