NWS employees give Senator Santorum the old 1-2!

[jrod]

Isnt this the same guy who proposed the NWS to charge for its services?


I can't believe he would say such things, this guy has no business being a leader. However being a lifelong citizen in Florida I have seen some idiotic canidates get elected and re-elected. The next election us(the weather world) will need to get the word out about him, odds are no one else will and the average voter has a memory of two week hence his comments will be long forgoten by most.

[jrod]

Also if this is the same guy who wants the NWS to be a pay service, I've heard through the grapevine that he has connections with accuweather and that is his motive for all of this. Make the NWS and NHC look bad while making Accuweather look great.

[jasons2k]

I find most of the posts here a bit disingenuous to say the least. I may get banned for saying this but the mods here seem to wield their power swiftly when a person posting here is of the right side of the political spectrum, but when it's a conservative under the gun, its fair game. Has this board turned into a MoveOn.org or Democratic Underground mouthpiece? Bottom line is it wasn’t Rick Santorum’s job to bring the levee problem up. You all need to direct your venom at Mary Landrieu who by the way is on the Appropriations Committee and could have brought the problem up many times in her tenure, but didn’t. Her family has been in Louisiana politics for years and where have the billions been spent? Hmmmm??? Why no criticism of Sheila Jackson Lee and the congressional black caucus for their idiotic statements. Or the Democratic hacks like Hillary Clinton, Dick Durbin and Nancy Pellosi jumping all over this like a German Shepard on read meat for political gain. So save the false indignation unless you’re willing to apply the same standard to your own party apparatchiks

Wrong. I'm a member of Freerepublic.com, have been for nearly 7 years (screenname is flair2000), and several Freepers and myself have been railing against Santorum over his idiotic comments and actions. Corruption=corruption, regardless of whether the officeholder has (R) or (D) after their name. If a there were a Democratic senator from Pennsylvania taking campaign cash from a large Pennsylvania based private weather firm, and the aformentioned senator was pushing a bill to stop public dissemination of weather information and shift it to the private sector, and the aformentioned private large Pennsylvania based weather firm stood to make a mint since they just so happened to have bunched all the info up into a "premium" site, I would be shouting and screaming just as hard. Just because the aformentioned senator happens to be a Republican makes no difference to me. His attacks on the NHC and NWS are beyond contempt.

Exactly!! I am a conservative myself and if there is anything disingenuous here, it's Santorum's comments, or worse, defending him simply because he happens to be a Republican.

[vbhoutex]

First of all lwg8tr this thread was about a particular subject and had/has nothing to do with Republican vs. Democrat, conservative vs liberal, etc. Or at least it didn't until you tried to turn it into a political debate. I have to stop there on my further comments since I am part of the staff here. Suffice it to say I find you post offensive!!!

[btangy]

The remarks by Rick Santorum are just reflective of the general ignorance of meteorology, and science in general, among our senators and representatives. They don't have a grasp of the complexity in trying to accurately forecast hurricanes and must rely on what little they can learn from their interns and subcommittee meetings interviewing Max Mayfield, etc.. This will not change until the meteorology/atmospheric sci community in academia exerts more political influence. Unfortunately, most would rather not get involved including myself.

[x-y-no]

I find most of the posts here a bit disingenuous to say the least. I may get banned for saying this but the mods here seem to wield their power swiftly when a person posting here is of the right side of the political spectrum, but when it's a conservative under the gun, its fair game.

Oh ... my ...

Thanks for the laugh!

Just to elucidate ... I think the mods here do a balanced job, for the most part. But they definitely do not lean left.

[Stratosphere747]

I find most of the posts here a bit disingenuous to say the least. I may get banned for saying this but the mods here seem to wield their power swiftly when a person posting here is of the right side of the political spectrum, but when it's a conservative under the gun, its fair game.

Oh ... my ...

Thanks for the laugh!

Just to elucidate ... I think the mods here do a balanced job, for the most part. But they definitely do not lean left.

I got a chuckle out of that myself. Obviously he/she was not a visitor to the PA...

[Windy]

I find most of the posts here a bit disingenuous to say the least. I may get banned for saying this but the mods here seem to wield their power swiftly when a person posting here is of the right side of the political spectrum, but when it's a conservative under the gun, its fair game.

Dear God, how long have you been on this site? Five minutes? Nearly all of the mods and definately all of the admins are conservative. You're clearly living on a different planet if you think that they're part of the liberal conspiricy!

[SkeetoBite]

I find most of the posts here a bit disingenuous to say the least.....

1. This is not a political issue. See all that cool content on the home page of this site? See all those free hurricane track maps found on my site? This bill will seek to limit the ditribution of the data WE use to provide YOU this FREE service, at OUR expense. Of course, nothing has been said about how the data will be made available to those who provide free weather services, but you can be sure that our access will be severely limited.

2. As you sit there typing out your mindless banter and political rhetoric, understand this; it's people just like you who are causing the great divide in our nation. You have so clearly drawn your line here today. Rick Santorum is the issue, and he is on the wrong side of this issue. Nobody gives a damn what party he's with. You are creating political issues where none exist.

Sorry for yelling, that just pissesme off.

[bvigal]

I find most of the posts here a bit disingenuous to say the least. ... but when it's a conservative under the gun, its fair game.

As a conservative myself, my opinion of Santorum is, he's a crook - pure and simple. He's willing to make all taxpayers chuck up some money into coffers of one of his major campaign contributors, AccuWeather, for his own benefit. Sure, he can say it's to protect jobs in his home state, but that's bunk.

I do not intend to pay for something I use every day, when I paid for years for the technology to produce it. The internet is simply "how things are done" these days, and as long as NWS is putting the data there, they may as well share it with the public. If that hurts private industry because they were doing it first, TOO BAD!!!

I'm not going down without a nasty fight, including emails to many Senators and the White House about just what a selfish, greedy crook this guy is!!

[ncbird]

I don't care if they

Santorum needs get the boot in the rump right out the door. Time for me to go on a letter writting spree and filling up some mail boxes.

[f5]

Remember NHC had Ophelia going north and Accuweather had Ophelia going west thats a 90 degree angle in geometry then the next day Accuweather had Ophelia following the NHC track.

[DoctorHurricane2003]

Bob Casey for U.S. Senate, 2006!

(I cannot STAND Rick Santorum, and for multiple reasons at that!)

[SkeetoBite]

Betcha' can't find this "Kinder-Cast" map on the Accu Weather website.

This is the company that is supporting Rick Santorum in his bid to turn control of taxpayer funded weather data over to the private sector.

As Hurricane Ophelia 2005 was clearly moving NNE, Accu Weather Meteoroligist Joe Bastardi claims that "extensive research" went into making this forecast map and challenged the National Hurricane Center in their forecasting skills. In his tropical update video, Mr. Bastardi went on the ridicule the NHC and stated "now we'll see who's right". Indeed we have.

Don't even get me started on Francis 2004, which left 15 people dead. There were 10 killed in Florida, 2 in Georgia and 1 in South Carolina. The Outer Banks are still waiting for this hurricane to arrive.

Accu Weather is a Trademark of Accu Weather, Inc.

[f5]

Betcha' can't find this "Kinder-Cast" map on the Accu Weather website.

This is the company that is supporting Rick Santorum in his bid to turn control of taxpayer funded weather data over to the private sector.

As Hurricane Ophelia 2005 was clearly moving NNE, Accu Weather Meteoroligist Joe Bastardi claims that "extensive research" went into making this forecast map and challenged the National Hurricane Center in their forecasting skills. In his tropical update video, Mr. Bastardi went on the ridicule the NHC and stated "now we'll see who's right". Indeed we have.

Don't even get me started on Francis 2004, which left 15 people dead. There were 10 killed in Florida, 2 in Georgia and 1 in South Carolina. The Outer Banks are still waiting for this hurricane to arrive.

Accu Weather is a Trademark of Accu Weather, Inc.

Thats the Track i was trying to describe in my post thanks!!See that 90 degree angle folks?turns out they lost and conceed to the NHC track

[Scott_inVA]

I have sent the following letter by facsimilie and US mail to WITF-FM Radio and Senator Santorum's Washington DC office:

Regarding a recent interview,

I am writing to express the hope your radio station has or will afford an opportunity for someone to refute factually inaccurate comments on WITF-FM on September 8, 2005. I own a commercial weather domain and produce exclusive hurricane forecasts and modeling graphics utilized by private citizens, government EOCs and the military. As such, I have extensive knowledge of this hurricane and forecasting in advance of all three land falls.

Senator Santorum made the following statements: "the weather service gave no warning, or not sufficient warning in my opinion, as to the effects when it came on land in Florida as a Category One hurricane. Predictions were that it wasn't going to go out to the gulf and affect the western gulf coast, it was going to sort of head up to Florida or go right off the coast of Florida." are intentional remarks meant to demean NOAA and promote his local constituency. One hopes your News Department is aware of this and responsibly offered facts to the contrary.

My web site is eager to provide you data illustrating Santorum's comments are misleading, dangerous and patently false. Among his numerous ill-informed comments was the reference to the "weather service"; in fact these forecasts come from the National Hurricane Center, not a vague weather service.

Ample Florida warnings and advisories were in affect prior to Katrina's Florida landfall as a Category 1 hurricane.
As of the morning of Friday 8/26 The National Hurricane Center issued no "prediction" Katrina would "sort of head up to Florida or go right off the coast of Florida". In fact, every forecast issued after 8AM on 8/26/05 clearly showed a likely landfall in the vicinity of Louisiana/Mississippi/western Alabama. Nearly seventy-two hours advance notice was given to all who listened (apparently the Senator did not). The National Hurricane Center and National Weather Service ominous warnings and forecast track verified with such precision as to have earned congratulations from virtually every meteorologist and hurricane forecaster in the United States.

I recognize Senator Santorum is attempting to besmirch NOAA to keep alive his pro-Accuweather pending legislation; however his inaccurate statements and mudslinging are reprehensible in time of National emergency. They also could mislead the public into believing the warnings were wrong and therefore should not be seriously taken in the future. Responsible journalism dictates a balanced story be presented to your listeners. I am happy to provide information, comments or graphics toward that end.

Respectfully submitted,


Scott M. Lancey
Mid-Atlantic WX.com
Lexington, Virginia

I am in Virginia, so no one will care but it is vital to keep people's feet to the fire.

[ncbird]

Well said Scott. Nice to see someone standing up and doing something.

[jasons2k]

Betcha' can't find this "Kinder-Cast" map on the Accu Weather website.

This is the company that is supporting Rick Santorum in his bid to turn control of taxpayer funded weather data over to the private sector.

As Hurricane Ophelia 2005 was clearly moving NNE, Accu Weather Meteoroligist Joe Bastardi claims that "extensive research" went into making this forecast map and challenged the National Hurricane Center in their forecasting skills. In his tropical update video, Mr. Bastardi went on the ridicule the NHC and stated "now we'll see who's right". Indeed we have.

Don't even get me started on Francis 2004, which left 15 people dead. There were 10 killed in Florida, 2 in Georgia and 1 in South Carolina. The Outer Banks are still waiting for this hurricane to arrive.

Accu Weather is a Trademark of Accu Weather, Inc.

Oh geez, there's plenty of instances where the opposite is just as true as well. Don't cherry pick. It's not like many of us on this board didn't think the very same, and the GFDL and Euro ideas had merit at the time. As much as I disagree with the Santorum Bill, JB does have his points. Here is JB from today:

"SATURDAY 9 AM. What is Miami up to? The lowering of the this storm this morning...again to a tropical storm is simply flabbergasting. The least they could have done was wait till the plane got in there, but what was the assumption, it was back to 992. Big deal...instead we are finding that its 976 mb.

This is what I keep trying to preach, that there has to be consistency. A storm that deep over that water has to have the wind somewhere to produce the convergence needed for what it now is ..a 90 mph hurricane. The fact the person is using the latest estimation techniques from instruments based on non recon, ( wind estimating devices from satellite) is meaning he is allowing theory to take over against established history.

This is why pressure has to be factored in and the Saffir Simpson scale should be a foundation.

So the game of musical intensity chairs continues and we are expected to sit here and say.,,what...we accept everything.

Again this is not a criticism of a future event, just an observation on something that I think has to be brought under control."

[donsutherland1]

Lwg8tr,

Several points:

1) I don't believe you're aware of Senator Santorum's proposed legislation, S.786: The National Weather Service Duties Act. In that piece of legislation, he is seeking to dramatically scale back the extent of information e.g., high quality radar data, etc. that the NWS can offer the general public.

2) It is in this context--not that Senator Santorum happens to be a conservative Republican--that I'm criticizing him. The Senator, in spite of being the #3 Member of the Majority Leadership has not found a single co-sponsor for his legislation since he introduced it on April 14.

3) In my view, the Senator is desperately trying to demonstrate a case for the legislation that has not garnered support on account of its own worth. Hence, he is trying to claim that the NWS/NHC failed badly with respect to Katrina. If he can succeed, then suddenly it would appear that his legislation is necessary.

4) The reality is that the NWS/NHC did not fail. Their forecasts for Katrina's landfall--both in Louisiana/Mississippi and earlier in Florida--were highly accurate and made well in advance. They did not fail to provide sufficient warning.

5) It is this conduct alone that I find unethical.

6) As for my own political ideology, let's just say that I find Michael Moore's viewpoints, those of the Democratic Underground, and those of Moveon.org to be generally extreme. My complaint about Senator Santorum has nothing to do with political ideology. It has everything to do with a bad piece of legislation that I oppose and his unethical effort to exploit the tragedy to gain advantage for that legislation.

7) There's plenty of failure with regard to the slow disaster response at the local, state, and federal levels. People from both political parties have a degree of responsibility. At the same time, people from all levels of government and both parties have also performed heroically, as well. The Military has been just outstanding in its efforts.

[jasons2k]

Lwg8tr,

Several points:

1) I don't believe you're aware of Senator Santorum's proposed legislation, S.786: The National Weather Service Duties Act. In that piece of legislation, he is seeking to dramatically scale back the extent of information e.g., high quality radar data, etc. that the NWS can offer the general public.

2) It is in this context--not that Senator Santorum happens to be a conservative Republican--that I'm criticizing him. The Senator, in spite of being the #3 Member of the Majority Leadership has not found a single co-sponsor for his legislation since he introduced it on April 14.

3) In my view, the Senator is desperately trying to demonstrate a case for the legislation that has not garnered support on account of its own worth. Hence, he is trying to claim that the NWS/NHC failed badly with respect to Katrina. If he can succeed, then suddenly it would appear that his legislation is necessary.

4) The reality is that the NWS/NHC did not fail. Their forecasts for Katrina's landfall--both in Louisiana/Mississippi and earlier in Florida--were highly accurate and made well in advance. They did not fail to provide sufficient warning.

5) It is this conduct alone that I find unethical.

6) As for my own political ideology, let's just say that I find Michael Moore's viewpoints, those of the Democratic Underground, and those of Moveon.org to be generally extreme. My complaint about Senator Santorum has nothing to do with political ideology. It has everything to do with a bad piece of legislation that I oppose and his unethical effort to exploit the tragedy to gain advantage for that legislation.

7) There's plenty of failure with regard to the slow disaster response at the local, state, and federal levels. People from both political parties have a degree of responsibility. At the same time, people from all levels of government and both parties have also performed heroically, as well. The Military has been just outstanding in its efforts.

Well stated; couldn't agree more. Kudos to you!