Tornadoes tell the tale???
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- hurricanetrack
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Tornadoes tell the tale???
After reading through the various NWS reports from the terrible tornado outbreak in Florida, it is quite unsettling to read that many wind speeds were in the upper category 4 SSHS intensity- and look what the damage was like. So it is possible that these tornadoes, some of them anyway, help to tell the tale of what very well might happen when a true, solid category 4 or 5 hurricane cuts across Florida. Of course, Andrew was a 5 and we know what it did. A lot of people live in Florida now compared to 1992- I just have a bad feeling that these scenes will be revisited sooner rather than later due to an epic hurricane. At least we have time to prepare, more or less, for those.
I have friends in the affected areas and my heart goes out to everyone there.
I have friends in the affected areas and my heart goes out to everyone there.
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- AnnularCane
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Lindaloo wrote:You are right Mark. I had a gut feeling one day when they started building casinos right on the Gulf of Mexico in MS. My gut feeling turned out to be correct. Guess what? They are building them right back.
What? I thought they were going to build them more inland. Why do they need to build them right on the water anyway?
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- hurricanetrack
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Oh yeah, Hardrock Casino- reopened right where it was. As did Isles of Capri and several others. Those that were wiped off the Earth will likely never return or will do so inland a few yards.
I tell you what- my money is on Myrtle Beach one of these days. The building there, with no barrier islands, none at all, is astounding. And they have old structures that are cracking and seeping already. I was there for NYE and took lots of "before" video. Believe me, I already know where I am going to be putting several of our remote video units when THAT time comes. I don't want to see it happen, I really don't, but sooner or later, 15 to 20 feet of water is coming in to the Grand Strand and it will be a true cataclysm.
I tell you what- my money is on Myrtle Beach one of these days. The building there, with no barrier islands, none at all, is astounding. And they have old structures that are cracking and seeping already. I was there for NYE and took lots of "before" video. Believe me, I already know where I am going to be putting several of our remote video units when THAT time comes. I don't want to see it happen, I really don't, but sooner or later, 15 to 20 feet of water is coming in to the Grand Strand and it will be a true cataclysm.
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AnnularCane wrote:Lindaloo wrote:You are right Mark. I had a gut feeling one day when they started building casinos right on the Gulf of Mexico in MS. My gut feeling turned out to be correct. Guess what? They are building them right back.
What? I thought they were going to build them more inland. Why do they need to build them right on the water anyway?
Beau Rivage is in the exact same place. The rest of them are using their hotels right now. The Palace which suffered heavy damage by falling into the Bay is back ope in the same location.
Mark, they will not be moved inland.
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- wxman57
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AnnularCane wrote:Lindaloo wrote:You are right Mark. I had a gut feeling one day when they started building casinos right on the Gulf of Mexico in MS. My gut feeling turned out to be correct. Guess what? They are building them right back.
What? I thought they were going to build them more inland. Why do they need to build them right on the water anyway?
Have you ever been to the Mississippi coast? There isn't much north of the beach for tourists. Just a lot of pine trees. Tourists like to stay where they can see and have access to the beach, not in a pine forest. The casinos are being built/rebuilt where the tourists will be. Yes, they'll be heavily damaged the next time a big hurricane hits, perhaps even destroyed. Remember how Ivan removed a good 10-15 feet of sand from beneath some large structures in Pensacola, causing them to collapse? The setup is a bit different along the MS coast, but such undermining caused the Hard Rock Casino/Hotel to collapse with Katrina.
Perhaps they figure that it'll be another 35 years until a storm as powerful as a Katrina or a Camille will strike the area again. They may be right, it could even be longer. In that case, they've made a great gamble. But it could just as easily happen in 2007. I suppose they've considered the odds, being casinos.

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- wxman57
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Lindaloo wrote:They are not "figuring" at all. that is what the problem is. What they do not understand is how many people will be out of work like with Katrina. They should think about employees rather than tourists.
Actually, by building/keeping the casino where tourists can visit is thinking about their employees. Building a casino away from where those who would visit wouldn't be good for the employees. No tourists = no need for a hotel/casino. They'd have to close and everyone would be out of a job. I read that in order to break even, they need about 98-99% occupancy in their hotel. That would be hard to come by away from the beach.
Imagine their ad...
"Come and stay in the beautiful piney woods of Vancleave! Stay here and gamble your money away or you can drive to the beach where everyone else is."

Last edited by wxman57 on Sun Feb 04, 2007 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
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wxman57 wrote:Lindaloo wrote:They are not "figuring" at all. that is what the problem is. What they do not understand is how many people will be out of work like with Katrina. They should think about employees rather than tourists.
Actually, by building/keeping the casino where tourists can visit is thinking about their employees. Building a casino away from where those who would visit wouldn't be good for the employees. No tourists = no need for a hotel/casino. They'd have to close and everyone would be out of a job. I read that in order to break even, they need about 98-99% occupancy in their hotel. That would be hard to come by away from the beach.
Imagine their ad...
"Come and stay in the beautiful piney woods of Vancleave! Stay here and gamble your money away or you can drive to the beach where everyone else is."
Well, by rebuilding them where they are they ARE NOT thinking about their employees if another one comes along.

The Choctaws are wanting to build one in the woods here in Jackson County. People do not care where they are built as long as they can gamble. Been to Vicksburg much wxman?

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True...and I am in agreement that such structures are at risk-structures, but if someone lives on the coast, aren't they going to work somewhere close to home...be it a casino, hotel, business, hospital, etc?
I would have to imagine that there businesses that sustained severe damage on the Mississippi Coast that were a couple of miles inland. And I would imagine that there were many employees of the casinos whose homes were damaged, not because they worked at the casino that was on the water, but because they were in the path of the storm.
I would think as long as the employees of these casinos get out of harm's way for an approaching storm....i.e., out of storm surge danger in particular, couldn't it be said that a Home Depot or Lowe's that chose to rebuild is showing the same disregard for it's employees?
I am not sure that businesses pulling out and rebuilding elsewhere is the answer. From what I have read,the casino boom on the coast provided a huge boost to the local economy and stimulated job and housing growth.
Rebuiding 20 miles inland, given the damage from Katrina, could be viewed as just as irresponsible.
That said, I live in South Florida about 2 miles inland, and one day I could be saying the same thing....the big hotels, resorts, and condos should not be rebuilding on the beach here.
I would have to imagine that there businesses that sustained severe damage on the Mississippi Coast that were a couple of miles inland. And I would imagine that there were many employees of the casinos whose homes were damaged, not because they worked at the casino that was on the water, but because they were in the path of the storm.
I would think as long as the employees of these casinos get out of harm's way for an approaching storm....i.e., out of storm surge danger in particular, couldn't it be said that a Home Depot or Lowe's that chose to rebuild is showing the same disregard for it's employees?
I am not sure that businesses pulling out and rebuilding elsewhere is the answer. From what I have read,the casino boom on the coast provided a huge boost to the local economy and stimulated job and housing growth.
Rebuiding 20 miles inland, given the damage from Katrina, could be viewed as just as irresponsible.
That said, I live in South Florida about 2 miles inland, and one day I could be saying the same thing....the big hotels, resorts, and condos should not be rebuilding on the beach here.
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- wxman57
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Lindaloo wrote:Well, by rebuilding them where they are they ARE NOT thinking about their employees if another one comes along.Do your research, the council of Harrison County benefits from the casinos being built in the tidelands area. Come on! Think wisely.
The Choctaws are wanting to build one in the woods here in Jackson County. People do not care where they are built as long as they can gamble. Been to Vicksburg much wxman?Guess they have beaches there too? LOL!
Linda,
It's a fact that people who come to south Mississippi want to go to the beach, not the woods. People love the beach, tourists love the beach. A casino cannot survive there relying solely on local residents of the MS coast. And it is even more difficult for a casino with a hotel, spa, and marina to survive away from a tourist location. The more attractive the location, the more things to do there, the more the people will come. Vicksburg has no beach, but it's a historical area. I haven't been there, but I'd wager that the casinos there are much smaller-scale compared to the Beau Rivage or the Hard Rock (less overhead). As for the Choctaws, I'm by no means an expert, but I think they may be given special considerations (i.e. tax breaks). They may build a casino off in the woods, but it won't take in nearly the revenue of those on the coast.
If all the casinos moved out of Jackson, Harrison, and Hancock counties then the local economy of the MS coast would be destroyed. Yes, it's a gamble, the casinos could be damaged or destroyed in the future, but they cannot surive as easily away from the people/tourists.
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What beaches? lol. We survived without them in the past and came back strong after Camille. What we have now due to those casinos is more murders and more crime. I do not want a casino in Jackson County, period! My heritage is Choctaw, but they want to set up in Jackson County and not pay taxes, so no, we would not benefit. Since Katrina, Pascagoula has become inundated with people who want to steal and kill our citizens. The police are scared of the PC clubs around here, so the thieves, homeless and others are allowed to wreak havoc in my hometown. No thanks to a casino.
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Living in South Florida, an area (a whole state really) that is highly dependent on tourism, it is very much a love/hate relationship..but at the end of the day, if people stop coming to florida, it is like a stack of dominos and the economy will collapse....i would think that is something the Mississippi Gulf Coast could not weather.
Tourists = cash flow in the local economy, investment in new businesses, new housing developments and schools, and a general sense that an area is booming. As someone not dealing with the unimaginable process of rebuilding the Gulf Coast, I would take the casinos not re-opening bigger and better as a sign of lost interest in the area or that it is beyond repair. Might be the furthest thing from the truth, but as they say, perception is everything.
If the tourists don't come back...and they have to want to go there because of the beaches, the casinos, the recreation, etc....take that away from them and i think you will have a ghost town. This is not the late 60's after Camille....for better or worse the economies of tourist-type destinations have to think on a more expansive and less local level.
Or put another way, Donald Trump or some other developer is probably waiting in line to build a resort in Biloxi if space opens up.
Tourists = cash flow in the local economy, investment in new businesses, new housing developments and schools, and a general sense that an area is booming. As someone not dealing with the unimaginable process of rebuilding the Gulf Coast, I would take the casinos not re-opening bigger and better as a sign of lost interest in the area or that it is beyond repair. Might be the furthest thing from the truth, but as they say, perception is everything.
If the tourists don't come back...and they have to want to go there because of the beaches, the casinos, the recreation, etc....take that away from them and i think you will have a ghost town. This is not the late 60's after Camille....for better or worse the economies of tourist-type destinations have to think on a more expansive and less local level.
Or put another way, Donald Trump or some other developer is probably waiting in line to build a resort in Biloxi if space opens up.
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- MGC
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THe strip right along the coast is a near ghost town in Harrison County. I guess it will remain that way until the bridges are rebuilt. Katrina set us back a few decades here. My heart goes out the the Florida tornado victims. I know just how they feel. Like many here on the coast, my family lost a loved one. Looking at the damage on TV some of the wind damage reminds me of Katrina. Trees stripped of their leaves, roofs ripped of homes. Katrina came short of blowing homes completely away but I did see several that came close from wind damage alone. Still have trouble with HRD wind analysis of Katrina......MGC
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