Global model runs discussion

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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5261 Postby Ntxw » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:43 pm

Ntxw wrote:Quick update on the MJO and models forecasting it. GFS sends it back into the wrong phases IMO (remember MJO does not go backwards) and most of the weak convection there is exists in the eastern IO/western Maritime but very incoherent. Euro is expecting a renewal wave in the IO which I am more inclined to believe since there is some +mountain torque event support. There could be development during this period but likely rogue. After that it will take about 30-45 days for the new MJO wave to progress back into the favorable phases which if it gets going soon should be about mid to late August. Still favor that period intact with best climo.


For the most part there has been no renewal of the MJO and it's very weak since mid July. Since one has not begun any aid from rising air through the MJO remains very unlikely so clusters of storms in any basin won't happen for at least a few more weeks. The idea of mid to late august is still a good one though since this fits well with climo with or without the MJO.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5262 Postby wxman57 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:54 pm

12Z GFS indicates no further Atlantic Basin development through August 14th.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5263 Postby cycloneye » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:01 pm

NOAA doubles computer capacity

Whizzing through 213 trillion calculations per second, newly upgraded supercomputers of NOAA’s National Weather Service are now more than twice as fast in processing sophisticated computer models to provide more accurate forecasts further out in time. And as the hurricane season ramps up, forecasters will be armed with an enhanced hurricane model that will improve track and intensity forecasts.

The scientific data and insights that these newly upgraded supercomputers will provide are essential to help government officials, communities, and businesses better understand and manage the risks associated with extreme weather and water events. In support of the president’s Climate Action Plan, the administration will continue to take steps like this to analyze and predict climate variability amid an increasing number of extreme natural events affecting the nation.

“These improvements are just the beginning and build on our previous success. They lay the foundation for further computing enhancements and more accurate forecast models that are within reach,” said Louis W. Uccellini, Ph.D., director of NOAA’s National Weather Service. “These upgrades are a game-changer for the entire public and private weather industry. In addition to the benefits to our own forecasters and products, we will provide our private sector partners with better information to empower them to enhance their services.”

Nicknamed “Tide,” the supercomputer in Reston, Va., and its Orlando-based backup named “Gyre,” are operating with 213 teraflops (TF) — up from the 90 TF with the computers that preceded them. This higher processing power allows the National Weather Service to implement an enhanced Hurricane Weather Research and Forecasting (HWRF) model.

"These forecasting advances can save lives,” said U.S. Sen. Bill Nelson, who helped get funding to add even more capacity to the supercomputer. “It's going to allow for better tracking of life-threatening storms and more accurately predict when and where they'll hit, and with what intensity."

With improved physics and a storm-tracking algorithm, the model has displayed up to a 15 percent improvement in both track and intensity forecasts, compared to last year's version of the model. The upgraded HWRF is also capable of processing real-time data collected from the inner core of a tropical system by the tail Doppler radar attached to NOAA’s P3 hurricane hunter aircraft, data which are expected to produce even greater forecast improvements.

“Next comes the quantum leap,” added Uccellini. Following this round of long-planned upgrades, funding requested in the FY 2014 President’s Budget, in addition to funding provided to NOAA by Congress in the spring of 2013 as part of the Hurricane Sandy emergency supplemental appropriations bill, would increase computing power even further to 1,950 TF by summer 2015. “That gives us the necessary computer power to run an enhanced version of our primary forecast model, the Global Forecast System,” said Uccellini.

"Given recent events like the tornado in Moore, Oklahoma or Superstorm Sandy, federal weather resources and personnel should be considered vital national assets. These upgrades assure world-class capabilities and a continued pathway to keep American lives and property safer," said J. Marshall Shepherd Ph.D., president of the American Meteorological Society and Professor at the University of Georgia. "As a father of two children and a scientist that understands looming weather threats, I take comfort in these developments."

Investments in supercomputing power for weather prediction are another step in NOAA’s efforts to build a Weather-Ready Nation. NOAA’s Weather-Ready Nation initiative, launched nearly two-years ago, has resulted in improvements in products, services and the way information is communicated to the public and partners. These improvements increase resilience to severe weather and reduce the potential of significant societal and economic impacts from severe weather. A Weather-Ready Nation is a society that is prepared for, and responds effectively to, weather-related events.

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories201 ... uters.html
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5264 Postby TheStormExpert » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:15 pm

Ntxw wrote:
Ntxw wrote:Quick update on the MJO and models forecasting it. GFS sends it back into the wrong phases IMO (remember MJO does not go backwards) and most of the weak convection there is exists in the eastern IO/western Maritime but very incoherent. Euro is expecting a renewal wave in the IO which I am more inclined to believe since there is some +mountain torque event support. There could be development during this period but likely rogue. After that it will take about 30-45 days for the new MJO wave to progress back into the favorable phases which if it gets going soon should be about mid to late August. Still favor that period intact with best climo.


For the most part there has been no renewal of the MJO and it's very weak since mid July. Since one has not begun any aid from rising air through the MJO remains very unlikely so clusters of storms in any basin won't happen for at least a few more weeks. The idea of mid to late august is still a good one though since this fits well with climo with or without the MJO.

Shouldn't the MJO start becoming less of an excuse for Tropical Development as we are now starting to get ready to enter the busiest part of the season?
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5265 Postby CYCLONE MIKE » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:18 pm

blp wrote:
cycloneye wrote:Nothing yet from the models as July comes to a close and August arrives. Let's see when the lid goes off.


Yes, not too far away now. We should start to see something by the end of this week as the model starts to reach the peak portion of the season starting in late August. I have noticied the Ridge is forecast to persist in its current state which would be bad news for landfalling areas.


Not so sure about the ridge persisting and being bad news. Until the weekly persistent east trough trough and fronts making it all the way down to gulf coast proves otherwise I think the coasts are actually safer than first thought.
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#5266 Postby Kingarabian » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:20 pm

GFS and CMC have an active Eastern Pacific in the next few weeks. Are they believable? GFS has been really consistent.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5267 Postby CYCLONE MIKE » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:21 pm

wxman57 wrote:12Z GFS indicates no further Atlantic Basin development through August 14th.


I know the model runs can change daily but wouldn't that be a shock to go another two-three weeks with nothing. On second thought the way conditions have been thus far wouldn't be really shocked at all.
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#5268 Postby BigB0882 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:23 pm

I think I would rather have nothing than these poor excuses for tropical cyclones. I want something exciting to follow and Dorian has wasted my time. lol
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Re:

#5269 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:47 pm

Kingarabian wrote:GFS and CMC have an active Eastern Pacific in the next few weeks. Are they believable? GFS has been really consistent.


more reason to think the atlantic will be dead.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5270 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:49 pm

CYCLONE MIKE wrote:
wxman57 wrote:12Z GFS indicates no further Atlantic Basin development through August 14th.


I know the model runs can change daily but wouldn't that be a shock to go another two-three weeks with nothing. On second thought the way conditions have been thus far wouldn't be really shocked at all.



bone dry. im starting to think 2 storms in aug is too high. this looks alot like the dead years of 72/82/83/94. if i could i would lower my seasonal numbers to 11/4/0
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5271 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:55 pm

wxman57 wrote:12Z GFS indicates no further Atlantic Basin development through August 14th.



not a big surprise.
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#5272 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:57 pm

here is an interesting fact. 2010-2012 there were 29 hurricanes and only 2 made landfall in the US. So far, that trend continues.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5273 Postby CYCLONE MIKE » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:22 pm

I think I am going to reduce number of august storms to three. I also find that fact very interesting. And you are correct about trends. The last couple seasons were dominated by troughs and ull's And as you said its continuing and just because we get into august and September I don't see that coming to an end. Maybe slack off a bit but come September fronts should start becoming even more frequent with just as hostile conditions. We shall see. So far as wxman said the gfs is agreeing.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5274 Postby Ntxw » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:22 pm

TheStormExpert wrote:Shouldn't the MJO start becoming less of an excuse for Tropical Development as we are now starting to get ready to enter the busiest part of the season?


It becomes less necessary for storm development yes. That doesn't mean it does not have an influence, doesn't matter what time of the season number of named systems, hurricanes, and majors rise substantially with a favorable MJO relative to that period. Storms will likely have to fight more dry air and higher pressures without the assistance of the MJO should it be unfavorable.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5275 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:51 pm

CYCLONE MIKE wrote:I think I am going to reduce number of august storms to three. I also find that fact very interesting. And you are correct about trends. The last couple seasons were dominated by troughs and ull's And as you said its continuing and just because we get into august and September I don't see that coming to an end. Maybe slack off a bit but come September fronts should start becoming even more frequent with just as hostile conditions. We shall see. So far as wxman said the gfs is agreeing.


this pattern has been persistent for years now. just about everyone said this season would feature the return of the deep tropics and numerous landfalls. just shows how little we actually know. maybe we need an el nino to have a hurricane season.
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#5276 Postby galaxy401 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:53 pm

That could be true but wait until August actually happens before we all start looking into a crystal ball!
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Got my eyes on moving right into Hurricane Alley: Florida.

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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#5277 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:55 pm

Ntxw wrote:
TheStormExpert wrote:Shouldn't the MJO start becoming less of an excuse for Tropical Development as we are now starting to get ready to enter the busiest part of the season?


It becomes less necessary for storm development yes. That doesn't mean it does not have an influence, doesn't matter what time of the season number of named systems, hurricanes, and majors rise substantially with a favorable MJO relative to that period. Storms will likely have to fight more dry air and higher pressures without the assistance of the MJO should it be unfavorable.



i know some forecasts were using a favorable MJO this season as a positive factor for an active MDR. MJO isnt really doing much.
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Re:

#5278 Postby ninel conde » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:57 pm

galaxy401 wrote:That could be true but wait until August actually happens before we all start looking into a crystal ball!


true enough. i certainly expect a burst of 2 or 3 storms sometime between aug15-oct01
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Re:

#5279 Postby Yellow Evan » Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:18 pm

Kingarabian wrote:GFS and CMC have an active Eastern Pacific in the next few weeks. Are they believable? GFS has been really consistent.


They have, but I am really hesitant to believe it.
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Re:

#5280 Postby Alyono » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:35 pm

ninel conde wrote:here is an interesting fact. 2010-2012 there were 29 hurricanes and only 2 made landfall in the US. So far, that trend continues.


3

Irene
Isaac
Sandy (officially a cat 1 strike on NY)
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