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Severe Wx Discussion - November 8, 2005

Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 11:55 pm
by wxmann_91
The last discussion was a complete bust. If this one is again then I will quit :D . I mean, I am not angry but if I create these topics and nobody replied then I'd look like a complete moron, and I'd be wasting a lot of time.

The NAM initialized pretty well on the 0Z run. Dewpoints around 70 in the GOM attm. By 0Z tomorrow, it shows dewpoints around 65 in the IL/IN vicinity, along with CAPE values up to 2000 and LI's down to -6. :eek: If you ask me that is pretty impressive for November. SRH values over 200 m2s2 along and to the north of the Ohio River. The shear increases toward 6Z due to an approaching strong jet max, and the presence of a strong cap should preclude development until dark, but once the initial supercells fire, tornadoes aren't out of the possibility.

The GFS didn't initialize as well, dewpoints are too low. Thus, by 0Z tomorrow, it shows LI's of only -2, and lesser CAPE values. It too shows a strong jet max approaching the current SWODY2 SLGT area, however, it is delayed by a few hours.

Overall model agreement is good.

Summary: Expect initiation around sunset or after. But good shear (both speed and directional as it seems) will aid in the development of tornadic supercells. Greatest threat in central IL and IN, along the warm front. Setup is very similar to last time expect just a little to the north and better moisture to work with.

Post comments here, before, during, and after the event (latter one if necessary).

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 1:07 am
by jhamps10
now what do you mean by Central IL, the Springfield-Decatur-Champaign area or along the I-70 coridoor?

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:17 am
by wxmann_91
jhamps10 wrote:now what do you mean by Central IL, the Springfield-Decatur-Champaign area or along the I-70 coridoor?


I'd say everyone to the north of I-70 should watch, including the Springfield-Decatur-Champaign area. The threat now also includes northern IL and southern WI, per the new SWODY1.

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:51 am
by jhamps10
wxmann_91 wrote:
jhamps10 wrote:now what do you mean by Central IL, the Springfield-Decatur-Champaign area or along the I-70 coridoor?


I'd say everyone to the north of I-70 should watch, including the Springfield-Decatur-Champaign area. The threat now also includes northern IL and southern WI, per the new SWODY1.


That makes me feel a little better, I live about 20 miles south of I-70. I am on watch though, since the TV stations mentioned a possiblity(slight, very slight) but still a chance.
After what happened Sat. night, everyone in a threat area NEEDS to stay on top of this. We have weather conditions that are just like they were on Sat. morning here right now, I'm actually a little bit on the nervous side right now.

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 6:39 pm
by wxmann_91
Initiation has not begun yet, but look at this AFD:

AREA FORECAST DISCUSSION
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE NORTHERN INDIANA
435 PM EST TUE NOV 8 2005

.SHORT TERM...
TONIGHT AND WEDNESDAY...
WIDESPREAD THUNDERSTORMS ARE EXPECTED OVER MOST OF THE FORECAST AREA
TONIGHT WITH LARGE HAIL...DAMAGING WINDS AND EVEN TORNADOES
POSSIBLE.
A WARM FRONT WAS LIFTING NORTH SLOWLY ACROSS CENTRAL IL
AND CENTRAL INDIANA THIS AFTERNOON. THE FRONT WILL ACCELERATE
NORTHEAST AS LOW LEVEL WINDS INCREASE FROM THE SOUTHWEST. THE
UPSTREAM AIRMASS DESTABILIZED TODAY WITH TEMPERATURES TOPPING 80 AND
DEW POINTS INTO THE MID 60S. MOISTURE FLUX/TRANSPORT WILL BECOME
EXTREME OVERNIGHT AS LOW LEVEL WINDS INCREASE TO AROUND 50 KNOTS.
SEVERE STORMS SHOULD DEVELOP THIS EVENING ALONG AND JUST NORTH OF A
WARM FRONT FROM MONTICELLO TO PORTLAND. THE LINE OF STORMS WILL
TRANSLATE NORTHEAST INTO FAR SOUTHWEST LOWER MICHIGAN AND NORTHWEST
OHIO OVERNIGHT WITH SEVERE WEATHER POSSIBLE THROUGHOUT THE NIGHT.
THE AREA ALONG AND JUST NORTH OF THE FRONT WILL BECOME ACTIVE EARLY
TONIGHT ONCE LOW LEVEL WINDS INCREASE AND INTERACT WITH THE FRONT.
THIS IS A PARTICULARLY DANGEROUS SITUATION GIVEN THE STORM
TYPE...TIME OF DAY AND RAPID STORM MOVEMENT.
CONDITIONS WILL BECOME
FAVORABLE FOR EVEN TORNADOES AS THUNDERSTORMS FORM WHERE THERE IS A
LARGE AREA OF WIND SHEAR NEAR THE GROUND. ENERGY HELICITY INDEX FROM
2.0 TO 3.5 INDICATES A FAVORABLE TORNADO POTENTIAL AS MOST UNSTABLE
CAPES REACH BETWEEN 1200 AND 1800 J/KG.


THE COLD FRONT WILL DIVE SOUTHEAST WEDNESDAY...WITH A LINGERING
CHANCE FOR SEVERE STORMS WEDNESDAY MORNING ESPECIALLY OVER NORTHWEST
OHIO.

&&

.WEDNESDAY NIGHT THROUGH TUESDAY...
PREFER ECMWF CONSISTENCY WITH THE SHORT WAVE THIS WEEKEND. THE ECMWF
HAS BEEN THE MOST CONSISTENT FROM RUN TO RUN WITH THIS SYSTEM...SO
WILL KEEP A CHANCE FOR STORMS IN SUNDAY. OVERALL...WENT COOLER EARLY
NEXT WEEK PER ECMWF.

&&

.MARINE...
SFC LOW SHOULD DEEPEN TO AROUND 990 MB OVER LAKE SUPERIOR BY LATE
WEDNESDAY. WINDS WILL INCREASE TONIGHT...ESPECIALLY BEHIND THE FRONT
BY LATE TONIGHT AS PRESSURE GRADIENT INCREASES. HAVE LEFT GALE
WARNING IF EFFECT WEDNESDAY AFTERNOON THROUGH THURSDAY MORNING FOR
THESE STRONG WINDS.

&&

.IWX WATCHES/WARNINGS/ADVISORIES...
IN...NONE.
MI...NONE.
OH...NONE.
LM...GALE WARNING 18Z WED-12Z THU FOR LMZ043-046.

&&

$$

SKIPPER

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 6:51 pm
by wxmann_91

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:14 pm
by wxmann_91
Tornado watch 852 out:

http://www.storm2k.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?p=1132077#1132077

It looks like today will either likely be boom or bust. Either the boundary layer decouples and elevated storms form as inhibition strengthens, or sfc-based storms form and a tornado outbreak ensues. Very tough forecast indeed, very similar to the setup for the Evansville outbreak. It was suppose to be the first scenario but it quickly turned into the second scenario.

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 10:15 pm
by jkt21787
Looks like bust instead of boom tonight. New SPC MCD indicates area west of East Central IN could be cancelled from the watch.