I love America, but we complain more than the people who are really suffering over there. Yes, we had 9/11, but that was no big deal compared to how the rest of the world has suffered. We complain about no food on the ships, flies and probably being hot.
What a shame we got this attitude here.
Israel thread #2
Moderator: S2k Moderators
U.S. to evacuate 7,000 from Lebanon by Friday
State Department waives fees for Americans fleeing fighting
Wednesday, July 19, 2006; Posted: 11:42 a.m. EDT (15:42 GMT)
(CNN) -- The U.S. State Department said Wednesday it will help evacuate 7,000 Americans from Lebanon within the next two days.
State Department spokesman Sean McCormack told CNN's "American Morning" that 1,000 would leave Wednesday, 2,000 Thursday and 4,000 more by Friday.
About 450 of the estimated 25,000 Americans in Lebanon have been evacuated to the nearby Mediterranean island of Cyprus since fighting between Israel and Hezbollah militants started July 12.
It's unclear how many Americans are trying to leave the war-torn country.
Thousands of people have been shipped out of Beirut's port on cruise ships and military vessels that must pass through an Israeli naval blockade as they take people to Cyprus, about about 100 miles (160 kilometers) northwest of Lebanon.
About 800 Americans and Britons left Beirut on Wednesday aboard the Orient Queen, a Greek cruise ship that the State Department chartered. That vessel is expected to arrive early Thursday in the Cypriot port of Larnaca.
Wednesday's arrivals in Cyprus included dozens of U.S. college students who endured an 11-hour voyage on a crowded car ferry to escape the violence.
The Norwegian-chartered ship carried 1,100 Europeans but also made room for 127 U.S. citizens, including the students and several American families.
Ashley Marinaccio, 20, a college student from Long Branch, New Jersey, said the ferry was like a "floating refugee camp" with "tons of flies," few places to sit or sleep, five toilets, a shortage of toilet paper and several ill passengers.
"It got really dirty," Marinaccio said. "We knew that it would be over, and we were going to safety, so it was all we thought about."
She called it "really disappointing" that the U.S. Embassy told the students "we're assessing the situation" while others from the Netherlands, Switzerland and France had been evacuated three days earlier.
Some lawmakers and relatives with family members stranded in Lebanon have complained that the State Department is moving too slowly to evacuate Americans.
In the face of that criticism, McCormack, the State Department official, defended the process, calling it "an international operation spanning three continents." He said that infrastructure was in place in Cyprus to take care of evacuees.
"We have been working very hard to make sure that our people get out in a safe, orderly and timely manner," McCormack said. "Certainly, we would like to make sure that people get out as quickly as possible, but we want to make sure they're safe as well."
But Marinaccio said she was pleased the U.S. government had provided food for Americans aboard her ferry although she said it disturbed her that others were hungry and there wasn't enough to go around.
U.S. Navy SEALs pulled alongside the ferry to deliver boxes of chicken sandwiches, she said.
"It was for American citizens only and that actually made a big stink on the boat, because people who weren't American citizens were trying to get the food," Marinaccio said. "Other people were screaming, 'It's for Americans only, show your passport.' "
She added, "I understand this was the government's food, but in the case of an emergency, everybody needs to eat, whether you're an American or not."
In addition to frustrations at the pace of U.S. evacuations, others, especially Democratic lawmakers, expressed outrage that evacuees initially were going to have to pay to leave.
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice ended the controversy Tuesday night, using her authority under the law to waive the fees people would have paid to the government.
"She wanted to go the extra mile to remove any possible worries that people might have. She understands they're in a very difficult situation," McCormack said.
"Any American who wants to get out of Lebanon is going to have that opportunity. And there will be no charge for that."
Stranded in war-torn country
Several Americans in Lebanon also wrote e-mails to CNN, expressing their frustration with the evacuation process.
"We are desperately trying to evacuate and have become more and more disappointed and angry with the way the evacuation is being handled," said Lina Fleihan of Greensboro, North Carolina. "We hear more about what's going on from CNN than we do from the U.S. government and the American Embassy here."
Natalie Kerlakian of Denver, Colorado, wrote that she had not heard from the embassy in a week.
"I hope this response will be better than that of Katrina," she wrote, referring to the heavily criticized government response to the hurricane that struck the Gulf Coast in August. (Read another family's story)
In addition to cruise ships, the State Department has arranged for six CH-53 Sea Stallion helicopters, which collectively can ferry about 300 passengers a day, to help in the evacuation effort. (Watch American children in helmets flee Beirut -- 2:19)
The helicopters are reserved primarily for medical emergencies and were used Tuesday to airlift about 60 of the most vulnerable people from the U.S. Embassy in Beirut, the embassy said.
Warships from the United States, Britain, Spain and Italy are to provide security for the evacuation. Included in the flotilla are U.S. ships from a strike group led by the amphibious assault ship USS Iwo Jima, which was dispatched to the Mediterranean from the Red Sea to assist evacuations, Pentagon officials said Tuesday.
"These operations are taking place in a war zone," Army Brig. Gen. Mike Barbero said. "They involve passage through a strict blockade and are limited by the capacity of the ports and the degraded infrastructure in Lebanon."
State Department waives fees for Americans fleeing fighting
Wednesday, July 19, 2006; Posted: 11:42 a.m. EDT (15:42 GMT)
(CNN) -- The U.S. State Department said Wednesday it will help evacuate 7,000 Americans from Lebanon within the next two days.
State Department spokesman Sean McCormack told CNN's "American Morning" that 1,000 would leave Wednesday, 2,000 Thursday and 4,000 more by Friday.
About 450 of the estimated 25,000 Americans in Lebanon have been evacuated to the nearby Mediterranean island of Cyprus since fighting between Israel and Hezbollah militants started July 12.
It's unclear how many Americans are trying to leave the war-torn country.
Thousands of people have been shipped out of Beirut's port on cruise ships and military vessels that must pass through an Israeli naval blockade as they take people to Cyprus, about about 100 miles (160 kilometers) northwest of Lebanon.
About 800 Americans and Britons left Beirut on Wednesday aboard the Orient Queen, a Greek cruise ship that the State Department chartered. That vessel is expected to arrive early Thursday in the Cypriot port of Larnaca.
Wednesday's arrivals in Cyprus included dozens of U.S. college students who endured an 11-hour voyage on a crowded car ferry to escape the violence.
The Norwegian-chartered ship carried 1,100 Europeans but also made room for 127 U.S. citizens, including the students and several American families.
Ashley Marinaccio, 20, a college student from Long Branch, New Jersey, said the ferry was like a "floating refugee camp" with "tons of flies," few places to sit or sleep, five toilets, a shortage of toilet paper and several ill passengers.
"It got really dirty," Marinaccio said. "We knew that it would be over, and we were going to safety, so it was all we thought about."
She called it "really disappointing" that the U.S. Embassy told the students "we're assessing the situation" while others from the Netherlands, Switzerland and France had been evacuated three days earlier.
Some lawmakers and relatives with family members stranded in Lebanon have complained that the State Department is moving too slowly to evacuate Americans.
In the face of that criticism, McCormack, the State Department official, defended the process, calling it "an international operation spanning three continents." He said that infrastructure was in place in Cyprus to take care of evacuees.
"We have been working very hard to make sure that our people get out in a safe, orderly and timely manner," McCormack said. "Certainly, we would like to make sure that people get out as quickly as possible, but we want to make sure they're safe as well."
But Marinaccio said she was pleased the U.S. government had provided food for Americans aboard her ferry although she said it disturbed her that others were hungry and there wasn't enough to go around.
U.S. Navy SEALs pulled alongside the ferry to deliver boxes of chicken sandwiches, she said.
"It was for American citizens only and that actually made a big stink on the boat, because people who weren't American citizens were trying to get the food," Marinaccio said. "Other people were screaming, 'It's for Americans only, show your passport.' "
She added, "I understand this was the government's food, but in the case of an emergency, everybody needs to eat, whether you're an American or not."
In addition to frustrations at the pace of U.S. evacuations, others, especially Democratic lawmakers, expressed outrage that evacuees initially were going to have to pay to leave.
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice ended the controversy Tuesday night, using her authority under the law to waive the fees people would have paid to the government.
"She wanted to go the extra mile to remove any possible worries that people might have. She understands they're in a very difficult situation," McCormack said.
"Any American who wants to get out of Lebanon is going to have that opportunity. And there will be no charge for that."
Stranded in war-torn country
Several Americans in Lebanon also wrote e-mails to CNN, expressing their frustration with the evacuation process.
"We are desperately trying to evacuate and have become more and more disappointed and angry with the way the evacuation is being handled," said Lina Fleihan of Greensboro, North Carolina. "We hear more about what's going on from CNN than we do from the U.S. government and the American Embassy here."
Natalie Kerlakian of Denver, Colorado, wrote that she had not heard from the embassy in a week.
"I hope this response will be better than that of Katrina," she wrote, referring to the heavily criticized government response to the hurricane that struck the Gulf Coast in August. (Read another family's story)
In addition to cruise ships, the State Department has arranged for six CH-53 Sea Stallion helicopters, which collectively can ferry about 300 passengers a day, to help in the evacuation effort. (Watch American children in helmets flee Beirut -- 2:19)
The helicopters are reserved primarily for medical emergencies and were used Tuesday to airlift about 60 of the most vulnerable people from the U.S. Embassy in Beirut, the embassy said.
Warships from the United States, Britain, Spain and Italy are to provide security for the evacuation. Included in the flotilla are U.S. ships from a strike group led by the amphibious assault ship USS Iwo Jima, which was dispatched to the Mediterranean from the Red Sea to assist evacuations, Pentagon officials said Tuesday.
"These operations are taking place in a war zone," Army Brig. Gen. Mike Barbero said. "They involve passage through a strict blockade and are limited by the capacity of the ports and the degraded infrastructure in Lebanon."
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Audrey2Katrina
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Janice wrote:Lebanon Prime Minister Siniora says 300 people have been killed in Israeli attacks; appeals for immediate cease-fire, according to media reports. Per CNN
I don't trust him/them any further than I can throw them. While I don't deny civilian casualties, again what the media IS NOT telling us (enough) is that Hezbollah surrounds themselves within civilian populations, dresses as civilians (as opposed to uniformed military--hence often counted as civilian casualties), and fires their rockets from "civilian" locations.
If Lebanon doesn't care to do more to rid themselves of these vermin, other than to complain about casualties (many of which are STILL Hezbollah) then I wish Israel all the luck in the world in doing so.
A2K
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feederband
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southerngale
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Early this morning, I was flipping the channels around and stopped on CNN to listen to one of their live reporters over there. It was a woman...anyone know who it was? Christiane Amanpour? I rarely watch CNN and don't remember her name, but she had dark hair. Anyway, she was talking about how Lebanon needed Hezbollah to survive to help with things like school, medical, or things like that. I don't remember specifically and briefly looked for an article online, but couldn't find one. If anyone else saw it, was it just me, or did she seem sympathetic as if Israel shouldn't take out Hezbollah because Lebanon needed them? Terrorists? She said a few times the good Hezbollah has done. Anyway, I was still half asleep and wish I remembered more details, but I do remember thinking, "Is she serious?" and expecting the CNN heads to cut her off, but she went on and on.
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Audrey2Katrina
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Christiane Amanpour
I well remember her from my CNN watching days (back during Desert Storm...Bush I)... and unless a LOT has changed (and I doubt it has) she is one of the biggest apologists news babes for the terrorists. She has ALWAYS given the terrorist viewpoint as if it were a valid one. I can't STAND her... OR CNN... which is yet another reason I'm glad I don't watch those slanted hypocrites. Under the guise of "objectivity" they always manage to make the folks they do NOT sympathize with come off looking bad/mean; while they trivialize the attrocities of people like Hezbollah, by dint of this woman who lacks only a burka to make her attire complete IMO.
A2K
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Audrey2Katrina
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She said a few times the good Hezbollah has done.
Historically, if one REALLY wanted to play "devil's advocate," one could validly claim there was much good that Hitler did for Germany, post WWI, as well (bringing back a nation in total ruin to that of a global power in less than a decade among many other things--hospitals, medicines, infrastructure.. and on and on...).... and yet I seriously doubt anyone in here (hopefully) would EVER use these things to justify this MONSTER, or that Germany needed his hideous presence for anything other than what led to a global catastrophe... and with Hezbollah now singing out "Bring on WWIII"... I think only a complete IDIOT could say these nuts are "good" in any other way, than a candy-coated dose of strychnine would be--good. Again, JMO... but I'm sticking to it!
A2K
Last edited by Audrey2Katrina on Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Audrey2Katrina
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IMHO... Folks like that aren't "playing" devil's advocate... they ARE the Devil's Advocate!
A2K
A2K
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southerngale
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I'm not sure if it was her. I tried to find a list of the CNN reporters over there, but no luck. I didn't want to give her name if it wasn't her, so I put a ? after it. But that description sounds about right. I'm hoping someone else saw it. I don't care for CNN either, but when I'm looking for news and Fox News goes to a commercial, I will flip around and stop anywhere.
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Audrey2Katrina wrote:Christiane Amanpour
I well remember her from my CNN watching days (back during Desert Storm...Bush I)... and unless a LOT has changed (and I doubt it has) she is one of the biggest apologists news babes for the terrorists. She has ALWAYS given the terrorist viewpoint as if it were a valid one. I can't STAND her... OR CNN... which is yet another reason I'm glad I don't watch those slanted hypocrites. Under the guise of "objectivity" they always manage to make the folks they do NOT sympathize with come off looking bad/mean; while they trivialize the attrocities of people like Hezbollah, by dint of this woman who lacks only a burka to make her attire complete IMO. A2K
A2K, You may really want to re-consider your view of CNN as biased. Take, for example, my uncle and I. We both watch CTV news up here in Canada OK? During the last election campaign, he came away as believing that CTV News was pro-Liberal (the governing party) and I came away believing that they were pro-Conservative (the Canadian government now) and were doing all they can to help conservatives get elected.
2 intelligent people came away from watching CTV each convinced that the network was biased. We all see the world through our own lenses. You, being an American in the deep south, I assume, are a very conservative/right-wing person. CNN doesn't present the view of the world that you share so you consider it biased.
Would it surprise you to learn that even noted conservative columnist Tucker Carlson considers Fox news to be titled far to the right?
Christiane Amanpour risks her life day in and day out as CNN's Chief International Correspondent to bring the world home to us. She is entitled to respect. I am sure all she was doing was expressing the other POV. Who knows what she said before SG changed the channel and started watching her. She has won numerous prestigious journalism awards.
You said earlier in this thread very heatedly that you get the news from the source you trust. In a way, that is tragic because you are only hearing what you want to hear. You are only listening to people that share your POV.
I'll write more later but I just had to take you on regarding this. I do it with the utmost respect, however.
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x-y-no
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Jeeze, people ... part of a journalist's job in a situation like this is to inform us how people on the ground there think and what the basis for that thinking is. I haven't watched any of the cable coverage of this so I'm only basing this on past experience seeing Amanpour's reports and that's how I understood her work in the past.
As far as I'm concerned, in most situations more information is better.
As far as I'm concerned, in most situations more information is better.
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Audrey2Katrina
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In light of the previous post, and despite the implied respect, its being rife with misconceptions, I absolutely must respond to those misconceptions, and then hope that rather than a debate about MY ideology, we can return to a discussion about the Israeli-Lebanon situation.
Nothing to reconsider. I still consider them monumentally biased. As far as CTV is concerned, I can't speak to that. Been to Canada only once but it is a beautiful country. I know irrelevant--but probably most of this is.
You sound intelligent, Jason. In such a light, I would think you know what "assuming" can lead you to. I am conservative on some issues, and quite liberal on others; and I deeply resent being labelled "right-wing", as this comes off sounding as if I'm some sort of conspiracy cross-burning nut--none of which is even remotely true. I take on conspiracy theorists all the time, and while you can find them in both camps (right and left)... the fact that I subscribe to none of their nonsense lends me very much in the middle.
Your assumption that I watch news to see my "view" is ill-conceived--and wrong. I consider CNN biased because I've taken courses in, and write examples for a national tournament in recognizing propaganda every year. I KNOW propaganda when I see it--in print, on radio, and in TV ads or reporting. I find CNN masters at the art of selective reporting.
Not at all, since 1.) Carlson might be labeled "conservative" but many of his views fail of that mark from what little I recall of him aside from that hideous bowtie. and more importantly 2.) Carlson would hardly speak highly of FOX, since they're cleaning up the floor with CNN, whose ratings have tanked. Maybe a lot more Americans have a better sense of what's fair than the estimable Mr. Carlson.
She is entitled nothing more than her civil rights as (I presume) a US citizen. I have little, if any respect for her biased methods of reporting. This is the problem of many today... SHE IS "entitled"... 'scuse me... what one is "entitled" to has caused a LOT of problems in today's society. You are entitled the opportunity to make the most of what talent God has given you, and to live your live here in the US with the protection of your "rights" under the US constitution (and nowhere in there will you find "entitled to respect")... and from there, what you're entitled to...ends. What you "EARN" is much more important... and while she has for many, whose "opinions" I can respect, she hasn't "earned" my respect a whit.
Oh, I have no doubt that she was. As I'd said above, one might well have said the same for the POV of one Adolph Hitler before he began hostilities and attrocities of WWII. Personally, I don't mind hearing the different POV on a "political" issue..which we can't go into here; but equally, there IS NO opposing POV when one party is struggling to survive on its own homeland, and the other is hell bent on their destruction through their willing sanction of genocide... sorry, but anyone feeling they have a POV worth watching is "entitled" that... but I have no intention of suffering it.
NOn-Sequitur... I have won well over 30 National Championships with my teams in the game recognizing propaganda... I know it when I see it... I view this as making me a more "informed" watcher, as opposed to one simply looking for his/her own POV.
Indeed, and I will continue to do so. It's not tragic... it's called separating the wheat from the chaff.
Another judgmental statement on your part. And another wrong one... I read, listen to, and view reports from sundry sources--where I DO draw the line.. is when I find a source consistent in its slant, or one that gives terrorists validation by somehow or other trying to make the public sympathize with them. I have NO use for this... beyond tolerance for terror, and clearly American-haters, I will, have, and will continue to view just about any source of info... left...or right!
Now... that said... we've each had our say... can we PLEASE, stay on the topic of Lebanon-Israel and its implications both domestically and globally.
A2K
A2K, You may really want to re-consider your view of CNN as biased.
Nothing to reconsider. I still consider them monumentally biased. As far as CTV is concerned, I can't speak to that. Been to Canada only once but it is a beautiful country. I know irrelevant--but probably most of this is.
I assume, are a very conservative/right-wing person.
You sound intelligent, Jason. In such a light, I would think you know what "assuming" can lead you to. I am conservative on some issues, and quite liberal on others; and I deeply resent being labelled "right-wing", as this comes off sounding as if I'm some sort of conspiracy cross-burning nut--none of which is even remotely true. I take on conspiracy theorists all the time, and while you can find them in both camps (right and left)... the fact that I subscribe to none of their nonsense lends me very much in the middle.
CNN doesn't present the view of the world that you share so you consider it biased.
Your assumption that I watch news to see my "view" is ill-conceived--and wrong. I consider CNN biased because I've taken courses in, and write examples for a national tournament in recognizing propaganda every year. I KNOW propaganda when I see it--in print, on radio, and in TV ads or reporting. I find CNN masters at the art of selective reporting.
Would it surprise you to learn that even noted conservative columnist Tucker Carlson considers Fox news to be titled far to the right?
Not at all, since 1.) Carlson might be labeled "conservative" but many of his views fail of that mark from what little I recall of him aside from that hideous bowtie. and more importantly 2.) Carlson would hardly speak highly of FOX, since they're cleaning up the floor with CNN, whose ratings have tanked. Maybe a lot more Americans have a better sense of what's fair than the estimable Mr. Carlson.
She is entitled to respect.
She is entitled nothing more than her civil rights as (I presume) a US citizen. I have little, if any respect for her biased methods of reporting. This is the problem of many today... SHE IS "entitled"... 'scuse me... what one is "entitled" to has caused a LOT of problems in today's society. You are entitled the opportunity to make the most of what talent God has given you, and to live your live here in the US with the protection of your "rights" under the US constitution (and nowhere in there will you find "entitled to respect")... and from there, what you're entitled to...ends. What you "EARN" is much more important... and while she has for many, whose "opinions" I can respect, she hasn't "earned" my respect a whit.
I am sure all she was doing was expressing the other POV.
Oh, I have no doubt that she was. As I'd said above, one might well have said the same for the POV of one Adolph Hitler before he began hostilities and attrocities of WWII. Personally, I don't mind hearing the different POV on a "political" issue..which we can't go into here; but equally, there IS NO opposing POV when one party is struggling to survive on its own homeland, and the other is hell bent on their destruction through their willing sanction of genocide... sorry, but anyone feeling they have a POV worth watching is "entitled" that... but I have no intention of suffering it.
She has won numerous prestigious journalism awards.
NOn-Sequitur... I have won well over 30 National Championships with my teams in the game recognizing propaganda... I know it when I see it... I view this as making me a more "informed" watcher, as opposed to one simply looking for his/her own POV.
You said earlier in this thread very heatedly that you get the news from the source you trust.
Indeed, and I will continue to do so. It's not tragic... it's called separating the wheat from the chaff.
You are only listening to people that share your POV.
Another judgmental statement on your part. And another wrong one... I read, listen to, and view reports from sundry sources--where I DO draw the line.. is when I find a source consistent in its slant, or one that gives terrorists validation by somehow or other trying to make the public sympathize with them. I have NO use for this... beyond tolerance for terror, and clearly American-haters, I will, have, and will continue to view just about any source of info... left...or right!
Now... that said... we've each had our say... can we PLEASE, stay on the topic of Lebanon-Israel and its implications both domestically and globally.
A2K
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IDF: Hizbullah preventing civilians from leaving villages in southern Lebanon
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340 ... 26,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340 ... 26,00.html
The IDF has found that Hizbullah is preventing civilians from leaving villages in southern Lebanon. Roadblocks have been set up outside some of the villages to prevent residents from leaving, while in other villages Hizbullah is preventing UN representatives from entering, who are trying to help residents leave. In two villages, exchanges of fire between residents and Hizbullah have broken out. (Hanan Greenberg)
(07.18.06, 21:41)
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