Tropical Depression forms by 8/21/21z

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senorpepr
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#21 Postby senorpepr » Fri Aug 19, 2005 7:22 pm

TPACane04 wrote:Senor, I understand your piece, but understand that I (and probably others)have trouble with someone banging this kind of prediction out there and potentially basing it on theories only a PhD can appreciate...we have excellent Mets on here who deal in reality, synoptics, sat presentations, etc. Even Watkins has struggled this week with TD10 and I respect his game as much as anyone on the board.

I could throw something up here that says I am a renowned psychic and predict "such and such" based on a dream I had last night, and would get blasted off the board...

nuff said, I will be back Sunday night to serve or enjoy some yummy crow.


I understand that many do not understand the connection for which Jim is mentioning. To be very honest, it isn't a field that I'm very comfortable with simply because of a lack of experience. That wasn't what my post was about.

The fact of the matter is, he is basing it off of meteorological theories which he's sited before. There is a huge difference between basing something on a unique, underinvestigated meteorological theory and basing something on a hunch. Jim, however, is basing on the former.

Furthermore, Jim's theories are just that -- theories. So is much of the meteorological community. There is little in meteorology that isn't based on theory. Some theories are more contraversial than others, such as the continuous polar front theory. Regardless, some theories are more studied than others. The affects of solar activity to the realm of tropics has hardly been studied when compared to other fields. In addition, even the topic of solar weather is by far underexplored when compared to the other fields.

My point is, however, that you and others shouldn't blast Jim on his theories when he has provided support. It doesn't matter whether or not only a PhD could appreciate it, it's the fact that he does have support. When someone bases a forecast on a hunch, that isn't supported.

Instead of calling his forecasts "bathroom reading," either investigate the points he's provided that supports his forecast and then debate it or... pipe down and move on.
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Re: Tropical Depression forms by 8/21/21z

#22 Postby Jim Hughes » Fri Aug 19, 2005 7:26 pm

mahicks wrote:
Jim Hughes wrote:We will be seeing a tropical depression form with the next couple of days....by 21/21z at the latest within the Atlantic basin. The former remnants of TD10 currently looks like the logical choice.

I am basing this on some matters that I have talked about in the past. A couple of other areas around the globe also seem to be picking up.

I spoke about it yesterday to donsoutherland1 in the Tropical Analysis forum

TD10: Initial thoughts

phpbb2/viewtopics.php?t=70471


Jim


Even though I agree, I give it an extra day or so...AND Yes, I think it will be Ex 10 that does it...

But can you plz use a disclaimer before I need a fire extinguisher to put out the flames??



Yes you are 100 % right and I screwed up by not positing the disclaimer first. I noticed that earlier this evening and I meant to send a PM to the hosts apologizing for this miscue.

I thought about editing the thread but then everyone could come back later and say that I changed something.


Jim
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Re: Tropical Depression forms by 8/21/21z

#23 Postby mahicks » Fri Aug 19, 2005 7:42 pm

Jim Hughes wrote:
mahicks wrote:
Jim Hughes wrote:We will be seeing a tropical depression form with the next couple of days....by 21/21z at the latest within the Atlantic basin. The former remnants of TD10 currently looks like the logical choice.

I am basing this on some matters that I have talked about in the past. A couple of other areas around the globe also seem to be picking up.

I spoke about it yesterday to donsoutherland1 in the Tropical Analysis forum

TD10: Initial thoughts

phpbb2/viewtopics.php?t=70471


Jim


Even though I agree, I give it an extra day or so...AND Yes, I think it will be Ex 10 that does it...

But can you plz use a disclaimer before I need a fire extinguisher to put out the flames??



Yes you are 100 % right and I screwed up by not positing the disclaimer first. I noticed that earlier this evening and I meant to send a PM to the hosts apologizing for this miscue.

I thought about editing the thread but then everyone could come back later and say that I changed something.


Jim


LOL....Thats a good reason, and with the way things have been going lately, your probably right!

Don't worry, I'll be your personal fire-fighter :-)
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Re: Tropical Depression forms by 8/21/21z

#24 Postby mvtrucking » Fri Aug 19, 2005 8:04 pm

Yes you are 100 % right and I screwed up by not positing the disclaimer first. I noticed that earlier this evening and I meant to send a PM to the hosts apologizing for this miscue.

I thought about editing the thread but then everyone could come back later and say that I changed something.


Jim[/quote]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jim, I find this stuff very interesting and appreciate your posts. Thanks.


mv
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#25 Postby T-man » Sat Aug 20, 2005 8:59 pm

:eek:
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#26 Postby Brent » Sat Aug 20, 2005 9:06 pm

97L might make it...
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#27 Postby Jim Hughes » Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:11 pm

Brent wrote:97L might make it...


The NHC hardly ever upgrades anything coming off of Africa that quick. I would like to know what TD formed the closest to Africa ...Coordinates

I recall Issac forming rather close to it several years ago but I know there has to be a TD that formed closer to it then him. Without a doubt...

I am leaving for the eastern shore early tomorrow for a few days so I will have to catch the TWC tropical update to see if anything forms by 21z.

I am sure that some sharp jabs will be sent my way ...and maybe rightly so...if nothing forms. I'll be back though...you can count on that.


Jim
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#28 Postby wxmann_91 » Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:15 pm

The NHC hardly ever upgrades anything coming off of Africa that quick. I would like to know what TD formed the closest to Africa ...Coordinates


Jeanne in 1998 formed at 20W.
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#29 Postby WeatherEmperor » Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:17 pm

Jim Hughes wrote:
Brent wrote:97L might make it...


The NHC hardly ever upgrades anything coming off of Africa that quick. I would like to know what TD formed the closest to Africa ...Coordinates

I recall Issac forming rather close to it several years ago but I know there has to be a TD that formed closer to it then him. Without a doubt...

I am leaving for the eastern shore early tomorrow for a few days so I will have to catch the TWC tropical update to see if anything forms by 21z.

I am sure that some sharp jabs will be sent my way ...and maybe rightly so...if nothing forms. I'll be back though...you can count on that.


Jim


Not necessarily. Remember Dora from 1964? If you dont, check the link I posted below. It showed Dora forming at the coast of Africa at like 17/18W. To take it one step further it ended up hitting FL. Weird.

<RICKY>

http://weather.unisys.com/hurricane/atl ... /track.gif
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#30 Postby Jim Hughes » Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:34 pm

[Not necessarily. Remember Dora from 1964? If you dont, check the link I posted below. It showed Dora forming at the coast of Africa at like 17/18W. To take it one step further it ended up hitting FL. Weird.

<RICKY>

http://weather.unisys.com/hurricane/atl ... /track.gif[/quote]

Thanks. She did form very close. I figured someone probably already knew who it was. Either that or they could come up with a closer storm.


Jim
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#31 Postby Matt-hurricanewatcher » Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:39 pm

This is a banding monsoon system. Like most Eastern Pacific system it will take a few days to wrap.
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#32 Postby BUD » Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:51 pm

Jim Hughes wrote:
Brent wrote:97L might make it...


The NHC hardly ever upgrades anything coming off of Africa that quick. I would like to know what TD formed the closest to Africa ...Coordinates

I recall Issac forming rather close to it several years ago but I know there has to be a TD that formed closer to it then him. Without a doubt...

I am leaving for the eastern shore early tomorrow for a few days so I will have to catch the TWC tropical update to see if anything forms by 21z.

I am sure that some sharp jabs will be sent my way ...and maybe rightly so...if nothing forms. I'll be back though...you can count on that.




Not to sure check out Hugo track


Jim
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#33 Postby DAVE440 » Sun Aug 21, 2005 2:52 am

Well...if something forms I seriously doubt it will be
"the depression formerly known as.... TD10"

Was looking earlier and didnt really see the mid level circulation
on PR radar NHC was talking about. Did see some convection tho
at those co-ordinates. Now ....few hours later...just an open center
and completely quiet where there were storms. Unless conditions get REALLY favorable REAL QUICK...nothings gonna happen... not even tropical rain showers.

That CV disturbance looks interesting! Big old blob with some nice
convection popping. This could be something very shortly.
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#34 Postby sma10 » Sun Aug 21, 2005 3:03 am

Jim Hughes wrote:
The NHC hardly ever upgrades anything coming off of Africa that quick. I would like to know what TD formed the closest to Africa ...Coordinates

I recall Issac forming rather close to it several years ago but I know there has to be a TD that formed closer to it then him. Without a doubt...



Kudos should definitely go to Jeanne (not last year's Jeanne, but 1998's version). I seem to recall she became a named storm around 20W and a hurricane at 25W
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#35 Postby Ixolib » Sun Aug 21, 2005 6:58 am

Today's the day. Will 97L be the one? 9 hours and counting...
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#36 Postby Jim Hughes » Sun Aug 21, 2005 7:58 am

Ixolib wrote:Today's the day. Will 97L be the one? 9 hours and counting...


Sort of seems like I am waiting on a firing squad. :wink:

I looked at some eastern Atlantic images a short ago.


http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/PS/TROP/trop-atl.html



97L starting to look better...nice spin might be developing......wishful speculation? I need it.

I leave within the hour....


Jim
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#37 Postby Ixolib » Sun Aug 21, 2005 8:12 am

It appears to me that your "speculation" may pan out after all.

Looks pretty good here and seems to be holding together - if not deepening.

If nothing else, convection is firing nicely...

http://cimss.ssec.wisc.edu/tropic/real-time/europe/movies/metirnhc/metirnhcjava.html
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#38 Postby Frank2 » Sun Aug 21, 2005 8:25 am

Several here have already mentioned that some models are forecasting this system to recurve early - even the TWO alluded to this, mentioning that it would "move generally westward".

Frank
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#39 Postby ts_kakolina » Sun Aug 21, 2005 8:31 am

The NHC hardly ever upgrades anything coming off of Africa that quick. I would like to know what TD formed the closest to Africa ...Coordinates


Anyone could check the first coordinates of this far east systems:

Date: 2-11 SEP 1951
Hurricane FOX
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.00 -20.00 09/02/18Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 18 AUG-2 SEP 1952
Hurricane ABLE
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 14.60 -19.00 08/18/06Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 28 AUG-9 SEP 1953
Hurricane CAROL
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 16.00 -20.50 08/28/06Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 2-24 SEP 1957
Hurricane CARRIE
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.00 -21.70 09/02/06Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 8-17 AUG 1958
Tropical Storm BECKY
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 15.30 -21.00 08/08/12Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 11-22 AUG 1958
Hurricane CLEO
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 10.80 -21.60 08/11/06Z 35 - TROPICAL STORM

Date: 29 AUG-14 SEP 1960
Hurricane DONNA
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 10.20 -21.50 08/29/18Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 28 AUG-16 SEP 1964
Hurricane DORA
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 14.00 -18.00 08/28/12Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 16 SEP-1 OCT 1965
Hurricane CAROL
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.30 -20.10 09/16/06Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 21 AUG-7 SEP 1966
Hurricane FAITH
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 12.90 -20.50 08/21/00Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 5-21 SEP 1967
Hurricane CHLOE
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 15.40 -20.30 09/05/00Z 30 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 11-19 SEP 1968
Tropical Storm EDNA
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 12.70 -21.10 09/11/18Z 25 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 25 AUG-4 SEP 1973
Tropical Storm CHRISTINE
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 11.00 -14.00 08/25/12Z 30 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 14-23 SEP 1973
Hurricane ELLEN
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 10.50 -22.40 09/14/12Z 30 - TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 29 AUG-15 SEP 1979
Hurricane FREDERIC
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 11.00 -25.50 08/29/06Z 25 1009 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 6-21 SEP 1980
Hurricane FRANCES
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 12.50 -19.00 09/06/00Z 25 1010 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 28 AUG-6 SEP 1982
Tropical Storm BERYL
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.70 -22.20 08/28/12Z 30 1008 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 16 SEP-2 OCT 1985
Hurricane GLORIA
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.30 -23.60 09/16/12Z 25 1009 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 8-20 SEP 1987
Tropical Storm DENNIS
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 10.80 -18.40 09/08/18Z 25 1012 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 10-25 SEP 1989
Hurricane HUGO
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.20 -20.00 09/10/12Z 25 1010 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 27 AUG-12 SEP 1995
Hurricane LUIS
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 11.30 -22.70 08/27/12Z 25 1010 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 19 AUG-6 SEP 1996
Hurricane EDOUARD
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 12.40 -19.90 08/19/18Z 25 1007 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 23 AUG-10 SEP 1996
Hurricane FRAN
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 14.00 -21.00 08/23/12Z 25 1012 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 15-29 SEP 1998
Hurricane GEORGES
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 9.00 -25.90 09/15/15Z 30 1006 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 21 SEP-4 OCT 1998
Hurricane JEANNE
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 9.60 -17.40 09/21/06Z 30 1008 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 19-31 AUG 1999
Hurricane CINDY
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 13.50 -18.90 08/19/00Z 30 1003 TROPICAL DEPRESSION

Date: 3-25 AUG 2000
Hurricane ALBERTO
ADV LAT LON TIME WIND PR STAT
1 10.80 -18.00 08/03/18Z 25 1007 TROPICAL DEPRESSION
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#40 Postby dwg71 » Sun Aug 21, 2005 11:54 am

Ixolib wrote:Today's the day. Will 97L be the one? 9 hours and counting...


4 hours left. Not gonna happen imo.
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