Assault weapons ban expires...
Moderator: S2k Moderators
Assault weapons ban expires...
The sad thing is bush supports a military-style assault weapons ban but doesn't want to make a big deal about it, because he doesn't want to get the NRA angry with him. Why keep such a low profile on banning Uzis and other semiautomatic weapons? Both democrat and Republican congressmen are avoiding to renew the ban, because they are also catering to the NRA. I thought we were trying to stop terrorism? Isn't this gonna make it worse? By the way it started in 1994 and will expire in 2004.
Last edited by JQ Public on Thu May 15, 2003 1:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
0 likes
-
Stephanie
- S2K Supporter
- Posts: 23843
- Age: 63
- Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:53 am
- Location: Glassboro, NJ
I support everyone's right to bare arms, but I have a real difficult time supporting the right to carry an uzzi - with so many accidental gunfire deaths, isn't this a bit much? I realize people want to be as well armed as the "bad guy", and if the bad guy wants one bad enough, they'll get their hands on them, but are they REALLY necessary??
0 likes
-
mf_dolphin
- Category 5
- Posts: 17758
- Age: 68
- Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 2:05 pm
- Location: St Petersburg, FL
- Contact:
A weapon is a weapon. A 22 caliber semi-automatic in steady hands is just as deadly as an Uzi. The law of the land still requires a special permit for fully automatic weapons. IMO, the whole deal about "assault" weapons is just political smoke. If we start taking away things that aren't "necessary" then where will it stop? The facts are that criminals will have weapons of all types regardless of the law. I just want the right to have my own to protect my family if I feel it's necessary! Anyone that takes the responsibility of owning weapons also must accept the responsibility of handling and storing them properly. Maybe a little required education about gun safety would be a good thing 
After all, we require proof of proficiency in order to drive a car. Why not the same type of thing for a weapon?
After all, we require proof of proficiency in order to drive a car. Why not the same type of thing for a weapon?
0 likes
-
mf_dolphin
- Category 5
- Posts: 17758
- Age: 68
- Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 2:05 pm
- Location: St Petersburg, FL
- Contact:
What is wrong with a UZI compared to a 45 Automag? We're talking about looks not facts. A semi-automatic UZI is no worse than any other weapon. Keep in mind, protection is not the only reason to own a weapon. Some people just like to collect them, or just have the fun of firing them. The arguement against "assault" weapons is merely a smoke screen against weapons in general. There is no statistical evidence that these type of weapons are responsible for any more deaths than any other weapon. In fact, hand guns are much more commmonly used in a deadly incident. This class of weapon just looks "military" so it's a convienient scare tactic.
0 likes
-
Stephanie
- S2K Supporter
- Posts: 23843
- Age: 63
- Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:53 am
- Location: Glassboro, NJ
mf_dolphin wrote:What is wrong with a UZI compared to a 45 Automag? We're talking about looks not facts. A semi-automatic UZI is no worse than any other weapon. Keep in mind, protection is not the only reason to own a weapon. Some people just like to collect them, or just have the fun of firing them. The arguement against "assault" weapons is merely a smoke screen against weapons in general. There is no statistical evidence that these type of weapons are responsible for any more deaths than any other weapon. In fact, hand guns are much more commmonly used in a deadly incident. This class of weapon just looks "military" so it's a convienient scare tactic.
Well, THEY scare the hell out of me, NOT the scare tactic.
0 likes
-
ColdFront77
-
mf_dolphin
- Category 5
- Posts: 17758
- Age: 68
- Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 2:05 pm
- Location: St Petersburg, FL
- Contact:
I have to disagree Tom. By that logic then bows and arrows should also be outlawed. Even cars. A weapon in qualified hands can be used for sport or fun. The biathalon has been an Olympic sport for years. Skeet, trap, target shooting and even assault courses are sports / recreation involving guns.
My basic point is this. Guns by themselves are not bad. The form of the gun ie assault, pistol, shotgun has absolutely nothing to do with when or how a gun is used. The statistics bear this out. btw Stephanie, any gun in the hands of someone who doesn't take it deadly serious scares me too
My basic point is this. Guns by themselves are not bad. The form of the gun ie assault, pistol, shotgun has absolutely nothing to do with when or how a gun is used. The statistics bear this out. btw Stephanie, any gun in the hands of someone who doesn't take it deadly serious scares me too
0 likes
-
ColdFront77
I couldn't resist
-
streetsoldier
- Retired Staff
- Posts: 9705
- Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:33 pm
- Location: Under the rainbow
OK, time for the streetsoldier to come in and straighten out the confusion; now, LISTEN UP...
The ban on "assault weapons" was and is nothing more than a "feel-good" plan based on COSMETIC APPEARANCES. Taking away the external pistol grip, or "flash suppresor", or "extra-capacity magazine" does nothing to alter the FUNCTION of any given rifle...a semi-automatic will still fire ONE ROUND AT A TIME, each round requiring ONE squeeze of the trigger.
NONE of the weapons will fire full-automatic blasts (that is, depressing the trigger once and having the weapon discharge every round while keeping the trigger down). No citizen may own a "full-auto" weapon, and this has been on the books since 1934.
One squeeze = One round, people. The LOOKS of the gun (Uzi, AK-47, StG-58, CETME, G-3, AR-15/M-16, etc.) have nothing to do with the FUNCTION at all. A "normal"-looking semi-auto rifle (Ruger, Remington, Winchester, etc.) still fires in the SAME WAY, ONE ROUND AT A TIME...and is just as "dangerous" as the cosmeticallly-enhanced models I have already referred to above.
This "ban" was and is a prelude to ultimate confiscation of ALL privately-owned firearms by the ATF, and was so designed; even the bill's writers and original sponsors, Senators Charles Schumer (D, NY) and Diane Feinstein (D, CA) have openly admitted this was its aim.
"If (the sponsors of this legislation) can "demonize" one or more types of firearms successfully, further laws can then be passed and implemented to assure UNIVERSAL CONFISCATION in this country"...that means your BB guns, air guns, water pistols and Great-Grandpa's old WW II Enfield, Springfield, Mauser or Garand...and these people wil not rest until every American is rendered disarmed, and therefore helpless to defend themselves from criminals, or resist future "dead-of-the-night" Federal assaults upon them while within the safety of their own homes.
I have seen many of you rise up against what you see as a "police state" on these very pages...and you are correct in so doing. Know, then, what disarming private citizens will accomplish in MAKING this "police state" a gruesome reality. So-called "assault" rifles being banned/confiscated is but another step on the way to tyranny.
The ban on "assault weapons" was and is nothing more than a "feel-good" plan based on COSMETIC APPEARANCES. Taking away the external pistol grip, or "flash suppresor", or "extra-capacity magazine" does nothing to alter the FUNCTION of any given rifle...a semi-automatic will still fire ONE ROUND AT A TIME, each round requiring ONE squeeze of the trigger.
NONE of the weapons will fire full-automatic blasts (that is, depressing the trigger once and having the weapon discharge every round while keeping the trigger down). No citizen may own a "full-auto" weapon, and this has been on the books since 1934.
One squeeze = One round, people. The LOOKS of the gun (Uzi, AK-47, StG-58, CETME, G-3, AR-15/M-16, etc.) have nothing to do with the FUNCTION at all. A "normal"-looking semi-auto rifle (Ruger, Remington, Winchester, etc.) still fires in the SAME WAY, ONE ROUND AT A TIME...and is just as "dangerous" as the cosmeticallly-enhanced models I have already referred to above.
This "ban" was and is a prelude to ultimate confiscation of ALL privately-owned firearms by the ATF, and was so designed; even the bill's writers and original sponsors, Senators Charles Schumer (D, NY) and Diane Feinstein (D, CA) have openly admitted this was its aim.
"If (the sponsors of this legislation) can "demonize" one or more types of firearms successfully, further laws can then be passed and implemented to assure UNIVERSAL CONFISCATION in this country"...that means your BB guns, air guns, water pistols and Great-Grandpa's old WW II Enfield, Springfield, Mauser or Garand...and these people wil not rest until every American is rendered disarmed, and therefore helpless to defend themselves from criminals, or resist future "dead-of-the-night" Federal assaults upon them while within the safety of their own homes.
I have seen many of you rise up against what you see as a "police state" on these very pages...and you are correct in so doing. Know, then, what disarming private citizens will accomplish in MAKING this "police state" a gruesome reality. So-called "assault" rifles being banned/confiscated is but another step on the way to tyranny.
0 likes
-
mf_dolphin
- Category 5
- Posts: 17758
- Age: 68
- Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 2:05 pm
- Location: St Petersburg, FL
- Contact:
I agree wholeheartedly Bill. However, there are provisions where a private citizen may in fact own a fully automatic weapon. If I remember right you have to apply for a special license through the ATF as a collector. Not real sure about the details but I know it can be done. Other than that the only other ones belong to the criminals...
0 likes
-
streetsoldier
- Retired Staff
- Posts: 9705
- Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:33 pm
- Location: Under the rainbow
Yes, Marshall, that would be the ATF Class III license; cost (if the applicant qualifies) is $200 per year, with at least 2 ATF inspections required of the licensee annually...to view the firearms, check serial numbers. models, etc., see that they are properly secured, not altered...you get the idea.
Fact is, less than 200 people have the Class III licenses, and most of these are police armorers..the private citizen having one is a rarity (although I do know of three who have them).
But to address the Uzi...in its original, full-auto form, it was the "submachine gun of choice" for the Western powers; in its "legal" semi-auto form, all you have is a nine-pound, 9mm long-barreled PISTOL..again, it can only fire one shot per squeeze of the trigger...and I wouldn't even try to conceal one, which is impossible.
More, "full-auto" assemblies to convert the Uzi are available only to Class III licensees under strictly controlled circumstances ("show cause" required, usually by a police department or other law-enforcement agency...never to private citizens)...and, even there, one would have to know where to get the parts and drilling templates necessary to accomplish this (only one firm has them, and they only sell to "authorized" authorities.).
Fact is, less than 200 people have the Class III licenses, and most of these are police armorers..the private citizen having one is a rarity (although I do know of three who have them).
But to address the Uzi...in its original, full-auto form, it was the "submachine gun of choice" for the Western powers; in its "legal" semi-auto form, all you have is a nine-pound, 9mm long-barreled PISTOL..again, it can only fire one shot per squeeze of the trigger...and I wouldn't even try to conceal one, which is impossible.
More, "full-auto" assemblies to convert the Uzi are available only to Class III licensees under strictly controlled circumstances ("show cause" required, usually by a police department or other law-enforcement agency...never to private citizens)...and, even there, one would have to know where to get the parts and drilling templates necessary to accomplish this (only one firm has them, and they only sell to "authorized" authorities.).
0 likes
-
streetsoldier
- Retired Staff
- Posts: 9705
- Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:33 pm
- Location: Under the rainbow
coriolis, you are in luck! Federal Arms Corporation (http://www.gunsnstuff.com) has an exclusive contract with Auto-Ordnance to market semi-auto versions of both the 1927A-1 and later M-1 versions of he Thompson submachine guns. These are NOT "full-auto", and have 16" barrels (the originals had 10") to meet strict ATF guidelines, but they do have (1927A-1 only) the "Cutt's Compensator" attached to the barrel end.
This "compensator" greatly reduces the tremendous recoil when fired in full-auto "bursts"...without which, the gun will "walk" upwards on the shooter, necessitating firing from "8 o'clock to 2 o'clock" across the targeted area.
As to the military, the Thompson ("Chicago Piano", "burp gun", Tommy gun", etc.) was originally designed for WW I troops, but the Great War ended before they were finished with the prototypes. They were issued and used extensively in WW II (my Dad, a troop-carrier pilot, had one issued to him...a 1928A-5, without buttstock); most were the later, simpler M-1 variant with flat, horizontal fore-ends and no "select-fire" option (the M-1 could only use the 30-round "stick" magazine; the 1927s/28s could use either a 50-round "drum" or a "stick").
The US, France, Russia and the UK/Commonwealth countries used over 2,500,000 Thompsons during WW II, coriolis; most are either "de-milled" for collectors or still in Government storage.
This "compensator" greatly reduces the tremendous recoil when fired in full-auto "bursts"...without which, the gun will "walk" upwards on the shooter, necessitating firing from "8 o'clock to 2 o'clock" across the targeted area.
As to the military, the Thompson ("Chicago Piano", "burp gun", Tommy gun", etc.) was originally designed for WW I troops, but the Great War ended before they were finished with the prototypes. They were issued and used extensively in WW II (my Dad, a troop-carrier pilot, had one issued to him...a 1928A-5, without buttstock); most were the later, simpler M-1 variant with flat, horizontal fore-ends and no "select-fire" option (the M-1 could only use the 30-round "stick" magazine; the 1927s/28s could use either a 50-round "drum" or a "stick").
The US, France, Russia and the UK/Commonwealth countries used over 2,500,000 Thompsons during WW II, coriolis; most are either "de-milled" for collectors or still in Government storage.
Last edited by streetsoldier on Fri May 16, 2003 10:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
0 likes
-
mf_dolphin
- Category 5
- Posts: 17758
- Age: 68
- Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 2:05 pm
- Location: St Petersburg, FL
- Contact:
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests