TC George: preliminary report issued

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HURAKAN
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#121 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:39 pm

AussieMark wrote:
Extremeweatherguy wrote:strange how gusts to 175kph (roughly 109mph) can be considered a category 3 in Australia. In the United States that would be a category two storm...if even (since that is gusts and not sustained). None the less, that is still a very impressive storm for being that far inland!


As I have said USA has a scale

we have a scale

deal with it being different

its not like we say this is a category X on the US scale so its nothing to worry about :lol:


Both scales are valid and both must be respected and followed. Criticizing one or the other doesn’t make sense. As you live by rules and learn the rules that must be follow, then learn the scales and obey them, not criticize them.
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#122 Postby AussieMark » Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:43 pm

exactly

sorry if I seem like I am getting testy today just sick of all the criticisms of the AUS scale being different to US scale today thats all.

i.e comments like this would only be a category 1 on the US scale.

Just get sick of reading it thats all
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#123 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:55 pm

AussieMark wrote:exactly

sorry if I seem like I am getting testy today just sick of all the criticisms of the AUS scale being different to US scale today thats all.

i.e comments like this would only be a category 1 on the US scale.

Just get sick of reading it thats all


When we learn something and don't know anything else we think that what we have is the best available. When I was a young boy in Cuba and I didn't know the lifestyle in the US or any other part of the world I though Cuba was the best place to live. Some wars are fough because of differences in religion or culture, one wants to be superior to the other. We must understand that all the different cultures in the world live under the same sky and in the same little blue ball that goes around an average star in the Main Sequence in an average Galaxy in some part of the infinite Universe. For society to step forward we must understand each other and cooperate with each other, not kill each other, or a few nuclear bombs will end the human race.
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#124 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:59 pm

TROPICAL CYCLONE ADVICE NUMBER 58
Issued at 12:45 pm WDT on Friday, 9 March 2007
BY THE BUREAU OF METEOROLOGY
TROPICAL CYCLONE WARNING CENTRE PERTH

A CYCLONE WARNING for a SEVERE CATEGORY 3 cyclone is now current for coastal
areas from Roebourne to Wallal and inland to Tom Price, Newman,
Paraburdoo, Marble Bar and Nullagine, the northeast Gascoyne and northern
Goldfields

At noon WDT Severe Tropical Cyclone George was estimated to be
170 kilometres north northwest of Newman and
145 kilometres east northeast of Tom Price
and moving south southeast at 13 kilometres per hour.

Severe Tropical Cyclone George is moving south southeastwards over inland parts
of the Pilbara. VERY DESTRUCTIVE winds are still possible near the track during
this afternoon although the cyclone is slowly weakening as it moves further
inland.

The system is currently 190 kilometres south of Port Hedland where DAMAGING
winds with gusts to 110 kilometres per hour are expected to ease over the next
few hours as the system moves further away.

DESTRUCTIVE winds with gusts up to 170 kilometres per hour are likely to extend
further inland near the path towards Newman later today.

GALES with wind gusts to 110 kilometres per hour are expected through the
remaining parts of the warning area today.

WIDESPREAD HEAVY RAIN and FLOODING are likely across the Pilbara, with
widespread falls in excess of 200 millimetres likely. Falls of 100 millimetres
or more could produce localised flooding in the northeast Gascoyne and northern
Goldfields on Saturday.

Severe Tropical Cyclone George earlier crossed the coast at 10 pm just to the
east of Port Hedland with VERY DESTRUCTIVE wind gusts to 275 kilometres per
hour. Port Hedland experienced the western side of the VERY DESTRUCTIVE core of
the cyclone between 10pm and 1am.

Details of Severe Tropical Cyclone George at noon WDT.

Location of centre : within 35 kilometres of
latitude 22.0 south longitude 119.0 east
Recent movement : south southeast at 13 kilometres per hour
Central Pressure : 954 hectopascals
Maximum wind gusts : 175 kilometres per hour near the centre.
Severity category : 3

FESA-State Emergency Service advises of the following alerts.
RED ALERT: People in or near communities of Newman, Auski, Whim Creek, Pardoo,
Marble Bar, Yandeyarra, West Angeles, Tom Price, Paraburdoo and Nullagine should
move to shelter.
YELLOW ALERT: People in or near the community of Jigalong should be taking
action in preparation for the cyclone's impact.
ALL CLEAR WITH CAUTION: People in or near Port Hedland are advised that the Red
Alert has been lifted and they can PROCEED WITH CAUTION.
The next advice will be issued by 2:00 pm WDT Friday 09 March.

Cyclone advices and State Emergency Service Community Alerts are available by
dialling 1300 659 210

A map showing the track of the cyclone is available at:
http://www.bom.gov.au/weather/wa/cyclone
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.....

#125 Postby HurricaneHunter914 » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:00 pm

Any damage reports yet?
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Re: .....

#126 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:02 pm

HurricaneHunter914 wrote:Any damage reports yet?


Cyclone kills three, causes widespread damage


09Mar07

At least three people are believed to have died when category four Cyclone George slammed into Western Australia's north overnight, says Premier Alan Carpenter.

Mr Carpenter also said a number of people had been injured, some seriously, when the cyclone struck a mining construction camp about 100km south of Port Hedland.

``We have three unconfirmed fatalities at the moment,'' he told reporters.

``We also know there are a number of people who are injured, some of them severely injured.''

It's believed many of the injuries occurred when portable buildings rolled over. Earlier, emergency services said they were expecting ``lots of injuries'' and were preparing to fly rescuers to the Fortescue Metals Group (FMG) rail construction camp.

But rescue attempts were being hampered by continuing strong winds as the cyclone moved south.

WA fire and emergency services spokesman Allen Gale said earlier it was possible more than one person had died at the mining camp, where people live in transportable homes.

``It's certainly possible because they're talking about quite a degree of damage,'' he told Sky News.

``Lots of injuries ... we're expecting multiples, more than one ... five 10, 15 injuries,'' Mr Gale said.

``There's hundreds of people in these camps. We understand there's over 300 people in one of the camps, 200 people in another camp, another 300 in another camp.

``These camps are pretty well built. The community up here is very resilient and is used to storms affecting .... but to take a direct hit like this - if all the conditions come together at the wrong time then things can happen.''

Cyclone George crossed the coast east of Port Hedland about 10pm (WDT) last night, tearing off roofs, mangling fences, downing trees over power lines and cutting off power and phone services to most local towns.

The severe tropical cyclone gusted with destructive winds of up to 275km/h, according to the Bureau of Meteorology (BOM), affecting Port Hedland, South Hedland, Wedgefield and some outlying towns.

Mr Gale said rescuers were preparing to fly to the 300-person Fortescue camp, but would have to wait for conditions to ease further before making the journey in a specially designed helicopter.

Mr Gale said other camps and remote communities may also have been severely affected by the cyclone.

``There's also stations along the way as well and also isolated indigenous communities have been affected overnight,'' he told Sky News.

``There's more than just the one location that we're still trying to get information from.

``Communications are affected in some of those areas so it may take a day or so before we can get helicopters out there and actually do a total reconnaissance before we have a full picture.''

In Port Hedland, there were reports of widespread damage.

SES Port Hedland manager Derek Jones said reports of damage were just starting to come in but the full extent would not be known until conditions calmed and it was safe for crews to properly assess the stricken areas.

Homes had had roofs torn off and fences and power lines had been brought down, he said.

``We'll have teams out and about as soon as we're mobile,'' he said.

``At this stage we ask residents to stay inside until it's all clear.

The cyclone was today moving over inland parts of the Pilbara, south of Port Hedland, towards Yandeyarra and West Angeles, and the weather bureau warned destructive winds were possible.

A red alert has been issued with people in or near coastal areas of Port Hedland, Whim Creek, Pardoo, Marble Bar and Nullagine urged to move to shelter.

The weather bureau has warned wind gusts of up to 150km/h remain possible for Port Hedland during today.

Cyclone George was this morning 150km south of Port Hedland, the weather bureau said, and was expected to weaken to a category one cyclone later today.

Hundreds of people were evacuated yesterday from low lying areas of the Pilbara as West Australian communities braced for the onslaught of the powerful cyclone.

http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au/art ... _news.html
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#127 Postby Chacor » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:24 pm

I'm amazed it's still a Cat 3 STC that far inland.
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#128 Postby Extremeweatherguy » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:40 pm

Addressed to some of the above posts regarding my original comment on the last page:

For the record...I never said I thought the U.S. scale was a better one or that this storm is not a bad one. In fact, I don't think these things at all. I am just not used to other scales, and that is why I thought it was a bit odd at first. In reality though (after looking into it more), I think I might actually like the Australian scale a bit better. Hurricanes/Cyclones/Typhoons being categorized by top gusts seems like a much better idea than being categorized by sustained winds (IMO). It is the gusts that usually do the most wind damage.
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#129 Postby AussieMark » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:18 am

Sorry for attacking you :oops:
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#130 Postby Matt-hurricanewatcher » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:29 am

I just said that it did not take into account of storms over 100 or so knots. This is a tropical cyclone discussion board, so I thought it was alright to discuse the scales, but I guest i was wrong. There is no need to get mad or think its attack at anything. Its just differences in options.
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#131 Postby Chacor » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:34 am

IDW24100
Australian Government Bureau of Meteorology
Western Australia

Media: Transmitters serving the inland central Pilbara are requested to sound
the Standard Emergency Warning Signal before broadcasting the following warning.

TOP PRIORITY

TROPICAL CYCLONE ADVICE NUMBER 60
Issued at 2:25 pm WDT on Friday, 9 March 2007
BY THE BUREAU OF METEOROLOGY
TROPICAL CYCLONE WARNING CENTRE PERTH

A CYCLONE WARNING for a SEVERE CATEGORY 3 cyclone is now current for coastal
areas from Roebourne to Wallal and inland to Tom Price, Newman, Paraburdoo,
Marble Bar and Nullagine, the northeast Gascoyne and northern Goldfields

At 2:00 pm WDT Severe Tropical Cyclone George was estimated to be
145 kilometres north northwest of Newman and
170 kilometres east northeast of Tom Price
and moving southeast at 13 kilometres per hour.

Severe Tropical Cyclone George is moving southeastwards over inland parts of the
Pilbara. VERY DESTRUCTIVE winds are still possible near the track during this
afternoon although the cyclone is slowly weakening as it moves further inland.

DESTRUCTIVE winds with gusts up to 170 kilometres per hour are likely to extend
further inland near the path towards Newman later today.

GALES with wind gusts to 110 kilometres per hour over the central and eastern
Pilbara may extend into the northeast Gascoyne tonight and into the northern
Goldfields on Saturday.

WIDESPREAD HEAVY RAIN with totals of 100 to 200 millimetres have fallen in the
Pilbara and falls of 50 to 100 millimetres are likely to extend along the
cyclone track into the northern Goldfields on Saturday.

Severe Tropical Cyclone George crossed the coast at 10 pm Thursday just to the
east of Port Hedland with VERY DESTRUCTIVE wind gusts to 275 kilometres per
hour. Port Hedland experienced the western side of the VERY DESTRUCTIVE core of
the cyclone between 10pm and 1am.

Details of Severe Tropical Cyclone George at 2:00 pm WDT.

Location of centre : within 35 kilometres of
latitude 22.1 south longitude 119.3 east
Recent movement : southeast at 13 kilometres per hour
Central Pressure : 954 hectopascals
Maximum wind gusts : 175 kilometres per hour near the centre.
Severity category : 3

FESA-State Emergency Service advises of the following alerts.
RED ALERT: People in or near communities of Newman, Auski, Marble Bar,
Yandeyarra, West Angeles, Tom Price, Paraburdoo and Nullagine should move to
shelter.
YELLOW ALERT: People in or near the community of Jigalong should be taking
action in preparation for the cyclone's impact.
ALL CLEAR WITH CAUTION: People in or near Port Hedland, Whim Creek and Pardoo
are advised that the Red Alert has been lifted and they can PROCEED WITH
CAUTION.
The next advice will be issued by 4:00 pm WDT Friday 09 March.
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#132 Postby Matt-hurricanewatcher » Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:02 am

One last word, if we Americans defended our systems and country like the Aussies defend theres. We would be a lot stronger and better off. That just a option. I personally feel that it was near cat4 when it made landfall.
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#133 Postby AussieMark » Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:22 am

Matt-hurricanewatcher wrote:I just said that it did not take into account of storms over 100 or so knots. This is a tropical cyclone discussion board, so I thought it was alright to discuse the scales, but I guest i was wrong. There is no need to get mad or think its attack at anything. Its just differences in options.


Discussion is ok but an all out attack I will venemously defend our system against which is what you have been guilty of not just today but in the past also

Matt-hurricanewatcher wrote:
CrazyC83 wrote:I'm no fan of the Australian scale. They call that a Category 2 cyclone when to us it is a high-end tropical storm. Gusts are almost impossible to measure accurately as well.


I agree totally they focus on tropical storms to cat2 like storms, then forget anything over 100 knots. Maybe there cyclones are not as strong, so they think they have no use for anything like Charley,Andrew,Ivan,Mitch,Wilma,Katrina,Hugo, like storms ect. But its there system. In yes some of there storms do get that powerful like Fay or Tracy. Monica, Ingrid.


Translation US scale is superior to the Australian scale and Australia should adopt the US scale as its superior. Thats basically what your are saying so how about we just drop all the false pre-tenses huh.
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#134 Postby AussieMark » Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:28 am

Matt-hurricanewatcher wrote:One last word, if we Americans defended our systems and country like the Aussies defend theres. We would be a lot stronger and better off. That just a option. I personally feel that it was near cat4 when it made landfall.


Thats a no brainer 99.9% of this board is US based.

the point I am making which u fail to acknowledge is that the australian cyclone scale has been in operation for years. And It works for us. Its for the public remember which makes it simple.

You are complaining that a category 2 on our scale is only a tropical storm on your scale.

I suppose since we are bring things to standard we could convert all your storms to the WMO standard of sustained 10 min winds which is how the cyclones in Australia are actually written up in best track ;)

Everyone does things different.

Just because they do it different to you does not make em wrong.
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#135 Postby HurricaneBill » Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:59 am

Now everybody kiss and make up.
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#136 Postby AussieMark » Fri Mar 09, 2007 2:26 am

I apologize from all this today can the mods delete my argumentative posts :oops:
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#137 Postby Rod Hagen » Fri Mar 09, 2007 2:41 am

HurricaneBill wrote:Now everybody kiss and make up.


And if you want a useful table for comparing the various scales used around the world, try http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_cyclone_scales

Now, if we could just get the Yanks to start using the WMO standard for sustained winds, and to speak metric, the world of cyclones / hurricanes/typhoons would become a much simpler place! ;-)

Joking guys. Cultural diversity is a fine thing IMHO, despite the occasional confusion that it causes!

Cheers

Rod
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#138 Postby Rod Hagen » Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:46 am

Mmm. Just by the way, why does the US regard a piddling one minute average speed puff as a "sustained" wind, when the rest of the world calls anything under 10 minutes sustained a "gust"? ;-)

Anyone have the world recognised 10 minutes sustained figures for recent US cyclones? (er , sorry, typhoons, er, hurricanes?) ;-)

Its a funny game, this. "Ours are bigger than yours" and vice versa, seems to all too often be the essence of it, despite very dubious calculation processes. Let's spare at least a few minutes thought for the people whose lives have been turned upside down, or lost altogether, in the last twenty four hours in Western Australia!

Cheers

Rod
Last edited by Rod Hagen on Fri Mar 09, 2007 5:08 am, edited 3 times in total.
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#139 Postby Chacor » Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:58 am

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/6433319.stm
Cyclone batters western Australia

At least three people are feared dead and up to 20 injured, after a powerful cyclone hit north-west Australia.

Cyclone George packed winds of up to 280km/h (170 mph), damaging homes and disrupting power in the remote town of Port Hedland.

A local mining company closed its iron ore operations, and some offshore oil production was also suspended.

Officials say the cyclone is the worst storm to hit the region since Cyclone Vance in 1999.

Cyclone George, which forecasters said may have been a maximum level five storm as it crossed the coast, hit a mine construction camp owned by Fortescue Metals Group, based about 100km (62 miles) south of Port Hedland.

It destroyed many temporary housing units at the camp, where workers were staying while building a railway.

At least one person is known to have died, but Western Australia Premier Alan Carpenter said there were unconfirmed reports that three people had been killed at the site.

An emergency team has recently been able to reach the camp and evacuate the injured, according to the metals company, but rescue attempts are still being hampered by continuing strong winds.

The storm also tore off roofs, felled trees and cut power lines to at least three towns in the area, according to emergency officials.

"We had our patio start to lift, we had fences being pushed over, trees being snapped, everything flying around," Port Hedland resident Steve Fitzgibbon told a local radio programme.

Cyclones are a regular feature in northern Australia during the summer months.

Cyclone Tracy killed 65 people in the northern city of Darwin in 1974.
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#140 Postby Matt-hurricanewatcher » Fri Mar 09, 2007 5:25 am

I don't know what to say.
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