We got to do something!

[Beam]

As for the mets...how would you feel giving your professional opinion in the field that you specialize in and have someone that doesn't have nearly the education, experience and knowledge that you have, come in and always disagree with the met, thinking that he/she knows better. I've seen our mets patiently explain the same thing over and over and those who insist that the met is wrong pushes the met to his limit. Would any of you not lose your patience? Our mets have done a great job of educating us. Don't forget that they are volunteering to do this. We can't pay them...heck, we can't even pay our staff

Bingo. Nailed it. These are people who have worked hard for many years to get where they are now, and it makes me more than a little irritated when I see some kid with no significant understanding of tropical weather systems stand up and tell a professional meteorologist, who forecasts these phenomena for a living that they're wrong, especially when the met has explained the hows and whys behind their statements at least a dozen times, and the amateur's just throwing some uneducated opinion out there, and not trying to learn anything. I honestly can't blame a pro met if they get irritated and make a cynical remark out of frustration.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not railing on those who don't have an understanding of tropical weather. I used to be clueless about this stuff too, and we all have to start somewhere. What's important is that the amateurs are willing to observe, learn from, and look up to the pro mets, instead of stubbornly pushing the same tired, uneducated ideas that conflict with the predictions of trained experts as well as raw science. I've gained a massive amount of knowledge both from experience and by watching the pro mets' predictions and ideas, and I have a much more level-headed and rational view of what to look for and what to expect from tropical systems than I ever would have if not for this place.

As for the "chatter" problem, I've been around since 2003, and this chatter happens every year when everyone is anxious for something to happen; albeit there are a lot more people around since the events of 2005. Usually when serious stuff is going down this problem takes care of itself -- and if for some reason it continues, I'm sure the s2k staff will put a hiatus to it. I do agree that some more constructive posts would be nice, but there's only so much you can add to a conversation about a cluster of thunderstorms.

In short, it's one thing to have wild ideas that fly in the face of science and expert meteorologists. It's another thing to be so headstrong and stubborn that you argue those ideas against the opinions of trained professionals instead of listening to what they have to say and trying to learn.

[SouthFloridawx]

I'm telling you guys, there has to be a happy medium for everyone. It's as easy as starting a new thread for general discussion about the system, leaving the official one open for real news and updated info on the system.

We are all here for basically the same reason. This thread is going to continue to go on and on forever, but isn't that what this place is about, sharing opinions and discussion. Peoples feelings get hurt, but I don't think I have seen very many instances where anything was intentionally done, to demean or hurt someone here. Remember I said very many, there are exceptions to the rule.

Let's figure it out.

[HURAKAN]

Something that I don't like is that sometimes people just post their opinions without having anything to back them up. It's nice to hear everyone's opinions, but I would be even nicer for everyone to back their opinion.

If you are going to disagree, then also explain why you disagree. If you agree, then explain why you agree. But don't create a post that just says "I agree" or "I disagree."

[tolakram]

I wanted to address one issue I've seen ...

The concept of eating crow when a forecast doesn't pan out.

What does that mean? Why are egos involved? Why can't people make forecasts based on their knowledge and relish the fact that when they're wrong they'll have the opportunity to understand why and be smarter for the effort? I'd like to see the concept of eating crow expunged from this forum, it doesn't belong and frankly the attitude that goes along with it seems to be causing a lot of the problems.

In my opinion.

[fci]

There are 3 locations set up now.
Talkin Tropics has the new location up top for advisories and there is the Tropcial Analysis Forum for the Pros to post in too.
Then there is the Discussion thread.
Remember, amatuers can post in the Tropical Analysis Forum but can't start a thread.
Also, if there is Recon, it gets a seperate thread too.

So, how many more do we really need?
I thought that the "discussion" thread was intended for what it exactly is now.

If S2K sets up a wide number of locations, it makes navigating a nighmare.

[Brent]

There are 3 locations set up now.
Talkin Tropics has the new location up top for advisories and there is the Tropcial Analysis Forum for the Pros to post in too.
Then there is the Discussion thread.
Remember, amatuers can post in the Tropical Analysis Forum but can't start a thread.
Also, if there is Recon, it gets a seperate thread too.

So, how many more do we really need?
I thought that the "discussion" thread was intended for what it exactly is now.

If S2K sets up a wide number of locations, it makes navigating a nighmare.

It's already setting up a problem for when we get a named storm all the info on it goes to the active storms board(and no discussion on this board, it doesn't make sense). I was more than a little confused during Chantal and that was a 24-hour non U.S. threat., and I've been here 3 years, a lot of people have been a lot less than that.

[Aric Dunn]

Like i said before overall I have no problems with any of it! because its not hard to read the previous posts before posting so that you dont say the same thing as the last 50 people
and its not hard to give some at the least some reasoning to a post (if it is a forecast or analysis) to better get your point across, and its really not hard to simply ask someone for a reason if you dont know what they are talking about (90% of the time).

as for the pro met thing i give them all the respect they deserve i just will always ask why! and I will agree and sometimes i will disagree and im right sometimes and wrong a lot more but wont stop. either way im here because they are here! they make me learn. I learn by discussion thats why i dont like post that dont back up their reasoning (pro or am ). thats how i have always learned. so I like it the way it is because its really not that hard to figure out!

[SouthFloridawx]

There are 3 locations set up now.
Talkin Tropics has the new location up top for advisories and there is the Tropcial Analysis Forum for the Pros to post in too.
Then there is the Discussion thread.
Remember, amatuers can post in the Tropical Analysis Forum but can't start a thread.
Also, if there is Recon, it gets a seperate thread too.

So, how many more do we really need?
I thought that the "discussion" thread was intended for what it exactly is now.

If S2K sets up a wide number of locations, it makes navigating a nighmare.

Well, I don't go to the Analysis forum as much as I should, and I don't think the majority of the people go there either. In the Talking Tropics forum it wouldn't be so bad to have:


99L Sat Pics, Models, Analysis and all that jazz
99L General Discussion Thread, arguing and insulting
99L Recon
99L Recon Discussion

It's really not that hard to follow along with. You make it sound like it is totally impossible to follow along with... but in actuality it would clear up a lot of issues and the Bolded above thread wouldn't need to be recreated 17 thousand times after 25 pages... we all know how long that lasts.

[Downdraft]

I wanted to address one issue I've seen ...

The concept of eating crow when a forecast doesn't pan out.

What does that mean? Why are egos involved? Why can't people make forecasts based on their knowledge and relish the fact that when they're wrong they'll have the opportunity to understand why and be smarter for the effort? I'd like to see the concept of eating crow expunged from this forum, it doesn't belong and frankly the attitude that goes along with it seems to be causing a lot of the problems.

In my opinion.

The concept of the term actually goes back several years and started as a joke. I believe it still is a joke and not meant to clash ego's actually there's even a famous one-liner in here. It wouldn't be a storm unless a certain poster says "Holy Crap." Just a few things that have stuck with the board over the years and have no deeper meaning than people having fun or admitting they blew one. I said it yesterday in the 99L I got feathers in my teeth and don't mind laughing at myself for saying it.

[skysummit]

The only problem with that is what about when we have 3 or maybe even 4 storms at once in the Atlantic Basin? Then they'll be 12 - 16 dedicated threads LOL.

[SouthFloridawx]

The only problem with that is what about when we have 3 or maybe even 4 storms at once in the Atlantic Basin? Then they'll be 12 - 16 dedicated threads LOL.

Yeah and for each storm there is already,

99L #1
99L #2
99L #3
99L #4
99L #5
99L #6

So on and so forth... If you are all cool with people yelling at other people because they are using one liners and then other people who don't have a formal education are telling the mets they are wrong... It's the same story all the time...

Everyone is going to keep doing what they are doing because we are our own individuals...

Don't tell other people not do something if you aren't willing to meet them in a middle a little.

I don't mean specifically you skysummit or anyone else for that matter.

[SouthFloridawx]

Ya know, one more thing is that we constantly have like 3 or 4 different threads on the same disturbances and waves at the same time, so what is the big deal about having something specifically defined to have a purpose, with no other threads like it?

I hear wxman57 talking all the time about having multiple threads for the same disturbances and they aren't even classified as anything yet...

[skysummit]

I hear ya. Honestly, I'm fine with the way it is. It's never going to change no matter how many rules are put in place. I just wish it could be like it was 2 or 3 years ago when you could post an idea or thought, and not get bashed upon just because someone doesn't agree with you.

Same thing goes for the pro mets. There is one in particular that I ALWAYS listen to and highly respect on this board. As for others, they do seem kind of harsh at times to regular members so the respect thing must go both ways.

[vbhoutex]

RESPECT is the name of the game here! It must go both ways also, but I do understand the frustrations of the pros when they have explained themselves quite thoroughly and still have someone railing against them saying they are wrong, but not putting any substance or respect into their disagreement. I have disagreed with the pro-mets here openly in the past(and I am one of the people that recruits and approves them coming here), but I have NEVER told one of them they are wrong. I state why I feel they way I do about the system and ask them to explain to me why I am incorrect. I ALWAYS get a respectful explanation and/or answer. TRY IT!! RESPECT goes a long way!!!

[decgirl66]

HEY!! What about "bear watches"? I haven't seen one of those in a while! Anyway, I think it is pretty amusing that this thread jumped from 2 to 4 pages within a few minutes!!! Just goes to show you, we have a lot of strong personalities on this board! Nothing wrong with a little diversity!

Everybody have a wonderful weekend! (And as you can see, I don't post often, but I do enjoy reading thru all the posts, even the oneliners and the etc...

[fci]

The only problem with that is what about when we have 3 or maybe even 4 storms at once in the Atlantic Basin? Then they'll be 12 - 16 dedicated threads LOL.

No need to put the LOL in.
It is true.

I know that now you have #1, #2 etc....; howver you only have 1 that is active.
If for each system there are multiple locations it WILL be confusing and you will look in all those places to find something.

Wait and see........

Seems easy now when there is nothing going on

Oh, and the one liners we all look for are fun:
Holy Crap, Eating Crow, Season cancel, they go on and on and are some of the flavor of S2K!!

[TreasureIslandFLGal]

I have a couple of ideas that may help out our situation here:

1) Get rid of the "ranking" categories altogether so that people don't try to post just to obtain the class 5 category. Have designators such as: Pro Met, Met-in-Training at "school", or Amateur. -the only options. Folks can then also be S2K Supporters. (Maybe the Support Level could be shown as Cat1 -Cat5 if folks want to "look more important". -in fact, we never did get that shown even though we donated )

2) Limit post frequency. If people are only allowed to post, i.e. only once every 10 minutes anywhere on the site, then they will consider the importance and content of what they wish to say and where it would be most appropriate to say it. This will keep the total number of posts down and increase the quality of what is said. Folks that just wish to say "I agree" or make a quick comment in reference can utilize the IM/mailbox option to personally chat with another poster. It makes the room more of a message board and not a chat room this way.

Nikki and I both love this site and come into the Storm area mostly to get information and the views regarding storm development and probable paths. We were both totally frustrated by all the "garbage" posts and bickering we saw running rampant over the last few days. It was much worse than we have ever seen here. Maybe it is just that many of the "kids" are not back in school yet, or there are many new faces that just aren't aware of the etiquette we expect on the board.???

We hope something can be done so that when the season really gets going, we won't be forced to leave our favorite site just to find good info. We need this site. Being right on the beach, we can't totally rely on the "official word" alone. Since watches don't even come out until 36 hours prior to a hit, and it takes a minimum of 56 hours to evacuate our county....getting the early word is obviously a benefit to us.

[RL3AO]

I agree.



Anyway, I'm new here but I know what you guys mean by the short non-needed posts. It is the same way over on Dr. Masters blog. There are so many people that the blogs comments become impossible to keep up with.

[Air Force Met]

As for the mets...how would you feel giving your professional opinion in the field that you specialize in and have someone that doesn't have nearly the education, experience and knowledge that you have, come in and always disagree with the met, thinking that he/she knows better. I've seen our mets patiently explain the same thing over and over and those who insist that the met is wrong pushes the met to his limit. Would any of you not lose your patience? Our mets have done a great job of educating us. Don't forget that they are volunteering to do this. We can't pay them...heck, we can't even pay our staff

Full credit to them for doing so but it does not give them any special right to attack other users or their opinion.

I agree with that...but let me tell you from our point of view...it gets frustrating when amatuers act like you have just insulted their child because you tell them something won't develop. I've seen it get worse over the last couple of years of low activity...the "Desire" for development. When we downplay it...it's like we called ther kid ugly and you can almost hear the mute button being pushed.

That gets frustrating. Yes...everyone is entitled to an opinion...but not all opnions are created equally.

As far as one-liners...here is my issue. If someone has a question...I try to answer it. It does no good for me to give a detailed answer for someone (and others who might want to know) if it gets covered up by 4 pages of nonsense in an hour. I, as well as others, am busy with my regular job, so I don't have the TIME to flip back and forth between the different rooms and keep track of everywhere I am...not to mention every thread. I just can't multi-task like that because I don't have the time. It's easier to stay in one room. So, people should THINK before they type and if it doesn't really contribute to the topic...then there is no need to post. Side-bar comments should be taken to PM's...no need for one word answers...it jut runs up the post count and nothing else...which is the reason some have 500+ posts after a month or two. It has taken some on this board YEARS to get to that point.

Think about it.

[SouthFloridawx]

That's why I'm suggesting, even though if you make a General Discussion thread, yeah it's another thread, but it leaves the official thread in Talking Tropics open to someone like AirForceMet to be more willing to post something and not worry about it getting buried 4 pages back.

I know that it would take a little time to get used to, but when we got a storm it's most of our primary focus.