Remember this?....

[Pebbles]

This was on TV too

http://americanradioworks.publicradio.o ... cane1.html

It may of been posted before but I don't understand why the government said they didn't know about this. I remember seeing this on tv like 3 or 4 times.

[vespersparrow]

Excellent links.
Thanks

[soonertwister]

This was on TV too

http://americanradioworks.publicradio.o ... cane1.html

It may of been posted before but I don't understand why the government said they didn't know about this. I remember seeing this on tv like 3 or 4 times.

WHO in the government says they didn't know about this? Either show us a link to the statement by the person who claims to say that they "didn't know about this", or please retract your statement as unsubstantiated.

You may have unwittingly done exactly the same thing propagandists do in order to stir up people about an issue: make a claim that an anonymous someone representing the group being slandered admitted that they screwed up. It's a trick used more than once daily somewhere around the world by some news sources.

All I ask is that inflammatory statements be backed up by a source. Under the circumstances that's a very reasonable request.

[artist]

(credit to Washington Post)
"Behind the scenes, a power struggle emerged, as federal officials tried to wrest authority from Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco (D). Shortly before midnight Friday, the Bush administration sent her a proposed legal memorandum asking her to request a federal takeover of the evacuation of New Orleans, a source within the state's emergency operations center said Saturday.

The administration sought unified control over all local police and state National Guard units reporting to the governor. Louisiana officials rejected the request after talks throughout the night, concerned that such a move would be comparable to a federal declaration of martial law. Some officials in the state suspected a political motive behind the request. "Quite frankly, if they'd been able to pull off taking it away from the locals, they then could have blamed everything on the locals," said the source, who does not have the authority to speak publicly.

A senior administration official said that Bush has clear legal authority to federalize National Guard units to quell civil disturbances under the Insurrection Act and will continue to try to unify the chains of command that are split among the president, the Louisiana governor and the New Orleans mayor.

Louisiana did not reach out to a multi-state mutual aid compact for assistance until Wednesday, three state and federal officials said. As of Saturday, Blanco still had not declared a state of emergency, the senior Bush official said."

[soonertwister]

Assuming that those were the President's remarks, they seem accurate within the context of the moment. He was likely informed that an entirely unexpected collapse of the levee had occurred. The original reports were that surge had not topped the levee.

It wasn't until at least sometime during the day Wednesday that it was discovered that the levee collapse was only because it was overtopped, and the water rushing in eroded the soil at the base to a depth of 19 feet on the land side of the levee. This erosion is what caused the levee to collapse. The original assumption was that the levee had collapsed from the pressure of the water, which was NOT anticipated. At the time, they didn't know that the water level had risen higher than the levee there. The evidence that the levee was overtopped was further strengthened by the discovery of two more breaks elsewhere.

The fact that any part of the levee was lower than the rest was probably something that should have been known before this event, and corrected.

[crazycajuncane]

This was on TV too

http://americanradioworks.publicradio.o ... cane1.html

It may of been posted before but I don't understand why the government said they didn't know about this. I remember seeing this on tv like 3 or 4 times.

excellent articles

[Eye10TX]

On Wednesday, it was the mayor and lots of New Orleanians who were all running around going "why is the water rising, what's going on, where's this water coming from?"

And you expect the President of the United States to know that a levee had a breach in it? Good grief. Wonder if he sees that wisp of smoke rising out in San Bernardino County right now.

[x-y-no]

artist quoted:

As of Saturday, Blanco still had not declared a state of emergency, the senior Bush official said."

Well that's flatly false.

Seems like there's self-serving spin coming from all directions.

[Windy]

This was on TV too

http://americanradioworks.publicradio.o ... cane1.html

It may of been posted before but I don't understand why the government said they didn't know about this. I remember seeing this on tv like 3 or 4 times.

WHO in the government says they didn't know about this? Either show us a link to the statement by the person who claims to say that they "didn't know about this", or please retract your statement as unsubstantiated.

You may have unwittingly done exactly the same thing propagandists do in order to stir up people about an issue: make a claim that an anonymous someone representing the group being slandered admitted that they screwed up. It's a trick used more than once daily somewhere around the world by some news sources.

All I ask is that inflammatory statements be backed up by a source. Under the circumstances that's a very reasonable request.

Here is a source.

[cmdebbie]

IMHO, I believe that a whole lot of people have taken Bush's comment about the levee breach out of context. It seems people are bashing him for saying know one imagined that happening. I do believe what he meant is that after the storm came through on Monday...everyone thought NO had escaped the worse. No one expected the levees to breach at that point.

Of course he knew the levees breaching was a possibility, but after the storm passed it seemed as if that scenario had not played out. Everyone was caught off guard when they actually did!

[Pebbles]

IMHO, I believe that a whole lot of people have taken Bush's comment about the levee breach out of context. It seems people are bashing him for saying know one imagined that happening. I do believe what he meant is that after the storm came through on Monday...everyone thought NO had escaped the worse. No one expected the levees to breach at that point.

Of course he knew the levees breaching was a possibility, but after the storm passed it seemed as if that scenario had not played out. Everyone was caught off guard when they actually did!

And the problem there is everyone focuses on the eye of the storm. I was so angry... and I have NCBird to back me up... I was screaming at the computer and TV screen when many kept saying NO was out of the "big one danger" we could all breath a sigh of relief. All this happening with the storm still going on!!! It wasn't over... in fact it was still making landfall on MS! And even after landfall the storm is still going on. Lets not forget this thing was HUGE the Hurricane and Tropical storm winds went out FOR Hundreds of miles! But many including the media almost every storm makes out like the worst is over once the eye makes land. This is SO FALSE.

Want proof... here's a thread on this very board that was going on around that time. http://www.storm2k.org/phpbb2/viewtopic ... sc&start=0 The news media was on at the same time this thread was going on saying how N.O. had avoided the big danger. I remember because I didn't stay at NCBird's house untill the storm was over. I went back to the resort we were vacationing at. Notice though the quotes from the NHC didn't say N.O. was outta danger at the point. But so many were already writing it off (the 'big one' flood potention, not only on the board but TV Major News Channel reporters were ALREADY saying it too).

Mind you I am NOT commenting on Bush's comment. I will not get in the political arena on this and not going to nitpick every comment every government offical made. I guess my original post was more of a my reflection (personal point of view) on how many officials came on TV and said things along the line of not expecting such devistation. Honestly I did, I was sick to my stomach watching this storm come in, while it made landfall and afterwards. But Floyd should of been a warning to all. The actual extent of damage and flooding from that hurricane started to show up the next day too. People sorta wrote off that storm also. But when the extent of the flooding started showing up the next day no one was laughing.

Just like in that case, keep in mind that this flooding N.O. wasn't like GUSH huge wall of water. And I am willing to bet the people that modeled this out probably will/did say that it would not be, just think of floodwaters move. It takes time for floodwaters to get around. I guarentee you it started happening while the storm was going on. The waves were lapping at the levi, eating away at it. It took a while for the water to inch it's way up to a point that people noticed it was indeed flooding the city.

P.S. I'm am not gonna hound the internet looking for quotes to back up my timing on this. You either believe what I say or you don't. Honestly I have no reason to lie. Also there is nothing I can say that can or will change what has happened. There were so many things that just didn't happen here. Including the fact that it's been discussed, that 72 hours wouldn't of been enough time to evacuate all the people in this situation, in the past on this board/in teamspeak. And there wasn't 72 hours in this situation. All we can do is live, learn, and pray.

[artist]

I recall when Nagin went on TV saying - we dodged the bullet - then shortly there after there were reports of flooding beginning and they were trying to figure out where the water was coming from.