Mediterranean system

[Derek Ortt]

looking at the one sat imagery and the QS, it appears as if it was a TC (though I need far more data to be sure).

Probably a 50KT TS that struck Greece

[P.K.]

From the University of Berne:

15/10



16/10



17/10

[Matt-hurricanewatcher]

They need to set up a hurricane center there, so we can get Advisories. It would be a good idea; at least to keep people informed.

[senorpepr]

They need to set up a hurricane center there, so we can get Advisories. It would be a good idea; at least to keep people informed.

It would be a bad idea. It would be a waste of money. You don't need to set up a hurricane center in a region where tropical cyclones rarely form to provide information that is already being provided by local weather services.

[P.K.]

The area is covered Matt, and there were warnings for this system as I posted earlier in the thread. I see no need for a specific tropical cyclone centre for the region.

Edit - Too slow...

[Yarrah]

As far as I know, there isn't even a European Weather Agency. Maybe it's time for the EU to start one?

[P.K.]

Well apart from EUMETSAT and the ECMWF not really. You need local knowledge for forecasts though, and it would likely remove jobs, so it won't ever happen. As well of course of the language barriers between different countries. As with the tropical cyclone warning centre for the Med I see no need.

[Derek Ortt]

It would be a bad idea. It would be a waste of money. You don't need to set up a hurricane center in a region where tropical cyclones rarely form to provide information that is already being provided by local weather services.

If we HAVE to have one for the Med, I'd designate it as a part of the Atlantic basin like the Caribbean and place it under NHC's responsibility. No extra money would be spent, only the occassional extra shift. Or meteofrance could be given responsibility, as they have the official responsibility for the south Indian

[Cyclenall]

looking at the one sat imagery and the QS, it appears as if it was a TC (though I need far more data to be sure).

Probably a 50KT TS that struck Greece

Are you saying that could have been a real tropical cyclone in those waters? Was it a tropical low pressure system?

[Matt-hurricanewatcher]

looking at the one sat imagery and the QS, it appears as if it was a TC (though I need far more data to be sure).

Probably a 50KT TS that struck Greece

Are you saying that could have been a real tropical cyclone in those waters? Was it a tropical low pressure system?

Looks possible, but research would be needed. Also where there high dew points around the system?

[Matt-hurricanewatcher]

Also looking at the sst's chart, you would really think that a cyclone would rather form over the southern or southeastern Med; where water temps are around 25c+. But I guest they can still form some what over 22-24c. Remembering Vince is one notable system for this.


Got any loops for this?

[loro-rojo]

If the Mediterranean Sea becomes a hurricane basic, I dont think that it should be included in the Atlantic basin. The Caribbean and the Gulf of Mexico are part of the Atlantic because storms from those areas pretty much affect the geographical areas.

Those systems in the Mediterranean would affect Europe, and Africa, areas that are not normally in danger from hurricanes that form in the Atlantic basin.

Am I right, or am I missing something?

[P.K.]

If we HAVE to have one for the Med, I'd designate it as a part of the Atlantic basin like the Caribbean and place it under NHC's responsibility.

The reason for that I think is it is within MetArea IV which is covered by the USA. http://weather.gmdss.org/image/metareas640.jpg Meteo-France prepare the western half of MetArea III so it would likely be them or Greece who would cover any tropical cyclone activity. As you say Meteo-France do already have tropical cyclone specialists.

[Derek Ortt]

a TC can easily form over waters of 22C.

SST does not fuel the hurricane, it is the surface fluxes from the ocean, which normally require SST of about 26, but not always.

Also, it is the difference between SST and tropopause temp that determines the atmospheric stability (excluding WV of course)

As for why I would put the Med as a part of the Atlantic basin, there are 3 reasons

1. TC's have hit Europe in the past. In fact, Gordon hit the Azores, a part of Europe this September

2. A TC can move from the Atlantic directly into the Med, just like it can into the GOM or Carib

3. The Med has a direct outlet not separated by land to the Atlantic (Strait of Gibraltar) where a TC can realisticly move (unlike the Atl and EPAC where a TC would have to move through the Panama Canal... an unnatural waterway that no TC will ever move directly over)

[P.K.]

Well in that case you could say that Meteo-France should cover the North Atlantic east of 35W and the Med, a bit like happens between the various Southern Hemisphere regions. One thing that does interest me is when RSMC Miami issues advisories on systems east of 35W in the area covered by France. I've also found it odd over the last couple of years with public advisories for this side of the Atlantic quoting USA timezones which really are not relevant over here.

[littlevince]

Amazing video of this system in Turkey
Waterspouts and massive floods

http://www.infosendirect.com/upload/Turquie.wmv