ATL: IKE Discussion

[txwatcher91]

Look at this loop
Clouds near the center rotating much slower than the clouds around it. Weirod.

Wow that is bizarre. Humm my totally noneducated thoughts is this will cause the windfield to continue to expand? I usually am pretty confident on what I'm seeing on most storms but this whole set up is so unusual it has me stumped. The hurricane is just not acting like a normal storm. The core is just... as you said WEIROD!

That's leftover convective debris from the old inner eye, which has pretty much collapsed. That's why it's not rotating as fast as the clouds outside of that radius. If that debris were to clear out, you would see quite clearly the new, larger eye.

I don't know about you, but I expect to see Ike's new and improved eye tomorrow afternoon at the latest.

[fasterdisaster]

Look at this loop


Clouds near the center rotating much slower than the clouds around it. Weirod.

Wouldn't that be normal? It would be like the inside horse on a carousel go slower than the outside horse because it has to cover less distance in the same amount of time?

I don't think so cause the way I heard it was a ballerina spinning with her arms closer together will go faster so the inside goes faster. It doesn't matter though because those clouds I'm pretty sure are the eye.

[Sihara]

This is made more complicated if they have pets who would not do well if separated from their owners. Unfortunately, if they stay in high risk areas they may find themselves separated only to come together on "rainbow bridge".

Both fear and ignorance are great paralyzers and I suppose many are suffering from one or both. IMHO, very strong language from the highest authorities need to try to get through to those who are risking all by not leaving.

Lynn, this nearly happened in my family - wouldn't leave for a storm because of the pets. I would think the best thing to do - won't do much good now, but for future ref - at the beginning of hurricane season, find a vet, kennel or something and make arrangements for them to take the pets on short notice - someplace inland and out of harm's way.

Doesn't help though that fear does paralyze, and as someone pointed out earlier in the thread, people in these areas, TX and LA have hurricane fatigue. OMG it has to wear you down when the storms keep coming.

[Wthrman13]

Look at this loop


Clouds near the center rotating much slower than the clouds around it. Weirod.

Wouldn't that be normal? It would be like the inside horse on a carousel go slower than the outside horse because it has to cover less distance in the same amount of time?

What you are talking about is solid body rotation. A hurricane vortex *approximates* (key word here is approximate) what is known as a Rankine combined vortex. In this kind of vortex, outside the radius of maximum winds, the winds increase rapidly as you move inward. Once you reach the RMW, the winds drop off toward the center of the storm, in such a fashion that the fluid inside the RMW rotates like a solid body (like a carousel, as you mentioned). Looking at Ike now, the area near the center of the storm where the clouds appear to be rotating more slowly than those around it is that solid-body rotation region inside the RMW.

[HURAKAN]

[shah8]

that's backwards logic RL3AO.

A point on the inside of the circle is matched to a point further along the radius. The far point has to travel further in distance to achieve the same number of degree traveled on the circumference as the inside point. Thus, the far point has to travel faster to remain aligned with the inside point.

If a point on the inside is markedly slower than a point on the outside, that implies that the strongest winds are well away from the eye, since the outside point is faster than it has to be to match the inside point.

[tolakram]

What you are talking about is solid body rotation. A hurricane vortex *approximates* (key word here is approximate) what is known as a Rankine combined vortex. In this kind of vortex, outside the radius of maximum winds, the winds increase rapidly as you move inward. Once you reach the RMW, the winds drop off toward the center of the storm, in such a fashion that the fluid inside the RMW rotates like a solid body (like a carousel, as you mentioned). Looking at Ike now, the area near the center of the storm where the clouds appear to be rotating more slowly than those around it is that solid-body rotation region inside the RMW.

Closer look at the 'eye'. Look quick before it gets dark. Quite impressive, unfortunately.

http://rammb.cira.colostate.edu/ramsdis ... ible_float

[fasterdisaster]

This is made more complicated if they have pets who would not do well if separated from their owners. Unfortunately, if they stay in high risk areas they may find themselves separated only to come together on "rainbow bridge".

Both fear and ignorance are great paralyzers and I suppose many are suffering from one or both. IMHO, very strong language from the highest authorities need to try to get through to those who are risking all by not leaving.

A lot of hotels, at least in Florida, will let you keep pets if you've been evacuated, and even if for whatever reason I can't find one I usually do fine camping out in the car and buying whatever meals I need. I just make sure to bring a lot of bottled water though. Usually though I can find a hotel that lets you keep pets.

[Wthrman13]

that's backwards logic RL3AO.

A point on the inside of the circle is matched to a point further along the radius. The far point has to travel further in distance to achieve the same number of degree traveled on the circumference as the inside point. Thus, the far point has to travel faster to remain aligned with the inside point.

If a point on the inside is markedly slower than a point on the outside, that implies that the strongest winds are well away from the eye, since the outside point is faster than it has to be to match the inside point.

RL3AO was right and saying the same thing you are (read his post again, carefully), but what he was talking about applies only to the winds *inside* the RMW. Outside the RMW, the winds increase rapidly as you move towards the RMW from the outside (i.e. the fluid does not behave like a solid body).

[Pebbles]

That's leftover convective debris from the old inner eye, which has pretty much collapsed. That's why it's not rotating as fast as the clouds outside of that radius. If that debris were to clear out, you would see quite clearly the new, larger eye.

Thanks for explaination. Hum not sure why I didn't pick that up as what was happening as I've seen plenty of ERC's over the years. This has to be the slowest ERC ever though (ok some exaggerating a tad) ...

[fasterdisaster]

Anyone else think he doesn't look quite as lopsided?

[LAwxrgal]

Question, my sister is in Humble (N of Houston) and is talking about staying. Should she?

[Tireman4]

I am. I have stayed before. I will stay now.

[wx247]

Okay, I am watching KHOU's live coverage and they are reporting that the city of Galveston has moved its emergency operations center to the San Luis hotel. This hotel sits right along the beach according to live shots. I realize there is a seawall and that the hotel is 20 feet high, but to me that seems silly. Thoughts?

[HarlequinBoy]

Question, my sister is in Humble (N of Houston) and is talking about staying. Should she?

My very good friend lives in Humble and she is staying. I think it's okay to stay there, but at least prepare very well.

She hasn't even boarded up or anything!

[LAwxrgal]

Question, my sister is in Humble (N of Houston) and is talking about staying. Should she?

My very good friend lives in Humble and she is staying. I think it's okay to stay there, but at least prepare very well.

She hasn't even boarded up or anything!

Whoa. I'd have at least boarded up.

I was there for Gustav, but now I'm back home. We just got power back on!

[Tireman4]

Me neither. It will be a rough ride, but if you are prepared, have the essentials, and pick up things out of your yard, just ride it out.

[fasterdisaster]

Okay, I am watching KHOU's live coverage and they are reporting that the city of Galveston has moved its emergency operations center to the San Luis hotel. This hotel sits right along the beach according to live shots. I realize there is a seawall and that the hotel is 20 feet high, but to me that seems silly. Thoughts?

Absolutely idiotic.

[MHurricanes]

I just cannot believe how big this storm is! Tropical force winds extend out 275 miles?! That's insane!

We just received another downpour, and we live in Seminole County, Fla. This storm is huge.

- MHurricanes

[wxman57]

Question, my sister is in Humble (N of Houston) and is talking about staying. Should she?

At worst, the power will be out from a few days to a few weeks. There are no surge issues in Humble. If there are any large trees near her home, then they could fall on top of her house. If she's ok with that, then no reason to flee. Just hunker down.