Texas Winter 2022-2023

Winter Weather Discussion

Moderator: S2k Moderators

Forum rules

The posts in this forum are NOT official forecast and should not be used as such. They are just the opinion of the poster and may or may not be backed by sound meteorological data. They are NOT endorsed by any professional institution or STORM2K.

Help Support Storm2K
Message
Author
Ntxw
Storm2k Moderator
Storm2k Moderator
Posts: 21502
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 6:34 pm
Location: DFW, Texas

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#561 Postby Ntxw » Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:21 am

Also the CPC ensembles package from the latest GEFS added some more years. 1963 and Dec 1985 which were frigid. List keeps growing.

Image
4 likes   
The above post and any post by Ntxw is NOT an official forecast and should not be used as such. It is just the opinion of the poster and may or may not be backed by sound meteorological data. It is NOT endorsed by any professional institution including Storm2k. For official information, please refer to NWS products.

  Help support Storm2K!
Help Support Storm2K

User avatar
TheProfessor
Professional-Met
Professional-Met
Posts: 3505
Age: 27
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:56 am
Location: Wichita, Kansas

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#562 Postby TheProfessor » Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:22 am

The cold is coming!

Hello old friends! It's been a while. I've been signaling this potential setup since October at my office. First highlighted the potential at our winter weather workshop. I've been pretty busy getting more involved over the last few months so it's been a lot of fun.

First I want to correct a misconception about this setup. Our source region is not the typical northwest Canada, but instead Siberia. This is a classic -EPO and -AO setup, which funnels the cold are our way. When you have just -EPO and the AO and NAO are positive the northern stream is more progressive and the cold air bleeds towards Europe. Without the -EPO but a -AO is in place the PNA and NAO become more important as a less amplified pattern allows cold to escape east and vice versa. Our source region in NW Canada is also more important in that setup. But when both come together it leads to a highly amplified pattern and cross polar flow that allows for continued shots of cold air.

Image

Early on there may be some escape of cold air to the east so the first cold shot may be somewhat of a glancing blow "step down" we'll probably still feel the effects here in Kanasas.

Image

By day 11 we see the -EPO ridge and -AO force Siberian air southward. We see a new trough entering the Plains interacting with the cold. This could be the big storm before Christmas.



Image

On Day 14 we continue to see the -EPO and -AO force cold southward. The trough has advanced further east now and some real cold would be filtering in on the back side of it.

Image

Image

Image

These are the temperatures the GEFS has over Siberia so we will be dealing with -30 to -40 air. This is an ensembles mean so extremes in either direction won't be represented.


Image

Snow cover looks good over the areas that the air parcels will travel over. Some of these areas will be getting a fresh snowpack as well. This will help limit air from modifying on its journey.

Overall it's looking to be a significant cold outbreak. Right now I think we'll see single digit lows here in Kansas at a minimum, which is way too cold for my liking. After spending 2.5 years in South I love my cold resistance I built up in Ohio. 20-30 degrees is my sweet spot. I do think there is a chance we could see historic cold, but in order for it to happen we need to have a significant snowpack develop from North Texas up to northern Nebraska. This system on Monday should have northern Nebraska covered. If we can get a large snowpack then single digit temperatures will be possible all the way down to Texas.
Last edited by TheProfessor on Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
13 likes   
An alumnus of The Ohio State University.

Your local National Weather Service office is your best source for weather information.

User avatar
ThunderSleetDreams
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1398
Age: 41
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 4:42 pm
Location: S of Weimar, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#563 Postby ThunderSleetDreams » Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:26 am

TheProfessor wrote:The cold is coming!

Hello old friends! It's been a while. I've been signaling this potential setup since October at my office. First highlighted the potential at our winter weather workshop. I've been pretty busy getting more involved over the last few months so it's been a lot of fun.

First I want to correct a misconception about this setup. Our source region is not the typical northwest Canada, but instead Siberia. This is a classic -EPO and -AO setup, which funnels the cold are our way. When you have just -EPO and the AO and NAO are positive the northern stream is more progressive and the cold air bleeds towards Europe. Without the -EPO but a -AO is in place the PNA and NAO become more important as a less amplified pattern allows cold to escape east and vice versa. Our source region in NW Canada is also more important in that setup. But when both come together it leads to a highly amplified pattern and cross polar flow that allows for continued shots of cold air.

[url]https://i.ibb.co/nz1RZrZ/gfs-ens-z500a-nhem-30.png [/url]

Early on there may be some escape of cold air to the east so the first cold shot may be somewhat of a glancing blow "step down" we'll probably still feel the effects here in Kanasas.

[url]https://i.ibb.co/wz4W0wL/gfs-ens-z500a-nhem-49.png [/url]

By day 11 we're looking at the AO blocking the path of the cold and sending it south. We should see some real cold flow down the back side of the trough.


[url]https://i.ibb.co/k41WVSq/gfs-ens-z500a-nhem-57.png [/url]

By day 14 we continue to see the -EPO ridge and -AO force Siberian air southward. We see a new trough entering the Plains interacting with the cold. This could be the big storm before Christmas.


[url]https://i.ibb.co/CWZ3g1K/gfs-ens-T2m-nhem-30.png [/url]

[url]https://i.ibb.co/NTFvhhQ/gfs-ens-T2m-nhem-49.png [/url]

[url]https://i.ibb.co/6nVGnGf/gfs-ens-T2m-nhem-57.png [/url]

These are the temperatures the GEFS has over Siberia so we will be dealing with -30 to -40 air. This is an ensembles mean so extremes in either direction won't be represented.


[url]https://i.ibb.co/SwFGwnN/ims2022342.gif [/url]

Snow cover looks good over the areas that the air parcels will travel over. Some of these areas will be getting a fresh snowpack as well. This will help limit air from modifying on its journey.

Overall it's looking to be a significant cold outbreak. Right now I think we'll see single digit lows here in Kansas at a minimum, which is way too cold for my liking. After spending 2.5 years in South I love my cold resistance I built up in Ohio. 20-30 degrees is my sweet spot. I do think there is a chance we could see historic cold, but in order for it to happen we need to have a significant snowpack develop from North Texas up to northern Nebraska. This system on Monday should have northern Nebraska covered. If we can get a large snowpack then single digit temperatures will be possible all the way down to Texas.



Beautiful post Professor!
3 likes   
#NeverSummer

I hibernate when it gets above 75 degrees!

User avatar
Texas Snow
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 730
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 12:06 pm
Location: N. Dallas & Cedar Creek Lake

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#564 Postby Texas Snow » Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:34 am

Thanks for this. Great detail to back up your thoughts! Glad things are going well for you…
2 likes   
"Don't let wishcastin get in the way of your forecastin"

Image

gpsnowman
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 2716
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:35 am
Location: Grand Prairie Tx

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#565 Postby gpsnowman » Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:53 am

The Professor has made it. Great post young man!! From posting in high school class to a polished meteorologist.
Last edited by gpsnowman on Fri Dec 09, 2022 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
4 likes   

Ntxw
Storm2k Moderator
Storm2k Moderator
Posts: 21502
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 6:34 pm
Location: DFW, Texas

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#566 Postby Ntxw » Fri Dec 09, 2022 11:01 am

Great post TheProfessor! Beauty of it this is a sustained pattern meaning the snowpack we build isn't at risk of being decimated by in-between moderating period, glacier. The gradual slow burn spokes of cold is preferable over the one big blast.

Yesterday I made a post about the waves of cold, so in fact with a gradual build the absolute coldest period may actually extend out there that we cannot yet see due to model limitations (further out in time.)
5 likes   
The above post and any post by Ntxw is NOT an official forecast and should not be used as such. It is just the opinion of the poster and may or may not be backed by sound meteorological data. It is NOT endorsed by any professional institution including Storm2k. For official information, please refer to NWS products.



  Help support Storm2K!

Help Support Storm2K


HockeyTx82
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1988
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:17 am
Location: Ponder, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#567 Postby HockeyTx82 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 11:11 am

gpsnowman wrote:The Professor has made it. Great post youmg man!! From posting in high school class to a polished meteorologist.


Our little Professor is all grown up... :cry:

:D
3 likes   
Don't hold me accountable for anything I post on this forum. Leave the real forecasting up to the professionals.

Location: Ponder, TX (all observation posts are this location unless otherwise noted)

User avatar
Iceresistance
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 8913
Age: 20
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:45 am
Location: Tecumseh, OK/Norman, OK

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#568 Postby Iceresistance » Fri Dec 09, 2022 12:32 pm

Now the OP GFS is being confused right now, snow or no snow.
0 likes   
Bill 2015 & Beta 2020

Winter 2020-2021 :cold:

All observations are in Tecumseh, OK unless otherwise noted.

Winter posts are focused mainly for Oklahoma & Texas.

Take any of my forecasts with a grain of salt, refer to the NWS, SPC, and NHC for official information

Never say Never with weather! Because ANYTHING is possible!

Cpv17
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 4324
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:24 pm
Location: Wharton/El Campo, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#569 Postby Cpv17 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 12:46 pm

Iceresistance wrote:Now the OP GFS is being confused right now, snow or no snow.


Op’s are terrible right now. They’re having big trouble figuring out the pattern change.
2 likes   

harp
Category 2
Category 2
Posts: 517
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:01 am
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#570 Postby harp » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:01 pm

Gfs is all over the place!! Sheesh??!!
0 likes   

User avatar
Iceresistance
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 8913
Age: 20
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:45 am
Location: Tecumseh, OK/Norman, OK

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#571 Postby Iceresistance » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:08 pm

harp wrote:Gfs is all over the place!! Sheesh??!!

Models having a hard time figuring out the changing patterns.
0 likes   
Bill 2015 & Beta 2020

Winter 2020-2021 :cold:

All observations are in Tecumseh, OK unless otherwise noted.

Winter posts are focused mainly for Oklahoma & Texas.

Take any of my forecasts with a grain of salt, refer to the NWS, SPC, and NHC for official information

Never say Never with weather! Because ANYTHING is possible!

HockeyTx82
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1988
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:17 am
Location: Ponder, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#572 Postby HockeyTx82 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:19 pm

Iceresistance wrote:
harp wrote:Gfs is all over the place!! Sheesh??!!

Models having a hard time figuring out the changing patterns.


Winter Cancel
2 likes   
Don't hold me accountable for anything I post on this forum. Leave the real forecasting up to the professionals.

Location: Ponder, TX (all observation posts are this location unless otherwise noted)

User avatar
ThunderSleetDreams
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1398
Age: 41
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 4:42 pm
Location: S of Weimar, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#573 Postby ThunderSleetDreams » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:22 pm

Guys, OP runs are entertainment right now. Again, blend your ensembles.
5 likes   
#NeverSummer

I hibernate when it gets above 75 degrees!

User avatar
txtwister78
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1011
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:56 pm
Location: San Antonio

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#574 Postby txtwister78 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:24 pm

]
Last edited by txtwister78 on Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 likes   

User avatar
txtwister78
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1011
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:56 pm
Location: San Antonio

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#575 Postby txtwister78 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:25 pm

The CMC Ens continue to trend colder during the Christmas week timeframe.

Image

Image
3 likes   

Cpv17
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 4324
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:24 pm
Location: Wharton/El Campo, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#576 Postby Cpv17 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:30 pm

txtwister78 wrote:The CMC Ens continue to trend colder during the Christmas week timeframe.

https://images.weatherbell.com/model/cmc-ensemble-all-avg/namer/t2m_c_anom/1670587200/1671732000-gSTcM7qjJZ0.png


Some of the biggest freezes our nation has seen started out west and worked east for coast to coast cold.
2 likes   

orangeblood
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 3334
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:14 pm
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#577 Postby orangeblood » Fri Dec 09, 2022 2:03 pm

Latest Euro Op about to lay the Arctic hammer down across lower 48 day 9-10…PV crashing into Great Lakes with 1060 HP forming in NW Canada. Pattern is ripe for this scenario

Image

Image
2 likes   

User avatar
Edwards Limestone
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 338
Age: 34
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 2021 11:05 am
Location: Smithson Valley, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#578 Postby Edwards Limestone » Fri Dec 09, 2022 2:07 pm

Is wxman just trolling us a little? He seems to be alone in here vs. our other pros.
0 likes   
The above post is NOT an official forecast and should not be used as such. It is just the opinion of the poster and may or may not be backed by sound meteorological data. It is NOT endorsed by any professional institution including Storm2k. For official information, please refer to NWS products.

HockeyTx82
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1988
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:17 am
Location: Ponder, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#579 Postby HockeyTx82 » Fri Dec 09, 2022 2:09 pm

Edwards Limestone wrote:Is wxman just trolling us a little? He seems to be alone in here vs. our other pros.


He will call it when he truly sees it.
3 likes   
Don't hold me accountable for anything I post on this forum. Leave the real forecasting up to the professionals.

Location: Ponder, TX (all observation posts are this location unless otherwise noted)

User avatar
ThunderSleetDreams
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1398
Age: 41
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 4:42 pm
Location: S of Weimar, TX

Re: Texas Winter 2022-2023

#580 Postby ThunderSleetDreams » Fri Dec 09, 2022 2:11 pm

Edwards Limestone wrote:Is wxman just trolling us a little? He seems to be alone in here vs. our other pros.


He hedges in his statement with words like “for now”….

But yeah, I think he’s challenging some of the posters here to show their work…. Like the Professor did.

All I know is this…. When my clients start chirping and my trading buddies go all in, I’m positive something is coming. They are usually the last to be IN on the Arctic pattern change.
2 likes   
#NeverSummer

I hibernate when it gets above 75 degrees!


Return to “Winter Weather”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 206 guests