ATL: Tropical Depression Fay

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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2461 Postby storms in NC » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:29 am

greels wrote:If notification of a TD/TS is not made till sometime this afternoon, it will give the general public here in T&C very little notice....no one I have talked to here on the Island today is aware of what is going on to the west of us.....

If this storm is headed our way, we definately need to get word out to our populations in the flood prone areas of our Island of what is forthcoming and that will not happen until something "official" comes out from our Disaster Management
Offices!


They sure are not giveing you all much time.
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#2462 Postby gatorcane » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:30 am

Accuweather thoughts, they seem to not be buying an east of Florida solution.

Tropical Development Possible Today or Tomorrow
We continue to watch for the development of a tropical disturbance located to the east of the Leeward Islands. This area became better organized late Wednesday and continues to show signs of organization Thursday.

The tropical disturbance is located near 16 north and 61 west as an area of low pressure (1009 millibars, or 29.80 inches of mercury). Convection redeveloped west and northwest of the center of circulation late Wednesday and has persisted into Thursday. There currently remains two inhibiting factors; dry air to the north and west and stronger winds. These winds should gradually relax over the next 24 to 48 hours as an upper- level trough ahead of it moves west back off to the southwest and weakens. This process would then vent the system and could help this system to become a depression and even storm in a short period of time.

The future track of this system will be highly dependent on the orientation and strength of the Atlantic ridge. A strong westward building ridge would guide this system over the Greater Antilles and into Cuba while a weaker building ridge would allow the system to ride more northwestward and perhaps threaten Florida or even the southeastern U.S. early next week. Some computer forecasts take the system into the northern Bahamas by Monday, then keep it east of Florida. Other computer models take the system farther west and into the Gulf of Mexico. Our current thinking takes the center of the storm through the Bahamas over the weekend and toward eastern Florida early next week.

In the short term, gusty winds to tropical-storm force and rain squalls will begin to impact the Leeward Island Thursday afternoon. These gusty winds and rain squalls will then move across the Virginia Islands and Puerto Rico Thursday night and Friday. This feature will continue to strengthen Friday and through the weekend and will likely become a hurricane as it passes through the Bahamas and toward the east coast of Florida. This storm could even become a Category 2 storm early next week as it spins off the east coast of Florida. Residents from the Leeward Islands to Puerto Rico to the Bahamas and the Southeast U.S. should pay close attention to this storm.

Another system we are watching about 1,350 miles east of the Lesser Antilles still remains disorganized, surrounded by dry, dusty air, and is tracking close to only marginally warm water. Development of this system is less likely, but we will continue to monitor this system as it tracks west across the Atlantic.

by AccuWeather.com Senior Meteorologist Rob Miller

http://hurricane.accuweather.com/hurric ... n=atlantic
Last edited by gatorcane on Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:32 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2463 Postby Sanibel » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:31 am

The CDO is persisting in red IR right now. I think scientific complacency is a mistake and the British Virgin Islands should expect a bursting tropical storm later today or tonight. Though I don't think it will happen, rapid intensification should now be mentioned as well.


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Last edited by Sanibel on Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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#2464 Postby Aric Dunn » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:31 am

im trying to confirm this ,, but I have extrapolated from earlier postion as well as satellite. The LLC ( small and not so well defined but more than earlier and yesterday) is sitting right on top of St. martin.. confidence level 75%

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/flt/t1/loop-rgb.html
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2465 Postby greels » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:32 am

Yup, I meant to the "east".....I am just a tad bit stressed at the moment....

If I was a drinking woman, this could be a 2-martini night!
Last edited by greels on Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2466 Postby Derek Ortt » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:32 am

gtsmith wrote:
hurricanefloyd5 wrote:are we at the point to were the stronger this storm gets the farther west it gose and the weaker it is the farther north it gose?????????


it's the reverse...weaker tracks west...strong tracks north...coriolis effect


not true at all


stronger often tracks north because of the deeper steering flow dictating a northern track
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2467 Postby ConvergenceZone » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:35 am

perhaps I'm wrong and this may be a big threat to the USA east coast afterall
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Re:

#2468 Postby Aric Dunn » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:36 am

Aric Dunn wrote:im trying to confirm this ,, but I have extrapolated from earlier postion as well as satellite. The LLC ( small and not so well defined but more than earlier and yesterday) is sitting right on top of St. martin.. confidence level 75%

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/flt/t1/loop-rgb.html


Image
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2469 Postby drezee » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:36 am

If this thing gets vertically stacked, then sky and land is the limit…
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#2470 Postby KWT » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:36 am

Well the one thing we don't want is for recon to find a rapidly strengthening TS, whilst not the most likely options who knows.

Sanibel, yep still bursting as you note with some cold cloud tops still present as well.

Aric, there is nothing there at all, even the pros have said as much, that center is not a center at all and any LLC is forming under the deep convection.
Last edited by KWT on Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2471 Postby BatzVI » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:37 am

I agree with Sanibel, that something should be said....I just spoke to someone at one of the local radio stations and she said, "oh yeah, we just have some rain coming"....I personally think it will be worse than just "some rain"....I'm no expert, but it sure looks like it's ramping up and unfortunately, most people here don't even know it.....
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Re:

#2472 Postby Extremeweatherguy » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:37 am

Aric Dunn wrote:im trying to confirm this ,, but I have extrapolated from earlier postion as well as satellite. The LLC ( small and not so well defined but more than earlier and yesterday) is sitting right on top of St. martin.. confidence level 75%

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/flt/t1/loop-rgb.html
Looking at that loop, you could be correct. That would mean that the LLC and the MLC are not currently stacked though, and that this system would be slower to develop. The center could try to relocate under the MLC as the day goes on though, and that could make things quite interesting. Actually, based on radar, I wouldn't be surprised if that strong MLC is already working down to the surface. We shall see. Recon will tell us a lot.
Last edited by Extremeweatherguy on Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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#2473 Postby gatorcane » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:37 am

sticks out like a sore thumb:

Image
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2474 Postby haml8 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:37 am

ConvergenceZone wrote:perhaps I'm wrong and this may be a big threat to the USA east coast afterall


After reading Accuweather and Jeff Masters earlier this morning, I don't know that anyone can truly have 50% or greater confidence in a track. This system has been unpredictable. I think even Derek would second that.. Just need to wait for recon, so far the information on wind speed is coming back bogus.
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#2475 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:39 am

Image
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2476 Postby Aric Dunn » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:40 am

WOW that is a crazy midlevel circualtion...
weird how the LLC is so far from it with no shear .hhhmmm...

updated radar
Image
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#2477 Postby KWT » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:40 am

Yep haml8, the next 24hr track depends so much on exactly where the LLC decides to set-up. After that its anyones guess, the models are close enough to Florida for people not to take this at all lightly...esp when you've got Derek saying this has a high chance of being a major hurricane if it avoids DR.

Aric, thats because thats not the LLC, pretty much every pro has said there is nothing that far west now....
Last edited by KWT on Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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#2478 Postby abajan » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:41 am

Considering how healthy convection looks now and that 92L's convection has gone through several cycles of waxing at night and waning during the day, I hope it doesn't rapidly intensify tonight.
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#2479 Postby Steve » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:41 am

>>it's the reverse...weaker tracks west...strong tracks north...coriolis effect

Not necessarily. If you have been following along, you would have seen a pro-met's explanation on how 92L could be different in that regard (at a point - hey I missed it too, just saw some reference posts to that discussion). It's buried way back and the search feature is inactive, so good luck finding it. But it might be something worth looking at down the road to see what the reasoning was and how that could apply down the road in future, similar situations.

As for the lead time for Puerto Rico, I'm guessing an STDs would be issued if necessary. They'll get the word out about possible flooding rains/ts conditions if warranted. This isn't a 155mph, mature system, so if it upgrades to something classifiable, they'll get the word out appropriate to the threat. It may be that Puerto Rico is reached in a down pulse if there doesn't yet (or by then) exist a low level center. Clearly the system looks good on IR, but that's IR. And that's the trickiest thing to rely on IMHO.

FWIW, for those calling for an early end of Summer, I would bring you back to 2005. Yours truly got into several arguments with people cancelling the Gulf season in early August due to some frontal activity. I claimed those "cold" fronts were precisely how the summer would be ushered into Dixie with big domes of hot, high pressure building in. Of course there was a difference in that pattern as the highs coming down were merging into the SW Atlantic Ridge, but still. Just because a front comes down doesn't mean that the summer or hurricane season is over - especially when we're still over a day from the mid-point of August. :)

Steve
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Derek Ortt

#2480 Postby Derek Ortt » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:42 am

That looks like a remnant eddy at St. Martin
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