Now the Whining Starts...

[HurriCat]

NO WAY IS THIS "POLITICAL"... but it will still show the differences in people...

I GUESS I must just be one heartless you-know-what, but now we are seeing a lot of people on TV, (bleeping) and moaning about "Where's FEMA? I don't have a thing!" and "They have lots of money, when is it getting here?"

I'm sorry, but I just get mad as heck at such helplessness and irresponsibility being shown by grown men and women. When it's someone standing there with children, I get even madder.

Listen up, I don't have much, and I sure don't make much. I'm not some "American Express" yuppie who just buys everything with no sweat. But starting with Charley, I learned that I have to have a PLAN. I owe it to myself and to my wife.

It really loaded up a credit card, but I quickly assembled two dang-good hurricane kits. I got a large tent and folding kennel cages for our cats. I got a few rolls of screen, heavy black plastic and things like a staple gun and hammer and nails. I got two extra-good water filters. I got one of those camp-toilets and supplies for it.

Next, I thought "What if..." and ran different scenarios in my head. Now, I have plans for all sorts of needs. If I need to leave, I know when to do so and where to go. I have extra gas cans and some cash socked away. If I'm staying, then I can board up and secure the property. If our house becomes unliveable, then we can camp out in relative comfort.

A lot of you won't like it, but I have firearms and am proficient in their use. I am a responsible owner and keep them secure. We will not be helpless should there be a few days in which the police or Guard aren't there to protect us. Even a mouse will fight if cornered.

You will never see me on TV, lamenting my sad tale, and whining for handouts.

Yes, I have compassion. Yes, I feel for these people. What I have little patience for is when people just do not take responsibility for their very lives.

Oh, and about that credit card - I worked hard and paid it off quickly through a lot of bag lunches at work and DVDs and stuff not purchased. Even without the convenience of a credit card, I would STILL have equipped myself with second-hand items and a one-piece-at-a-time determination.

I'm doing it now. I would not "preach" like this if I wasn't walking my talk as it were.

I'm not rich, I'm not overly smart, and I bet that only my wife thinks me a bit handsome.

So, if I'm not so hot, then why can't the other people be more self-reliant? I mean, at least save enough cash for a bus ticket. And for poop's sake, have the common sense to LEAVE if you're that close to the ocean and the advisory to leave is given!

[docjoe]

As someone who survived Ivan and Dennis I have to agree with this post. Although my personal experience did not approach that of NOLA or south Mississippi I have dealt with getting a new roof, chopping up the 45+trees that fell in my yard, going days and days without power, and almost losing my business in the process. However I was able to survive without FEMA, the government, or anyone else. Why?? Because my wife and I took to heart the basic hurricane preps that can be found in any coastal newspaper, tv or radio outlet, homesupply store etc. We stocked enough for a week or more. It wasnt fun. It was hot, dirty, sticky etc. The children were a handful. But we made it. I cannot for the life of me understand how grown adults can live on the coast and not prepare and then moan and cry about FEMA, law enforcement etc. This country needs to quit being such a population of victims and start being more responsible. Finally let me add that I do understand there are those that do not have the means to prepare and protect themselves and this is not directed at them.

docjoe

[jrtalon]

this is way different, we are talking about a diaster 3 states wide, people can't simply walk 5 miles down the road to the next town to find shelter....because there is no next town either. These people have been wandering around for 2 days in the sweltering heat with little food and little safe water. You talk about having a tent and water filters, I'm sure most people down there also had supplies for the hurricane, those supplies don't exactly work when the storm wipes them away along with everything else you have.

[NC George]

They had a shot of one woman, and her first question was, "where's my FEMA trailer?" I just wanted to reach out to that woman and tell her, FEMA trailers are months off. Rebuilding is something survivors need to not worry about now, survival is what is most important in the situation at hand. She needs to go to a shelter, where she will be living for quite some time. Single people are last on the list.

[LSU2001]

It is easy to write these posts on our thousand dollar computers from the safety and security of our nice middle class homes/apts/trailers or whatever. It is not as easy to understand and realize that many of the people that stayed in NOLA are extremly poor. Everyday is about survival not just when a storm comes. If you have not experienced the innercity of any metropolitan area then you have no clue what you are talking about. I work as a teacher in a Baton Rouge innercity school. I see first hand the daily struggle that many of my students must face. Some worry about violence and gangs in their neighborhoods, some face the reality of no home and no food. Others can only get one hot meal a day and that is at school. This is part of everyday life in the "'HOOD" Many of the people in NOLA could not buy supplies even if they wanted too. They could not leave and the city offered no way for them to leave. THose at the superdome are the lucky ones. You also have to understand that many of the poor in the superdome are coming from a life of street violence and the attitude that I will simply take what I need or want and if I go to jail then I guess at least I will be fed.

I am not making this stuff up and I am not hyping the reality of their everyday existence. I myself would never ask for help if I could provide for myself but many of the people you are castigating have little or no choice but to depend on the govt for help.
JMHO
TIM

[schmita]

It is easy to write these posts on our thousand dollar computers from the safety and security of our nice middle class homes/apts/trailers or whatever. It is not as easy to understand and realize that many of the people that stayed in NOLA are extremly poor. Everyday is about survival not just when a storm comes. If you have not experienced the innercity of any metropolitan area then you have no clue what you are talking about. I work as a teacher in a Baton Rouge innercity school. I see first hand the daily struggle that many of my students must face. Some worry about violence and gangs in their neighborhoods, some face the reality of no home and no food. Others can only get one hot meal a day and that is at school. This is part of everyday life in the "'HOOD" Many of the people in NOLA could not buy supplies even if they wanted too. They could not leave and the city offered no way for them to leave. THose at the superdome are the lucky ones. You also have to understand that many of the poor in the superdome are coming from a life of street violence and the attitude that I will simply take what I need or want and if I go to jail then I guess at least I will be fed.

I am not making this stuff up and I am not hyping the reality of their everyday existence. I myself would never ask for help if I could provide for myself but many of the people you are castigating have little or no choice but to depend on the govt for help.
JMHO
TIM

That's nice. Very pretty. But I am not middle class. Maybe upper middle class. Maybe more than that!! But after September 11th we WALKED for more than 4 hours for safe haven and that was without any fore knowledge. Do you know what I am saying?

Anyone could have gotten out for Katrina.

Don't give me that I can't carry my 3 year old for hours stuff.
My husband carried our two cats, fifteen pounds each. When we got where we were going, it was next to the UN so that took 45 minutes to walk around.
I am sick of you people trying to justify that the poor people didn't have the resources. I had the damn resources and I walked!!!!
Damn
irina

[PurdueWx80]

It is easy to write these posts on our thousand dollar computers from the safety and security of our nice middle class homes/apts/trailers or whatever. It is not as easy to understand and realize that many of the people that stayed in NOLA are extremly poor. Everyday is about survival not just when a storm comes. If you have not experienced the innercity of any metropolitan area then you have no clue what you are talking about. I work as a teacher in a Baton Rouge innercity school. I see first hand the daily struggle that many of my students must face. Some worry about violence and gangs in their neighborhoods, some face the reality of no home and no food. Others can only get one hot meal a day and that is at school. This is part of everyday life in the "'HOOD" Many of the people in NOLA could not buy supplies even if they wanted too. They could not leave and the city offered no way for them to leave. THose at the superdome are the lucky ones. You also have to understand that many of the poor in the superdome are coming from a life of street violence and the attitude that I will simply take what I need or want and if I go to jail then I guess at least I will be fed.

I am not making this stuff up and I am not hyping the reality of their everyday existence. I myself would never ask for help if I could provide for myself but many of the people you are castigating have little or no choice but to depend on the govt for help.
JMHO
TIM

Another great post!

I'm sorry, but suggesting that people "walk" to safety from a hurricane is a little ridiculous. Walking away from ground zero where something had already happened is a completely different story than walking to safety from something that may happen in 24 hours. Have you not seen how many of the people who didn't evacuate can't walk - have you seen the elderly? I mean seriously, even if people could walk away it would take a week to get far enough from harm's way. Evacuating the city proper would not have been enough.

[wlfpack81]

Very good post lsu2001. Right from the horses mouth. I've been trying to beat this into people's head who just don't really get it. I mean conditions in many inner city neighboorhoods aka the ghetto, hood or whatever you want to call it is TERRIBLE. Don't even get me started on poor areas in the south which tend to be less apt based, but rather block after block of rundown houses. No I wasn't raised poor if some of you are wondering why I'm so hot over this issue. Unlike some I just tend to try to have compassion for others and at least try to view things through their eyes.

And to close the circle to include everyone there are plenty of poor whites (and asians etc.) in these areas as well. Trailer park is basically the equal of the ghetto. Despiration, crime b/c of poverty, no hope. You don't have to have heart for the adult poor but at least have some heart for the kids. They didn't choose to be born in these situations and have on choice but to live it once they're growing up.

If all of these same people who are poor, uneducated (all due to poverty) were born into rich familes they wouldn't act this way. Or to look at it this way take Paris Hilton (heir to what a S300+mil brand) and have her born into a poor white family in the App. Mts of W.Va. She'd exhibit same tendencies due to her environment she's in. Higher chances for crime, poor education, violence, take what I want mentaility. She'd exhibit all of this.

[MBismyPlayground]

I understand all of this anger. I do feel for these people. Beyond imagination. Even though the circumstances are different, there are the basics, every weather channel tells you to have. Water for 7 days, food, batteries, meds, flashlights, radio ect.... Just in case.
I make a point of keeping my hurricane kit in a large plastic sealable container, water tight. Also I make sure that there is the Hurricane fund, just in case.(that is CASH money, sealed up, put in a safe spot.ATMs do not work with no electric)
The lack of personal responsibility makes me sick. The demands of this GIVE ME society disgusts me.
Maybe I am a bit more umm "ballsy" then other women, but I would walk(swim) a mile(or 10) to find help for my family. I would search for what I or they needed.
I can't imagine, sitting on a roof and watching my kids die from dehydration, waiting for someone to get me. If I had to tie mattresses together and tie my kids onto them.......alligators, sharks or snakes be damned.
Of course, I would have evacuated when the first hint went out.
Now, note to self, add a small blow up boat/raft thing to hurricane kit.
RANT OFF.......
yea I am upset to see so much death, pain, distress.

[olddude]

Even here in the Fl. Keys it is amazing to me how many people aren't prepared.

Yes, I agree that those on the Mississippi coast, with supplies, lost them.
It simply underscores the need to evacuate. Take your prep. kit with you and go. It has been said many couldn't afford to go. I'll venture to say more didn't go due to not paying proper attention, misguided bravado, or apathy, than from finacial reasons. My heart does go out to the survivors and next time they WILL leave.

Better to live to fight another day. Prepare yourself and your family.

[MBismyPlayground]

I understand all of this anger. I do feel for these people. Beyond imagination. Even though the circumstances are different, there are the basics, every weather channel tells you to have. Water for 7 days, food, batteries, meds, flashlights, radio ect.... Just in case.
I make a point of keeping my hurricane kit in a large plastic sealable container, water tight. Also I make sure that there is the Hurricane fund, just in case.(that is CASH money, sealed up, put in a safe spot.ATMs do not work with no electric)
The lack of personal responsibility makes me sick. The demands of this GIVE ME society disgusts me.
Maybe I am a bit more umm "ballsy" then other women, but I would walk(swim) a mile(or 10) to find help for my family. I would search for what I or they needed.
I can't imagine, sitting on a roof and watching my kids die from dehydration, waiting for someone to get me. If I had to tie mattresses together and tie my kids onto them.......alligators, sharks or snakes be damned.
Of course, I would have evacuated when the first hint went out.
Now, note to self, add a small blow up boat/raft thing to hurricane kit.
RANT OFF.......
yea I am upset to see so much death, pain, distress.

I need to add to this......just to clarify......I am not rich by any means. I have worked hard for what I do have. Even poor people get food stamps that can buy food and bottled water. I have been around the ghetto and poor folks, and I have never seen any one of the kids out there who LACK a radio, boom box or cell phone for that matter.

[luvwinter]

I have also seen first hand that kind of life when I have had clients that lived in these kinds of neighborhoods. But I don't agree that they couldn't have left their homes. They could have left their homes to go to the superdome before the storm and they would have been able to do so in their shoes not trudging through filthy contaminated water. If you don't have the money to ride to the bus. Walk. That's what they are all doing now, walking to the superdome. But now they are doing it with no food or water and in bare feet. I am not talking about the infirmed or elderly I am talking about people who have a good set of legs and can walk on their own. You don't need money to walk. I know the life alot of these people have is not pleasant, as I have seen it all to many times with clients I have had. That doesn't mean they have to remain helpless victims. I also agree the city could have done more and bused them out of the city as they are doing now. If they had done that in the first place then it wouldn't be as bad of a situation. It's not like the red cross and salvation army couldn't have put something together where they provided transportation to the poor as a way out. There was poor planning all the way around. On the other hand those who chose to stay but could have left on their own have no room to complain about anything. They chose their fate. I believe in compassion and empathy as I am a social worker, but I also believe in empowering people to take care of themselves and act on their own behalf.

[soonertwister]

I could comment at length about American subcultures and the desires and goals that drive them, but I'll just say that the vast majority of American poor would be considered rich by third-world standards.

There are those who have for generations grown up in an entitlement culture and who feel relatively immune to disaster because of the extensive social safety nets that our society provides. It does not protect them from the usual calamities that befall the poor of every society: violence, disease, and poor environment for health, advancement and development as an individual.

As a society we have yet to come completely to terms with these problems, so maybe with this tragedy, it will be time to take another more honest and harder look.

[jasons2k]

I feel both sides. I feel so much sadness and compassion, especially for the elderly, children, and those that are in terrible, dire situations right now. I don't know how many times I've lost it the past 3 days.

At the same time, I get angery because there is a lot of complacency. I'll give you an analogy. If you knew 24 hours from now a nuclear bomb was going to detonate in your city, you would evacuate. No matter what, you would find a way, call all your friends, relatives, whomever, and collectively the city would find a way to escape. -It is a matter of LIFE or DEATH and you WILL get out-.

The sad truth is that most people (until now?) don't perceive a hurricane as a life-threatening event; just an inconvenience. There may be anxiety and excitement, but for the most part, there is no true fear. And unless people change that perception, they won't follow evacuation orders.

Maybe from now on, things will be different.

[wlfpack81]

That's nice. Very pretty. But I am not middle class. Maybe upper middle class. Maybe more than that!! But after September 11th we WALKED for more than 4 hours for safe haven and that was without any fore knowledge. Do you know what I am saying?

Anyone could have gotten out for Katrina.

Don't give me that I can't carry my 3 year old for hours stuff.
My husband carried our two cats, fifteen pounds each. When we got where we were going, it was next to the UN so that took 45 minutes to walk around.
I am sick of you people trying to justify that the poor people didn't have the resources. I had the damn resources and I walked!!!!
Damn
irina

Anyone my butt. So you had to walk for miles. Well, being upper class as you mentioned means you were probably already in better shape to begin w/naturally as compared to a poor person who only gets one good meal a day like lsu mentioned. Try being an old grandparent raising a few grandkids or vice versa, son / daughter raising elderly or sick and elderly relatives. Not that easy to walk the needed distance to get out of the low lying area. I'm sure you're walk while horrible was nothing compared to the distances these people would've need to walk to get out . And w/the poor not everyone has tv (if they do probably not cable) and didn't know where to go to reach the busing stations for the Superdome or out of the city (if they had buses going out of the city). Add in the heat of this time of year I can see what some honestly couldn't get it.

When it comes to the attitudes of certain people (I won't go there) towards poor people in this country fall into these categories:

1) Honestly don't know about how bad it can get
2) Know and don't care (which is what most fall into IMO)

Sad thing is these 2 types are the same ones screaming the nation has gone away from God when they themselves don't act right. Hypocrites!!! Yea that's taking it there but whatever. I'm getting tired of the BS I'm seeing on these boards. Doesn't surprise me but still.

[LSU2001]

As of the census2 of 2000, there are 484,674 people, 188,251 households, and 112,950 families residing in the city. The population density is 1,036.4/km² (2,684.3/mi²). There are 215,091 housing units at an average density of 459.9/km² (1,191.3/mi²). The racial makeup of the city is 28.05% White, 67.25% African American, 0.20% Native American, 2.26% Asian, 0.02% Pacific Islander, 0.93% from other races, and 1.28% from two or more races. 3.06% of the population are Hispanic or Latino of any race.

There are 188,251 households out of which 29.2% have children under the age of 18 living with them, 30.8% are married couples living together, 24.5% have a female householder with no husband present, and 40.0% are non-families. 33.2% of all households are made up of individuals and 9.7% have someone living alone who is 65 years of age or older. The average household size is 2.48 and the average family size is 3.23.

In the city the population is spread out with 26.7% under the age of 18, 11.4% from 18 to 24, 29.3% from 25 to 44, 20.9% from 45 to 64, and 11.7% who are 65 years of age or older. The median age is 33 years. For every 100 females there are 88.2 males. For every 100 females age 18 and over, there are 83.3 males.

The median income for a household in the city is $27,133, and the median income for a family is $32,338. Males have a median income of $30,862 versus $23,768 for females. The per capita income for the city is $17,258. 27.9% of the population and 23.7% of families are below the poverty line. Out of the total population, 40.3% of those under the age of 18 and 19.3% of those 65 and older are living below the poverty line.

You cannot walk 10-15 miles carrying enough food and water for days that the mayor told them to. You cannot walk out of NOLA. For god sakes there is a 26 mile bridge just to get across the lake.

I feel for anyone from NYNY because of Sept. 11, 2001 but I did not see your fire dept turn down our (Louisiana's) gift of a fire truck and a rescue unit. I personally donated to that effort simply because I wanted to help an area hit by a disaster. I never questioned if they could have saved the fire trucks they lost or questioned why things happened the way they did.

The bottom line is the situation is grave and people are dying. We can debate why they didn't have supplies or why they didn't leave for days and that will not change the fact that what is happening is real and not some theory or a computer model The great flood of NOLA is now occuring and all of the scientist have been justified in calling for action. Now maybe people will listen to the experts and plan for such an event. Remember NOLA is not the only place subject to impact by a large cane. Tampa, and New York are both catastrophes waiting to happen.
Tim

[NFLnut]

As someone who survived Ivan and Dennis I have to agree with this post. Although my personal experience did not approach that of NOLA or south Mississippi I have dealt with getting a new roof, chopping up the 45+trees that fell in my yard, going days and days without power, and almost losing my business in the process. However I was able to survive without FEMA, the government, or anyone else. Why?? Because my wife and I took to heart the basic hurricane preps that can be found in any coastal newspaper, tv or radio outlet, homesupply store etc. We stocked enough for a week or more. It wasnt fun. It was hot, dirty, sticky etc. The children were a handful. But we made it. I cannot for the life of me understand how grown adults can live on the coast and not prepare and then moan and cry about FEMA, law enforcement etc. This country needs to quit being such a population of victims and start being more responsible. Finally let me add that I do understand there are those that do not have the means to prepare and protect themselves and this is not directed at them.

docjoe

All I can say is ditto. Charley, Jeanne, Frances alumni here and not once when I had two trees in my kitchen with 2" of water on the floor for four days with no power for 16 days total did I blame "FEMA!"

But what do we expect? We have a major portion of society in this country who think that everything should come from the gubment! And that's why you and I work until, what is it now, June 5th just to pay taxes!!

I have cried my eyes out over these people and the horrible stories the last three days. I even teared up when I heard the Police shot that seal that washed up on shore and people were all day trying to keep it hydrated in Gulfport. I have donated to the Salvation Army and Red Cross. But I am going to blow a gasket if I see one more idiot on TV pushing a shopping cart full of brand new Nikes or hear someone blaming the Gubment!

[JQ Public]

It is easy to write these posts on our thousand dollar computers from the safety and security of our nice middle class homes/apts/trailers or whatever. It is not as easy to understand and realize that many of the people that stayed in NOLA are extremly poor. Everyday is about survival not just when a storm comes. If you have not experienced the innercity of any metropolitan area then you have no clue what you are talking about. I work as a teacher in a Baton Rouge innercity school. I see first hand the daily struggle that many of my students must face. Some worry about violence and gangs in their neighborhoods, some face the reality of no home and no food. Others can only get one hot meal a day and that is at school. This is part of everyday life in the "'HOOD" Many of the people in NOLA could not buy supplies even if they wanted too. They could not leave and the city offered no way for them to leave. THose at the superdome are the lucky ones. You also have to understand that many of the poor in the superdome are coming from a life of street violence and the attitude that I will simply take what I need or want and if I go to jail then I guess at least I will be fed.

I am not making this stuff up and I am not hyping the reality of their everyday existence. I myself would never ask for help if I could provide for myself but many of the people you are castigating have little or no choice but to depend on the govt for help.
JMHO
TIM

That's nice. Very pretty. But I am not middle class. Maybe upper middle class. Maybe more than that!! But after September 11th we WALKED for more than 4 hours for safe haven and that was without any fore knowledge. Do you know what I am saying?

Anyone could have gotten out for Katrina.

Don't give me that I can't carry my 3 year old for hours stuff.
My husband carried our two cats, fifteen pounds each. When we got where we were going, it was next to the UN so that took 45 minutes to walk around.
I am sick of you people trying to justify that the poor people didn't have the resources. I had the damn resources and I walked!!!!
Damn
irina

you ma'am are an idiot

[luvwinter]

Now things are getting out of hand. There is no room for name calling. I agree to the compassion part and helping people out I am infuriated about the looting and people with the entitlement attitude. The poster who mentioned it was right. It is a sickening part of our society and it needs to change as people need to take responsability for their well being in one way or another. I have had clients who had nothing and children to care for but they did anything they could to take care of themselves. When they can't do it on their own, not for lack of trying I am all for asisstance.

[LSU2001]

Now things are getting out of hand. There is no room for name calling. I agree to the compassion part and helping people out I am infuriated about the looting and people with the entitlement attitude. The poster who mentioned it was right. It is a sickening part of our society and it needs to change as people need to take responsability for their well being in one way or another. I have had clients who had nothing and children to care for but they did anything they could to take care of themselves. When they can't do it on their own, not for lack of trying I am all for asisstance.

I agree 100% but you must remember that as late as Sunday morning the Mayor was taking a wait and see attitude. He then started a mandatory evac.
Many did not get the news until late sunday and by then it was too late.
Tim