STORM2K

It disturbs me when idiots like this give gun control advocates reason to preach (and you can't argue with them).

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,113691,00.html

Man Killed During Initiation at Masonic Lodge

Tuesday, March 09, 2004

PATCHOGUE, N.Y. — A man was killed during a ceremony at a Masonic temple when another member fired a gun loaded with real bullets instead of the expected blanks and shot him in the head, police said Tuesday.

A 76-year-old man alleged to have fired the shot was arrested.

William James, 47, was shot while participating in an induction Monday night at the Southside Masonic Lodge, Suffolk County police said. He was pronounced dead at the scene.

Albert Eid, of Patchogue, was arrested and scheduled to be arraigned Tuesday, police officer Al Prim said. The district attorney's office said the .32-caliber pistol used in the shooting was licensed to Eid.

Police Detective Lt. Jack Fitzpatrick said the ceremony included a loud noise to frighten the new member. The inductee faces the front of the room and cans are stacked up behind him, he said. A gun is fired near the inductee's head and the cans are toppled, Fitzpatrick added.

The lieutenant said Eid had two guns — one with blanks and one with real bullets — and he apparently pulled out the wrong one.

Carl Fitje, grand master of the New York State Freemasons, said in a statement Tuesday that guns do not play a role in any officially sanctioned lodge ceremonies.

"We don't use pistols," Steve Mayo, who described himself as a senior deacon of the lodge, told reporters Tuesday. "This is not a Masonic ceremony where we bring pistols."

Mayo said the Monday night ceremony was an initiation into the Fellow Craft, which is the second degree within the multilevel Masonic system.

Mayo said James, of Medford, had been a member of the lodge for a few months while Eid had been a member for many years.

"This is very upsetting, very upsetting that one of our brothers was accidentally killed," he said.

James worked for the planning department of the Long Island town of Brookhaven, spokesman Dave Kennedy said.

an uneducated public is the main reason i want more gun controls. everyone makes sacrifices...i don't understand how this is a big deal?! IMHO there are definitly bigger issues in life.

Something is seriously WRONG with this picture!

I am a Mason, and it is impermissible for ANY Brother to bring weapons within the Lodge when it is in session. In fact, all brethren must leave their grievances, personal politics, etc. AT THE DOOR (including weapons); harmony and peace prevailing at all times in the Lodge. I have never heard of using a gun as a noisemaker during ANY ceremony (and I've seen them all, time after time).

I am interested in what the Grand Lodge of New York has to say about this incident....and they will, I'm certain.

I do join in grieving over the loss of a Brother.

As to "gun control", I am adamantly opposed to it. At "best", this is an example of irresponsible MISUSE of a firearm, and should be dealt with as such, especially as it caused the untimely death of a man.

streetsoldier wrote:As to "gun control", I am adamantly opposed to it. At "best", this is an example of irresponsible MISUSE of a firearm, and should be dealt with as such, especially as it caused the untimely death of a man.

So true! To have had the gun at the initiation was bad enough. To fire it near a person's head -- also a major problem. But to be so stupid as to point it AT his head and then pull the trigger?

I don't own a firearm myself (of course, I live in TX and most of my friends all own guns including a couple of them who are Dems), although I do carry a weapon. I'm all for an adult's right to own and carry one, as long as he or she is responsible with it and trained to use it properly (just like with a car). When an adult, be it the parent or whoever, is not responsible enough to keep it out of the hands of children, then I have an issue with it.

I don't own a firearm myself (of course, I live in TX and most of my friends all own guns including a couple of them who are Dems), although I do carry a weapon. I'm all for an adult's right to own and carry one, as long as he or she is responsible with it and trained to use it properly (just like with a car). When an adult, be it the parent or whoever, is not responsible enough to keep it out of the hands of children, then I have an issue with it.

I don't own one either, but I do think that anyone that wants to own one should be trained on how to use it ( I think it should be mandatory). I also agree with background checks.

I have no problem with firearms being owned by law abiding, responsible citizens. I do have a problem with criminals as well as people who abuse alcohol or drugs having them. Also some kind of training should be mandatory as it is my experience that many ppl who own handguns couldnt hit the broad side of a barn.

Private ownership of guns is the last line of defense against a totalitarian government. It could happen, especially with the direction that this country is taking.

Bingo coriolis, I have an uneasy feeling. If there is civil unrest near the election then we might need to have a serious chat.

BEER980 wrote:Bingo coriolis, I have an uneasy feeling. If there is civil unrest near the election then we might need to have a serious chat.

What the heck are you guys trying to say? A civil war is going to breakout over the elections? This country is polarized but I can't see something like that happening.

I do not currently own a gun but have in the past and will agiain in the future. I firmly believe that it is every American's right to do so in spite of the attempts to change the words of our founding fathers. I do however believe that certain gun control issues should be addressed. I have no problem with requiring background checks and basic firearms training. An untrained person with a weapon is a danger to themselves and others. On the other side, I think the bans against certain type of 'military" type weapons are stupid. A guns look has no determination on how a gun is used. It's just an attempt to remove gun ownership under the guise of protecting the public.

Cant see a Civil War happening...i dont condone that kind of crap anyway. As citizens we have the power to change our government peacefully.

I think that we'll get past this election without any serious unrest. But the trends are unmistakable: the gradual trend towards socialization. This country is undoubtedly changing. Each incremental step seems justified at the time. The overall result will be a country totally different than we have known. The USA is not immune to the forces of history. Empires and nations rise and fall. The only questions are "when" and whether we go out with a bang or a wimper.

Stephanie wrote: What the heck are you guys trying to say? A civil war is going to breakout over the elections? This country is polarized but I can't see something like that happening.

That would be the idea and the start of something that will affect us all. I have been going over some info and several things seem to have been predicted. Lets just say if it does come true then stock up.

If any war starts it would be between those folks that are anti-government vs those that are pro government. But it'd be a quick war. Lol this is getting weird...i doubt war in all seriousness though! I was just giving a worst case scenario...

coriolis wrote:Private ownership of guns is the last line of defense against a totalitarian government. It could happen, especially with the direction that this country is taking.

"AMEN, AMEN and AMEN!" You hit the nail on the head Ed! As the old saying goes...."They can take my gun when they pry it from my cold, dead hand!" Guns don't kill people, people kill people! I own SEVERAL weapons, 2 sidearms, numerous rifles, shotguns....

Dennis

I believe in gun control... Holding the gun with BOTH hands!!!