Whats with this?

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Jim Cantore

Whats with this?

#1 Postby Jim Cantore » Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:28 pm

Smoke? Does it mean haze?

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#2 Postby O Town » Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:14 pm

No. I would think smoke would mean from a fire somewhere, and haze is something else all together. But I just looked up "Haze" in wikipedia and found that yes indeed haze is a mixture of smoke and other pollutant particles. But I guess its still a bit different, smoke is just that, smoke, and haze is a mixture of smoke and other particles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haze
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#3 Postby TexasStooge » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:32 pm

Smoke during -68*F weather? You've gotta be kidding me! :eek:

Then again, that's somewhere in Ojmjakon.
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#4 Postby Janie2006 » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:39 pm

Where is that? Siberia?

Edit: Ok, duh, I finally saw the city at the top of the graphic. Doh.
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Verkhoyansk, too.

#5 Postby jimvb » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:56 pm

I notice that Verkhoyansk, Russia (Verhojansk on Wunderground) also has a report of smoke. The two places are not that close together. The temperature in Verkhoyansk is -57 degrees F. Is all of eastern Siberia going up in smoke? I imagine there can be fires, but it seems to me that snow on the ground would put them out.
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#6 Postby senorpepr » Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:01 pm

I've done PLENTY of forecasting throughout Eastern Europe and Asia. Smoke is VERY common in weather reports.

Usually, this smoke is created by a handful of methods...

:rarrow: First, this places don't have methods for getting rid of waste. Instead of the "trash man," these folks usually burn off their waste. In stable conditions, that will make smoke a huge restricter in visibility.

:rarrow: Second, keep in mind this is Ojmjakon, Russia; located in the heart of Siberia. As you can see, it's VERY cold there. Matter of fact, it's the coldest location in the world... outside of Antarctica. When the temperature is so cold, you have to keep warm somehow. Natural gas is usually not an option, so other methods of burning (usually waste) are used to keep warm.

:rarrow: Not so much the case here, but a lot of Asian sites report smoke (FU) or a combination of smoke and haze (FU HZ) or smoke and fog (FU BR / FU FG) to show smog. This is more common in major cities, especially in southeast Asia. This is usually associated with power plants and other industrialization waste.

In this case, it's probably a mixture of option one and two. (Burning off waste / Keeping warm)


As for the technical definition of smoke versus haze...

Smoke is just what it sounds like: it's smoke. When smoke is present, whether it restricts visibility or not, it usually will be reported.

Here are some visuals of smoke:
Smoke #1 Smoke #2

Here are some visuals of haze:
Smoke #1 Smoke #2
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#7 Postby Siberian Express » Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:26 pm

Maybe they burn wood? When it's so cold, with no wind, the smoke from the wood burners "hangs" from inversion.
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#8 Postby senorpepr » Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:51 pm

Siberian Express wrote:Maybe they burn wood? When it's so cold, with no wind, the smoke from the wood burners "hangs" from inversion.


Yeah, at first I ruled that out because I was thinking of the frozen tundra there, but under further review, there are trees in and around Ojmjakon. Therefore, that's probably the most likely event here--burning wood for warmth.
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#9 Postby Aslkahuna » Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:54 pm

Until the use of fireplaces and wood burning stoves was banned, Reno used to report a lot of smoke during winter inversion situations.

Steve
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