2005 Atlantic Tropical Cyclone Reports Discussion Thread

[southerngale]

The NHC and the officials here said that Rita was a cat. 3 when it first made landfall. Then nearly 6 months later in the Rita report, they still say it was a cat. 3 at landfall. I've seen damage pics from Rita, Katrina, and Wilma - no reason to think Rita wasn't a cat. 3, plus the NHC says it was. No offense, but I think I believe them. I've got no desire to debate this...just wanted to make that comment since a few people seem to think that the NHC has Rita too strong, while having Wilma too weak. Interesting...

[george_r_1961]

Derek I respect the fact that you are college trained but since it isnt possible to get a wind reading in every cubic inch of a storm it is often prudent to take into account the extent and the character of the damage when determining how strong a landfalling storm was. While im not college trained my 36 years of hurricane watching counts for something. After seeing the damage and video shot during the storm there has never been a doubt in my mind Rita was a Cat 3.

[Normandy]

There was a dropsonde of 137KT, now, that may have eben discounted, but if it ws deemed to be a gust and not representative of the sustained wind, Emily never should have been upgraded to a cat 5, since it has about the same level of evidence

and please, STOP USING DAMAGE TO DETERMINE A STORM'S CLASSIFICATION. WILMA WAS A HURRICANE, NOT A TORNADO

But 137 kts isnt cat5, i thought 140 was.

[f5]

There was a dropsonde of 137KT, now, that may have eben discounted, but if it ws deemed to be a gust and not representative of the sustained wind, Emily never should have been upgraded to a cat 5, since it has about the same level of evidence

and please, STOP USING DAMAGE TO DETERMINE A STORM'S CLASSIFICATION. WILMA WAS A HURRICANE, NOT A TORNADO

But 137 kts isnt cat5, i thought 140 was.

1 knot=1.15 mph

137 kts X 1.15=157.55

CAT 5 is 156+

[Derek Ortt]

Had there not have been 4 aircraft in Rita at the same time, I would be inclined to go with the idea that the max winds were not sampled. But 4 aircraft the afternoon before landfall not being able to find cat 3 winds is very revealing

As for Wilma, a recent seminar seems to indicate that I was wrong and that the 90% reduction also did not apply for that as the wind/precip field became more stratiform instead of convective, implying a larger storm, but a weaker one

[Derek Ortt]

as for the video, there is very few video of cat 3 winds, most is from the TS winds before the arrivial of the eye, or well away from the eye, like in the recent Larry video. That was not the 180 m.p.h. gusts

The video in Rita (that from Anderson Cooper) reminded me of what I went through on the roof of my office b (uilding during Katrina, borderline TS/cat 1 winds, with gusts approaching 100 m.p.h. But as we saw, that was still enough to DEVASTATE Texas (some other gusts were approaching 120 m.p.h. and sustained winds likely topped out near 85-90 using the 1.4 gust to sustained factor)

[southerngale]

as for the video, there is very few video of cat 3 winds, most is from the TS winds before the arrivial of the eye, or well away from the eye, like in the recent Larry video. That was not the 180 m.p.h. gusts

The video in Rita (that from Anderson Cooper) reminded me of what I went through on the roof of my office b (uilding during Katrina, borderline TS/cat 1 winds, with gusts approaching 100 m.p.h. But as we saw, that was still enough to DEVASTATE Texas (some other gusts were approaching 120 m.p.h. and sustained winds likely topped out near 85-90 using the 1.4 gust to sustained factor)

I have yet to see a video showing even the winds that I saw personally inland in Jasper. I don't know where George found that video. It hit in the middle of the night and there just aren't any good videos. Not to mention 90 something % evacuated, greatly decreasing the chance of amateur videos. If the videos you saw were similar to what you experienced in a borderline TS/cat. 1, I have no doubt you did not see the peak winds (I haven't). I've been here since I was able to return...a few weeks after Rita hit...I've seen the reports, stories, and eyewitness accounts from local officials. I have to go with what they say.

Regardless, it was devastating and I pray nothing comes close to us this year! We can't handle it....too much recovery to go.

[Derek Ortt]

yes, Rita was very devastating, be it a category 2 or a category 3 hurricane. However, as in the case of Katrina, the precise winds for each region should be determined so that we can improve our contstruction codes, so that we never see this type of damage (this also goes for Miami as well as Wilma should not have really damaged our city, and we had low-end cat 1 winds, but with cat 3 gusts)