2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2921 Postby Iceresistance » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:06 pm

aspen wrote:
Iceresistance wrote:https://twitter.com/BigJoeBastardi/status/1560197251787522048?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Why are we not factoring September through November? 2017 had a slow August until the later part of the month when Harvey regenerated in the GoM

August 2017 had two hurricanes, including one that was close to being a major, before Harvey’s first genesis. It was quite an active August all things considered, nothing like what this August has been like.

Guess I forgot Franklin. :P
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2922 Postby psyclone » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:17 pm

What a dreadfully boring season for weather watchers so far. Setting the bar high makes it easy to get hung out to dry. 2 days before the bell ring...it's time for the atlantic to either dance...or soon we give credit to club cancel. It's strangely hot and dry in mid florida. we actually need rain here...which is pretty much unheard of for mid August...
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2923 Postby skyline385 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:24 pm

Lightening the mood in here (or going to make it worse maybe)

 https://twitter.com/andyhazelton/status/1560308534532882438





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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2924 Postby Category5Kaiju » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:30 pm

Well this is looking interesting...to say the least.

All I am going to say is if this season actually does "bust," then you can bet that our fundamental understandings of warm MDR and La Nina being historically associated with helping the Atlantic enter active mode are going to have to be re-evaulated. Like, extensively. :D

*edit: genuinely curious here, but does anybody know exactly where's so much talk about dry air, and how abnormal this is? I would love to hear opinions on this as it seems like shear is not bad at all and the SAL is not terribly thick either; seems like everything is about this dry air stuff..
Last edited by Category5Kaiju on Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2925 Postby Steve » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:30 pm

WiscoWx02 wrote:I think out next best and only legit bet for development for the rest of August at this point is that area entering the BOC. Forget Africa honestly…Andy Hazelton and others are making it quite clear that at this point no favorable MJO is going to save chances of much happening out there on WxTwitter due to dry air and wave breaking and he’s usually pretty logical and good at what he does. I don’t really see these issues going away in September but October maybe/likely isn’t a lost cause…after 2020, 2018…I’ll never trust October again :cry:


Never can discount a low off the SE or Mid-Atlantic Coast either.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2926 Postby Patrick99 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:59 pm

psyclone wrote:What a dreadfully boring season for weather watchers so far. Setting the bar high makes it easy to get hung out to dry. 2 days before the bell ring...it's time for the atlantic to either dance...or soon we give credit to club cancel. It's strangely hot and dry in mid florida. we actually need rain here...which is pretty much unheard of for mid August...


Other than that pre-tropical storm in very early June, "rainy season" here on the SE FL coast never really got started.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2927 Postby WiscoWx02 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:30 pm

Steve wrote:
WiscoWx02 wrote:I think out next best and only legit bet for development for the rest of August at this point is that area entering the BOC. Forget Africa honestly…Andy Hazelton and others are making it quite clear that at this point no favorable MJO is going to save chances of much happening out there on WxTwitter due to dry air and wave breaking and he’s usually pretty logical and good at what he does. I don’t really see these issues going away in September but October maybe/likely isn’t a lost cause…after 2020, 2018…I’ll never trust October again :cry:


Never can discount a low off the SE or Mid-Atlantic Coast either.


That too…or November cough Eta/Iota cough. Maybe 2002 is what this season ends up being like. Yeah I know it isn’t El Nino but still…there are obviously other factors to consider other than ENSO now days.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2928 Postby NotSparta » Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:37 pm

Category5Kaiju wrote:Well this is looking interesting...to say the least.

All I am going to say is if this season actually does "bust," then you can bet that our fundamental understandings of warm MDR and La Nina being historically associated with helping the Atlantic enter active mode are going to have to be re-evaulated. Like, extensively. :D

*edit: genuinely curious here, but does anybody know exactly where's so much talk about dry air, and how abnormal this is? I would love to hear opinions on this as it seems like shear is not bad at all and the SAL is not terribly thick either; seems like everything is about this dry air stuff..


A couple of outliers mean a warm MDR and La Nina no longer correlate to active seasons? Yeah, not so sure of that one
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2929 Postby Ntxw » Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:40 pm

NotSparta wrote:
Category5Kaiju wrote:Well this is looking interesting...to say the least.

All I am going to say is if this season actually does "bust," then you can bet that our fundamental understandings of warm MDR and La Nina being historically associated with helping the Atlantic enter active mode are going to have to be re-evaulated. Like, extensively. :D

*edit: genuinely curious here, but does anybody know exactly where's so much talk about dry air, and how abnormal this is? I would love to hear opinions on this as it seems like shear is not bad at all and the SAL is not terribly thick either; seems like everything is about this dry air stuff..


A couple of outliers mean a warm MDR and La Nina no longer correlate to active seasons? Yeah, not so sure of that one


Contrary I would say if it ends up some lower than initial expectations then it would fall in line with what has happened before with 3rd year Nina's. Just broad-brushing Nina=very active and Nino=very inactive are not guaranteed statements. There are different variations of each and local patterns.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2930 Postby CyclonicFury » Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:47 pm

We usually see a lessening of mid-level dry air over the MDR in September, so even if it may not seem that way now, I'd be shocked if we don't have at least one Cape Verde type hurricane. We haven't even had any strong MDR activity in August the last few years. I still think the lid will come off, even if it is a bit delayed.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2931 Postby Hammy » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:01 pm

WiscoWx02 wrote:
Steve wrote:
WiscoWx02 wrote:I think out next best and only legit bet for development for the rest of August at this point is that area entering the BOC. Forget Africa honestly…Andy Hazelton and others are making it quite clear that at this point no favorable MJO is going to save chances of much happening out there on WxTwitter due to dry air and wave breaking and he’s usually pretty logical and good at what he does. I don’t really see these issues going away in September but October maybe/likely isn’t a lost cause…after 2020, 2018…I’ll never trust October again :cry:


Never can discount a low off the SE or Mid-Atlantic Coast either.


That too…or November cough Eta/Iota cough. Maybe 2002 is what this season ends up being like. Yeah I know it isn’t El Nino but still…there are obviously other factors to consider other than ENSO now days.


I'm still sticking to 1988 analog but this isn't entirely out of the question either--I don't recall who but somebody pointed out that the equatorial E Pacific is functionally in a Nino even if the rest of it isn't.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2932 Postby NotSparta » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:05 pm

Hammy wrote:
WiscoWx02 wrote:
Steve wrote:
Never can discount a low off the SE or Mid-Atlantic Coast either.


That too…or November cough Eta/Iota cough. Maybe 2002 is what this season ends up being like. Yeah I know it isn’t El Nino but still…there are obviously other factors to consider other than ENSO now days.


I'm still sticking to 1988 analog but this isn't entirely out of the question either--I don't recall who but somebody pointed out that the equatorial E Pacific is functionally in a Nino even if the rest of it isn't.


None of the Pacific is in a Nino, 3 and 1+2 have yet to rise above 0 this year

Image

Image
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2933 Postby skyline385 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:11 pm

Ok this will definitely cheer up some of the mood here. From todays weeklies:

Image
Image


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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2934 Postby SFLcane » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:20 pm

skyline385 wrote:Ok this will definitely cheer up some of the mood here. From todays weeklies:

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/f024db18b8bb95cb9cde6df95698ae93.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/a5ebd6bdf76b7b56f905591039beb112.jpg


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Well look at that! Can you post the TC strike probs
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2935 Postby skyline385 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:22 pm

SFLcane wrote:
skyline385 wrote:Ok this will definitely cheer up some of the mood here. From todays weeklies:

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/f024db18b8bb95cb9cde6df95698ae93.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/a5ebd6bdf76b7b56f905591039beb112.jpg


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Well look at that! Can you post the TC strike probs

Sure most of it seems to be concentrated on the east coast

Image
Image
Image


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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2936 Postby SFLcane » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:26 pm

skyline385 wrote:
SFLcane wrote:
skyline385 wrote:Ok this will definitely cheer up some of the mood here. From todays weeklies:

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/f024db18b8bb95cb9cde6df95698ae93.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/a5ebd6bdf76b7b56f905591039beb112.jpg


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Well look at that! Can you post the TC strike probs

Sure most of it seems to be concentrated on the east coast

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/b39ecf1fb321a173634db28524b4cff3.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/25e645c82ba8f0a8e5ae7925edfcbd4b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/1a4eec9812a62d131379f1c567006d03.jpg


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Climate models were useless this year claiming the caribbean was going to be the hot spot um how about no. Those are coming off near 20n wth is that lol. Looks very fishy to me but we will see.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2937 Postby SFLcane » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:28 pm

Who knows in reality there is no hot spot anywhere just plenty of dry air.
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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2938 Postby skyline385 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:30 pm

SFLcane wrote:
skyline385 wrote:
SFLcane wrote:
Well look at that! Can you post the TC strike probs

Sure most of it seems to be concentrated on the east coast

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/b39ecf1fb321a173634db28524b4cff3.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/25e645c82ba8f0a8e5ae7925edfcbd4b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220818/1a4eec9812a62d131379f1c567006d03.jpg


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Climate models were useless this year claiming the caribbean was going to be the hot spot um how about no. Those are coming off near 20n wth is that lol. Looks very fishy to me but we will see.

Well we still don’t know which one will prevail. The Euro has had an MDR bias all season which has busted multiple times and has over-deepened waves inland continuously as well (responsible for those 20N waves coming out).


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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2939 Postby SFLcane » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:45 pm

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Re: 2022 Indicators (SSTs/SAL/MSLP/Shear/Steering/Instability) and >Day 16 Models

#2940 Postby Category5Kaiju » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:47 pm

Hammy wrote:
WiscoWx02 wrote:
Steve wrote:
Never can discount a low off the SE or Mid-Atlantic Coast either.


That too…or November cough Eta/Iota cough. Maybe 2002 is what this season ends up being like. Yeah I know it isn’t El Nino but still…there are obviously other factors to consider other than ENSO now days.


I'm still sticking to 1988 analog but this isn't entirely out of the question either--I don't recall who but somebody pointed out that the equatorial E Pacific is functionally in a Nino even if the rest of it isn't.


1988 would have had a very wild and active September and October had it been in a +AMO imho; I agree, I do think that that is a decent analog, especially when considering how we *could* potentially see the big gun hurricanes after August it seems like (from what I can theorize, it makes sense if this season is a backloaded one; iirc, there was some talk last year about how active Augusts actually may not be conducive for above average seasons, and while 2021 did end up above average, considering its relatively active August, I think that it may have had the opportunity to be more active if its MJO/CCKW timing was a bit different, as aside from Larry and Sam, September and October were not all that crazy busy).

Also, I personally disagree that we are "functionally" in a Nino; that does not explain why the EPAC, while active, still failed to produce a swarm of major hurricanes (like what we saw in 2014 or 2018), and why the WPAC has been phenomenally silent. The behaviors of both basins are very much Nina-like.
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