Iran seizes U.K. troops=The 15 sailors are back home

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P.K.
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#141 Postby P.K. » Wed Mar 28, 2007 4:04 pm

HURAKAN wrote:
Thanks P.K., I hope no one was affected or felt offended.


Unless you were to get the English flag wrong I wouldn't be offended. :wink:

Just seen part of the video on the evening news, looks like she doesn't really mean what she is saying and has been told what to say.
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#142 Postby Nimbus » Wed Mar 28, 2007 4:37 pm

As Cookiely mentioned this morning, I certainly hope Iran doesn't use the talk of a US/Israeli invasion to justify making this a long term hostage situation.
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#143 Postby Hybridstorm_November2001 » Wed Mar 28, 2007 4:40 pm

Well knowing what happened around 1979 they might try to do just that. It is their style.
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#144 Postby Cryomaniac » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:20 pm

P.K. wrote:Just seen part of the video on the evening news, looks like she doesn't really mean what she is saying and has been told what to say.


That's what the problem is. Forcing people to admit on camera stuff they didn't do is clearly not humane treatment of prisoners.

Frankly I don't hold out a great deal of hope for a peaceful solution to this crisis, because unless the British government want to come across like cowards, they need to start making more solid threats, and soon.
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#145 Postby James » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:45 pm

On the news they showed a letter she had supposedly written herself. Unless she is in the habit of dropping statements like "returning with a gift from the people of Iran" into everyday speech I doubt she's saying these things of her own free will.
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#146 Postby Brent » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:48 pm

James wrote:On the news they showed a letter she had supposedly written herself. Unless she is in the habit of dropping statements like "returning with a gift from the people of Iran" into everyday speech I doubt she's saying these things of her own free will.


I seriously doubt she voluntarily said that as well...

and I heard the comparisons to the 1979 hostage crisis tonight. I honestly don't think the U.K. or U.S. will allow it to go on that long.
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#147 Postby Yarrah » Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:31 pm

So the UK government is putting more pressure on Iran; trade relations have been frozen and members of the Iranian government will no longer be able to recieve a visa for the UK. Pretty reasonable measures, IMO.

What's also interesting, is that Turkish diplomats might get a chance to see the prisoners and talk to them. Since Turkey has good relations with both the UK and Iran, this could lead to something.
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#148 Postby HURAKAN » Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:02 pm

P.K. wrote:Unless you were to get the English flag wrong I wouldn't be offended. :wink:


I'm kind of immune to those problems because people get confused a lot the Cuban and Puerto Rican flag.

Cuban flag:
Image

Puerto Rican flag:
Image
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#149 Postby cycloneye » Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:07 pm

:uarrow: Sandy,you are completly right about the flag confusion between the Cuban and Puerto Rican flags that sometimes occurs.
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#150 Postby James » Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:28 am

Well, it seems that Iran may now let British officials have access to the sailors, but it's also said that the others will only be released when the UK states that they were in Iranian waters at the time.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6505453.stm

It kinda sounds like Iran knows they have no real case and want to try and salvage some kind of flimsy justification.
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#151 Postby James » Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:07 am

Oh dear, Iran is now saying it might delay the release of Faye Turney. Here's a quote from the BBC article:

"The head of Iran's supreme national security council, Ali Larijani, said: "It was announced that a woman in the group would be freed, but (this development) was met with an incorrect attitude." "

Maybe this is the reaction to the fact that Tehran hasn't got the admission it's looking for.
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#152 Postby Chacor » Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:34 am

Or it's a delay tactic, to prolong this crisis and to put off losing face. Tehran knows it's in the wrong, imo, and are just trying to do all they can to retain even a glimmer of world respect. If it had any, in the first place.
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#153 Postby Nimbus » Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:37 am

This was a UK report and it also stated.

"Increasing the tension, the Iranian consul in Bassra charged that British soldiers had surrounded his office in the southern Iraqi city this morning and fired shots into the air in a "provocative act" that "could worsen the situation of the British sailors"."

So Iran is also citing violent retribution as the reason for not bringing the hostage release to conclusion.
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#154 Postby lurkey » Thu Mar 29, 2007 9:22 am

Nimbus wrote:
So Iran is also citing violent retribution as the reason for not bringing the hostage release to conclusion.


I'm confused. Violent retribution as the reason for not bringing this matter to conclusion??
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#155 Postby feederband » Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:00 pm

Now they are releasing another letter from the female Marine...In it says that U.S forces should leave Iraq...

I think someone will have to send the Iranians a real message soon...
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#156 Postby wx247 » Thu Mar 29, 2007 2:18 pm

The UN Security Council is meeting on this today apparently (according to CNN). This as oil spiked above $66 earlier. Fun,fun. :eek:
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#157 Postby lurkey » Thu Mar 29, 2007 2:18 pm

feederband wrote:Now they are releasing another letter from the female Marine...In it says that U.S forces should leave Iraq...

I think someone will have to send the Iranians a real message soon...


Actually, she's a Royal Navy sailor, not a Royal Marine. I remember reading somewhere that the Brits don't allow women in the Royal Marines.

What makes the oil price increas worse, is that gasoline inventories in the US are low. Mostly, because they are changing from the normal gas formula, to the "summer" mix.
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#158 Postby Cryomaniac » Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:40 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6508909.stm

UN voices 'concern' on UK sailors

The UN Security Council has agreed a statement voicing "grave concern" at Iran's capture of 15 British sailors.

It also calls on Tehran to allow the UK consular access to the personnel.

The statement is a watered-down version as the UK wanted it to "deplore" Iran's detention of the Britons and call for their immediate release.

Meanwhile, Iran has released a second letter, apparently written by captured Leading Seaman Faye Turney, 26, which urges the UK to withdraw from Iraq.

Stronger statement

The British ambassador to the UN, Sir Emyr Jones Parry, said the UN statement was a "good outcome" for the UK.

Sir Emyr added that the unanimous statement sent the "right message" to Iran to allow access to the sailors and marines, and secure their prompt release.

The UK failed to win support for a stronger statement deploring Iran's actions, following opposition led by Russia.

Iran's UN mission said in a statement: "This case can and should be settled through bilateral channels.

"The British government's attempt to engage third parties, including the Security Council, with this case is not helpful."

The statement was agreed following more than four hours of negotiations.

In full, it said: "Members of the Security Council expressed grave concern at the capture by the Revolutionary Guard and the continuing detention by the government of Iran of 15 United Kingdom naval personnel and appealed to the government of Iran to allow consular access in terms of the relevant international laws.

"Members of the Security Council support calls, including by the secretary general in his March 29 meeting with the Iranian foreign minister, for an early resolution of this problem including the release of the 15 UK personnel."

Legal proceeding

Speaking on the BBC's Question Time, Labour Party chairman Hazel Blears said she deplored the way LS Turney, the only female to be seized, had been "singled out" by the Iranians.

Former British Ambassador to Iran Sir Richard Dalton told Newsnight the situation could take some time to resolve.

"Either they can accede to the demand that they release these people or they can put them, as they've threatened, in front of some form of legal proceeding," he said.

The Britons, based on HMS Cornwall, were seized on Friday after boarding a vessel in the northern Gulf and returning to their boats.

Iran says they strayed into Iranian territorial waters, a claim which the UK denies.

'Incorrect attitude'

Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett said using LS Turney for propaganda purposes was "outrageous and cruel".

The second letter, released by the Iranian embassy in London and addressed to British MPs, states: "Isn't it time for us to start withdrawing our forces from Iraq and let them determine their own future?"

It also says that "even through our wrongdoing" the Iranians have "treated us well and humanely".

Ali Larijani, Iran's chief nuclear negotiator, said the release of LS Turney had been delayed, and spoke about the UK's "incorrect attitude".


What's really winding me up about this whole thing is that the British government is not being hard enough, and they are in effect, backing down to Russia as well ffs. Why? Whose side are you on Putin? Just because you can get away with war crimes in Chechnya, Iran can as well,.. get the hell out. Strengthen teh language or give up, simple as that.
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#159 Postby Derek Ortt » Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:50 pm

we need to remember that Russia has even more al queda problems than we do

they also tend to act in a far more secretive nature.For example, back in 2001 when the Russians were publicly saying they were in afghanistan only after the fall of the Taliban to help with the rebuilding, Dan Rather was hiniting that they were kind of fighting the Taliban (may explain their sudden collapse, they were facing a real AF in the USA and Britain and a real army)

http://www.indiareacts.com/archivefeatu ... ctg=policy

this also hints of Russian involvement (not sure how much I trust that we were about to attack before 9/11, the point is that Russia tends to not exactly publicize their true intentions)
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#160 Postby Cryomaniac » Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:37 am

Derek Ortt wrote:we need to remember that Russia has even more al queda problems than we do


Maybe when they aren't blowing up their own buildings and blaming it on Chechen rebels...

they also tend to act in a far more secretive nature.
The always have to be honest, and I guess it's worked from their point of view.
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