VP Cheney accidentally shoots someone while hunting

[azsnowman]

If you have a loaded gun in your hand it is YOUR responsiblity to not shoot the people around you... even if Whittington didnt say he was there, it is 100% the person holding the gun's fault.

100% true from any reasonable gun safety standpoint. Also, any of the rest of us would be facing a hefty fine at the least right now, and possible charges of criminal negligence.

AMEN and AMEN! Like I posted earlier, I spent 16 hours on advanced weapons training last weekend and there is NO excuse for negligence on ANYONES' part.....it doesn't matter WHO it is. We had 2 instructors on the range and ANY minor infraction of the basic safety rules and you were BOOTED off the range, no questions asked and you failed!

Dennis

[southerngale]

If you have a loaded gun in your hand it is YOUR responsiblity to not shoot the people around you... even if Whittington didnt say he was there, it is 100% the person holding the gun's fault. And the thing that makes me most uncomfortable is that we didn't find out that the Vice President of the United States had shot somebody until the ranch owner told her local newspaper (at what point would he have said something?!). If we're paying his salary I'd like to hear that he's shot someone from him and not from some random lady in Texas.

At that point. He told her to tell.

That's why the news corp was whining so much yesterday. They weren't told first.


As to the point about it being his responsibility, I agree to a certain extent. However, from what I understand about quail hunting (which isn't much), once he was lined up to shoot, he wouldn't have been able to see someone cross into that line where Whittington went un-announced and was sprayed with pellets. A truly tragic accident nonetheless.

[Stephanie]

I think that the news should've been handled by the White House initially, but I could see where Cheney was probably not thinking about who should handle this because of what just happened.

[SamSagnella]

At that point. He told her to tell.

He says they agreed on Saturday that she would say something, yet she waited til Sunday to do so. My statement earlier was questioning at what point would Cheney have said "hey, she's taking too long...I'm gonna speak up." It just really makes it seem that if she hadn't said anything that no one would have.

That's why the news corp was whining so much yesterday. They weren't told first.

THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE TOLD FIRST... it is not the responsibility of random ranch owners to tell us when the freaking VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES shoots someone. We literally pay for every dime Dick Cheney spends on anything he does...therefore I think it's only fair to ask that in return he tell us when he shoots someone. IMO, the VP's office should have issued a statement within the first couple of hours. (see what the former WH press secy would have done)

As to the point about it being his responsibility, I agree to a certain extent. However, from what I understand about quail hunting (which isn't much), once he was lined up to shoot, he wouldn't have been able to see someone cross into that line where Whittington went un-announced and was sprayed with pellets. A truly tragic accident nonetheless.

While I wholeheartedly agree with you that this was a tragic accident, it is rediculous to blame ANYONE but the person who pulled the trigger (in this case, Cheney). I'm sure he feels terrible about the whole thing (we all would if we shot a friend), but if you have a loaded gun in your hand you better be freaking positive that you're not going to hit someone by mistake when you pull the trigger. If you are in a position where you wouldn't be able to see someone if they were there, what business do you have pointing a gun in that direction?

[GalvestonDuck]

If you have a loaded gun in your hand it is YOUR responsiblity to not shoot the people around you... even if Whittington didnt say he was there, it is 100% the person holding the gun's fault.

100% true from any reasonable gun safety standpoint. Also, any of the rest of us would be facing a hefty fine at the least right now, and possible charges of criminal negligence.

I have yet to hear anyone say that Cheney is denying any fault for this. So why are we arguing that point?

I think most gun owners know it is their responsibility to be certain of their target and their surroundings. However, after 6 years of working in an ER, it became quite apparent to me that hunting accidents do happen. Furthermore, few ever resulted in criminal charges.

[gtalum]

I have yet to hear anyone say that Cheney is denying any fault for this.

then it's safe to say you haven't been listening to the usual GOP radio pundits. They're all atwitter explaining how everyone who hunts shoots people and gets shot all the time. It's no big deal. It's all Whittington's fault. And now a lot fo the more kneejerk types all over the place are making the same claims.

[GalvestonDuck]

I have yet to hear anyone say that Cheney is denying any fault for this.

then it's safe to say you haven't been listening to the usual GOP radio pundits. They're all atwitter explaining how everyone who hunts shoots people and gets shot all the time. It's no big deal. It's all Whittington's fault. And now a lot fo the more kneejerk types all over the place are making the same claims.

Again, I have yet to hear anyone say that Cheney is denying any fault for this.

[gtalum]

Ah, my bad. I misundertsood your clearly stated post somehow.

He hasn't exactly taken the blame for it either, though.

[vbhoutex]

I don't usually get into things like this. For one thing I am not a gun owner and do not plan to be.

However, I do know that accidents like this happen on a regular basis during hunting season. No, that doesn't make it ok or shift any blame for the mistakes made, etc. What it highlights to me is the fact that the only reason all of this hoopla and press coverage is even happening is because it was the VP that was involved. If it had not been Cheney, we would have never heard about it. IMO, it is the press out looking for a sensational story and if it is a public figure they figure that is even better. To me that is just plain wrong.

[Skywatch_NC]

I don't usually get into things like this. For one thing I am not a gun owner and do not plan to be.

However, I do know that accidents like this happen on a regular basis during hunting season. No, that doesn't make it ok or shift any blame for the mistakes made, etc. What it highlights to me is the fact that the only reason all of this hoopla and press coverage is even happening is because it was the VP that was involved. If it had not been Cheney, we would have never heard about it. IMO, it is the press out looking for a sensational story and if it is a public figure they figure that is even better. To me that is just plain wrong.

Totally agree, Brother...the media/press has absolutely been putting Cheney through hades over this!

It's no wonder at all that it wasn't reported for at least 24 hours and I don't blame the guy at all for not jumping on the bandwagon so to say right away!! Putting oneself in his shoes in this instance...how the heck would that person feel?!

[MiamiensisWx]

It's all politics. Of course, that's what makes life awesome!

Yeah, right. This thread is getting political quickly. Sorry if I sound mean... it's just that this thread really seems to be getting somewhat nasty.

[x-y-no]

I don't usually get into things like this. For one thing I am not a gun owner and do not plan to be.

However, I do know that accidents like this happen on a regular basis during hunting season. No, that doesn't make it ok or shift any blame for the mistakes made, etc. What it highlights to me is the fact that the only reason all of this hoopla and press coverage is even happening is because it was the VP that was involved. If it had not been Cheney, we would have never heard about it. IMO, it is the press out looking for a sensational story and if it is a public figure they figure that is even better. To me that is just plain wrong.

I completely disagree. Anything major that happens with an elected official like the VP is news. You wouldn't see it on the news if some random private citizen had a heart procedure either. But did that make it "wrong" to report when Cheney had an angioplasty?

I'd argue with the "accidents like this happen on a regular basis" statement too. There's something like 20 million regular hunters in this nation, and very few of them ever land anybody in an ICU. I know that I, for one, would never ever do what the witness account has Cheney doing (wheeling around tracking a bird and firing to what was his rear). I'd be livid at anyone I was with who did any such thing, and I darn sure would refuse to ever hunt with them again. It was a grossly negligent act, pure and simple. If such behavior is truly as common as some are making it out to be, then we desperately need much more gun safety training. But I don't believe it is, or we'd be seeing far more hunters shot.

[Stephanie]

There's something like 20 million regular hunters in this nation, and very few of them ever land anybody in an ICU.

There's been a hunting accident in my area a year or so ago, but this was deer hunting. The point it that we really don't know how many have landed them in the ICU because it's usually a local issue. I agree that it is newsworthy because he's in the public eye and no matter what any politician, entertainer, etc. does it is newsworthy. Their private life becomes public, fair or not but it comes with the territory.

Do you hunt x-y-no?

[Lindaloo]

I don't usually get into things like this. For one thing I am not a gun owner and do not plan to be.

However, I do know that accidents like this happen on a regular basis during hunting season. No, that doesn't make it ok or shift any blame for the mistakes made, etc. What it highlights to me is the fact that the only reason all of this hoopla and press coverage is even happening is because it was the VP that was involved. If it had not been Cheney, we would have never heard about it. IMO, it is the press out looking for a sensational story and if it is a public figure they figure that is even better. To me that is just plain wrong.

I completely disagree. Anything major that happens with an elected official like the VP is news. You wouldn't see it on the news if some random private citizen had a heart procedure either. But did that make it "wrong" to report when Cheney had an angioplasty?

I'd argue with the "accidents like this happen on a regular basis" statement too. There's something like 20 million regular hunters in this nation, and very few of them ever land anybody in an ICU. I know that I, for one, would never ever do what the witness account has Cheney doing (wheeling around tracking a bird and firing to what was his rear). I'd be livid at anyone I was with who did any such thing, and I darn sure would refuse to ever hunt with them again. It was a grossly negligent act, pure and simple. If such behavior is truly as common as some are making it out to be, then we desperately need much more gun safety training. But I don't believe it is, or we'd be seeing far more hunters shot.

Tell ya what Jan. Go quail hunting then get back to me.

[fwbbreeze]

There's something like 20 million regular hunters in this nation, and very few of them ever land anybody in an ICU.

There's been a hunting accident in my area a year or so ago, but this was deer hunting. The point it that we really don't know how many have landed them in the ICU because it's usually a local issue. I agree that it is newsworthy because he's in the public eye and no matter what any politician, entertainer, etc. does it is newsworthy. Their private life becomes public, fair or not but it comes with the territory.

Do you hunt x-y-no?

I have been involved in over 200 dove hunts in my life and probably 50 or so quail hunts. Of the dove hunts I have been involved in at least 10 have had accidental shootings. Did any of these land anyone in ICU, no....an emergency room visit... a couple of times. Dove hunts(at least the ones I attend) usually occur in a field with many hunters present. There is not a hunt that goes by that I don't get sprayed with bird shot falling from the sky. Unless you are hunting BY YOURSELF there is a always chance someone else will get shot. 99% of the time I don't even feel it because of the clothing I have on.

I have to wonder what kind of quail hunt he was involved in. I usually hunt quail with no more than 2 other people and I use a dog to sniff out the birds, however many times quails are raised on farms and turned loose for the sole purpose of being hunted and these hunts usually involve more people thus increasing the risk. I AGREE that all the fault lies with the VP, it is his responsibility to know where he is shooting and who is around at all times. However these accidents do occur and just because they don't make front page news doesn't mean they don't happen.

fwbbreeze

[GalvestonDuck]

Hunting accident statistics:
http://www3.sympatico.ca/d.rosen/accidentstats.htm

[gtalum]

So across all of Mexico, Canada, and the USA there were a grand total of 701 2-party hunting accidents in 1997 and 668 in 1998. That's a pretty small number.

[alicia-w]

agree. i guess it wouldnt be such a big deal if he didnt appear to be so darned secretive about it. one gets the impression that he thinks himself above it all.

[x-y-no]

Do you hunt x-y-no?

Not any more. But for many years I would hunt deer and wild hog every season. Never did bag a hog, though.

[x-y-no]

Tell ya what Jan. Go quail hunting then get back to me.

I don't understand the argument. Because I never hunted this particular species, all my training is meaningless?