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Discuss the recovery and aftermath of landfalling hurricanes. Please be sensitive to those that have been directly impacted. Political threads will be deleted without notice. This is the place to come together not divide.

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shaggy
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#281 Postby shaggy » Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:49 pm

the mayor of NO sat on his hands directly after the storm and thought they might be in the clear and that delay was a major mistake.Law enforcement should have been in place to move into and around the city immediatley folllowing the winds and the Gov should have had the NG called up and at the ready the second the winds laid up.Thats how they do it here in NC and when we had the terrible floooding from floyd there was very little looting and it never got to the state that NO is in now.
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#282 Postby ChaserUK » Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:50 pm

scanner back online - thank you for your help! Have to say I have Fox on 24/7 since Sunday and this helps greatly. Am going to send link to my man in the field - Jim Bartlett (see his site here http://www.jwbartlett.com). He is in NO at the moment and has been helping out with the National Guard and Coast Guard - from what I have heard he has seen some dire scenes. If interested see me chasing Isabel after clicking on the Storm Chasing Page and click on the trailer link.

This is a weather event we love for its beauty and power but not for its destructiveness! Needless to say when we chase we ensure we are not any burden on local recovery efforts and help out where we can! It just so happens my visa did not come through in time on this occasion.
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MBismyPlayground
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#283 Postby MBismyPlayground » Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:52 pm

have 58 personell from Bellechor?? OK......good.
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#284 Postby myred » Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:56 pm

MBismyPlayground wrote:
myred wrote:I do believe that we can use the national gaurd and not the US military. All they have to do is put them in law enforcement mode and arm them and not just rescue mode.


Unfortunatly I beleive that without martial law, all is lost.
The national Guard cannot empliment martial law.
We need soldiers on the ground, Lock and Loaded. This is like watching a war.....right in our own backyard. Scary thought too. If this is how we handle things such as a natural disaster, how will handle anything else??
This can only gives the terrorists ideas of where the breach is...... In the south.


My thinking is that the national guard is an extension of the US miitary. They are trained and could handle the job. Like you said lock and load. Maybe I am wrong, but at least it would protect the posse comitatus laws of the us constitution.
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#285 Postby thunderchief » Thu Sep 01, 2005 4:10 pm

Someone keeps calling the emergency operations center and isnt getting any response.
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MBismyPlayground
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#286 Postby MBismyPlayground » Thu Sep 01, 2005 5:14 pm

myred wrote:
MBismyPlayground wrote:
myred wrote:I do believe that we can use the national gaurd and not the US military. All they have to do is put them in law enforcement mode and arm them and not just rescue mode.


Unfortunatly I beleive that without martial law, all is lost.
The national Guard cannot empliment martial law.
We need soldiers on the ground, Lock and Loaded. This is like watching a war.....right in our own backyard. Scary thought too. If this is how we handle things such as a natural disaster, how will handle anything else??
This can only gives the terrorists ideas of where the breach is...... In the south.


My thinking is that the national guard is an extension of the US miitary. They are trained and could handle the job. Like you said lock and load. Maybe I am wrong, but at least it would protect the posse comitatus laws of the us constitution.


Actually the Nat Guard have their hands tied a little more tightly.
They can only defend themselves if they feel that their life is in imminent danger. Although an extension, right now, in the capacity in which they have been deployed, they are basically controlled by the state(govenor).
It will definitly all fall into a very gray area, and most guard soldiers are very aware of the fact they need to walk that fine line.
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myred
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#287 Postby myred » Thu Sep 01, 2005 6:29 pm

Ok I m with you, call in anybody who can handle this. The world is watching and nevermind the embarrassment there are still thousands suffering.....
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#288 Postby nutzforweather » Thu Sep 01, 2005 8:53 pm

ncdowneast wrote:the mayor of NO sat on his hands directly after the storm and thought they might be in the clear and that delay was a major mistake.Law enforcement should have been in place to move into and around the city immediatley folllowing the winds and the Gov should have had the NG called up and at the ready the second the winds laid up.Thats how they do it here in NC and when we had the terrible floooding from floyd there was very little looting and it never got to the state that NO is in now.


I dont know what YOU have been watching, but he has been begging for federal assistance since the beginning of all of this and so has the Governor..but let's not get'political' and discuss the 'geetar' strumming 24 hours after a request for federal help from Nadin. After surviving GF North Dakota, I can promise you, it IS NOT the same..

Everyone threw a fit when Schiavo was thirsty, where is the outrage NOW when old people and babies are dying?
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#289 Postby MBismyPlayground » Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:27 pm

Anyone listening tonight??
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#290 Postby jopatura » Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:36 pm

I was planning to around 10:30pm. I'm from Houston, near the Astrodome, so I've been keeping an ear on that stuff tonight. After the mainstream stuff stops though, I'm planning on it.
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#291 Postby BroncoChuck » Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:38 pm

im listening off and on.... sounded like they lost radio contact on a supply drop earlier. Had to send a chopper out to locate...
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#292 Postby MBismyPlayground » Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:44 pm

trying to load the buses and situation is turning "viotale" Seems they don't have local NO or state police support. Sounds stressed big time. Guess people are trying to ambush the buses as they are loading.

Also somene mentioned there are only 1600 left at the shelter and they will be ferried out tomorrow?????
What about the Convention Center?
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#293 Postby BroncoChuck » Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:01 pm

I think the Convention Center is the last on the list.... makes no sence to me since there is what?? 10,000+ people there too right?

Per all the reports Ive seen on tv and here no real supply drops have been made there....??

Guess they figure if they wait longer there will be less people to evacuate since they will all just dry up from lack of water and die......

very sad :(
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#294 Postby MBismyPlayground » Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:56 pm

BroncoChuck wrote:I think the Convention Center is the last on the list.... makes no sence to me since there is what?? 10,000+ people there too right?

Per all the reports Ive seen on tv and here no real supply drops have been made there....??

Guess they figure if they wait longer there will be less people to evacuate since they will all just dry up from lack of water and die......

very sad :(

Eventually they got some local/state police to help in loading the buses.Apparently someone had to chew someone else out to get it done.
I know they have loaded some helo's with some patients. They now have a load of MRE's somewhere going somewhere. Having trouble finding Sgt Maj Howe, who many have been looking for. Apparently there are also some more buses going to the French Quarter.
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#295 Postby smashmode » Fri Sep 02, 2005 12:23 am

Some sort of fire at the convention center.
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#296 Postby jasons2k » Fri Sep 02, 2005 12:27 am

smashmode wrote:Some sort of fire at the convention center.


Oh great, the hits keep a coming :(
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#297 Postby smashmode » Fri Sep 02, 2005 12:28 am

It is a fluid situation..we've had hostile takeover of bus, a black man in a maxima that has armed robbery three folks..

people driving wrong ways..

I mean..the night is young.
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oneness
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#298 Postby oneness » Fri Sep 02, 2005 12:50 am

Lori wrote:I'm trying to figure out why Govt officials are saying everything is under control.

Who are they trying to convince?

people trapped in New Orleans, the media, the police and national guard,
tv viewers and internet users have eyes and ears.

IMO

Pretending something is ok when it really isn't just makes it harder to solve the problem.



And misreading it does the same, the Governor didn't say it was "under control", she said they were doing everything possible with 100% of what they have (which is clearly nowhere near enough), and that Federal resources were finally beginning to appear today, but much more is needed, immediately.

These emergency workers are also extremely stressed and sleep deprived, and I can see the pain in their eyes and grim expressions. It’s obvious the effort has been ineffectual, so far, in a very tragic way. Mayor Nagin himself made it completely clear (if I remember it was Saturday evening at 10:05 PM on 4WWL TV, after taking the call from the NHC), that after this storm had passed, anyone remaining in the city may be trapped in a catastrophically damaged and non-functional city, with no food, no water, no power, no sewage, no shelter, no police, no transport, a city full of toxic diseased swamp waters, debris and of course, decomposing bodies and looters.

He did warn of this, that it very well may occur, and TV streams I watched before the storm were pretty straight-up about the dangers as well.

It happened as warned.

There's no quick-fixes, mainly because far too many people decided, for whatever reasons (not condemning here), to stay after those warnings.

It wasn't called the "worst-case scenario" for nothing.

Blaming inadequate officialdom now, is only going to burden them with a huge extra stress, which they really don't need right now, and I fear some of them may not be able to take it in the coming days of strident criticism and personal attacks.

Criticism has a place, but this is not the time or place for it.

I don't want to see these people become inundated with that right now, and maybe rendered even more ineffective over coming days, only because more people in LA may suffer if these people start to come apart.

I’m not saying don’t criticise, but please consider the toll if you do criticise, and please, you don't have to spin it positively or negatively, just for goodness sake, make it constructive, accurate and based upon the known and observable facts.

2 cents
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#299 Postby Lori » Fri Sep 02, 2005 1:17 am

May God bless Gov Blanco and give her the strength,wisdom,and comfort in this time of terrible trial. May God protect her watch over her.

Amen
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#300 Postby jasons2k » Fri Sep 02, 2005 1:21 am

Amyone know about the fire situation?
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