INVEST 91L -Discussions,Analysis and Imagery

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Duddy
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM (TCFA Issued)

#201 Postby Duddy » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:39 pm

jschlitz wrote:These are comments from Jeff Lindner on this system:

Potential for tropical cyclone to impact the TX coast.

Changes to forecast from Wednesday through Friday are required based on latest HPC and NHC thinking and 12Z model guidance. At 300pm visible images along with radar from Cancun, Mexico clearly show a well defined low level circulation about 100 miles N of the Yucatan coast. Upper level low over the central Gulf of Mexico is moving W toward the S TX coast with strong southerly shear across the top of 91L. Shear should weaken over the next 12 -24 hours as the upper low moves westward. Steering of 91L then comes under the influence of large scale high over the southern plains.

Current model guidance including 12Z run of GFDL takes the system into the S TX coast between Brownsville and Corpus Christi which is also supported by the GFS and NAM. Will disregard 68kts by the SHIPS and follow closer with the 50kts depicted on the DSIPS guidance suggesting a landfalling tropical storm late Wednesday along the lower TX coast.

Will need to make significant changes to wind and seas forecast and rainfall/QPF forecast starting Wednesday. At this time core of adverse weather should impact areas from Matagorda Bay southward.

Seas: Expect coastal winds to shift to the ENE Tuesday and begin to increase by Wednesday as Gulf pressures lower. Wave Watch III guidance builds offshore swells into the 8-12 foot range starting early Wednesday as tropical storm force winds spread into the outer coastal waters. Will increase from flat seas of 1-2 feet into 6-8 feet coast to 12 feet offshore. Increasing swells and winds will result in tidal run-up along the beaches starting late Tuesday. Will increase tides into the 1.0-2.0 foot above normal range (Brazoria County N) and into the 2.0-2.5 foot range (Brazoria County S). Could see tides up to 4.0 feet above normal around Matagorda Bay by late Wednesday with overwash of protection dunes.

Winds: Will increase winds into the 20-30mph range out of the E to ENE for Wednesday. May be close to northern extent of TS force wind radii over the Matagorda Bay area late Wednesday. Squalls and rainbands will likely produce gust at or above 40mph along the coast.

Rain Chances: Will up chances to 50% by Wednesday and may need to go even higher especially W of I-45 based on forecast track of center and deep surge of 2.50+ PWS. NAM and GFS show most of the heavy rains N and E of the center of the system…so even a landfall in S TX would support heavy rains and squalls northward up the TX coast. HPC progs show 6.4 inch bullseye near the landfall locations with widespread 2-4 inches contours up the TX coast into Matagorda Bay.

Residents along the TX coast should closely monitor the progress of this system.

Continued significant forecast changes are possible based on the forecast track and intensity of the system.


Crap, Matagorda is mentioned alot there :(
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clevelandindians

Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#202 Postby clevelandindians » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:40 pm

who thinks it will be a TD by 5 tomorrow!?
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#203 Postby RL3AO » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:41 pm

clevelandindians wrote:who thinks it will be a TD by 5 tomorrow!?


I really don't know. It needs more organized convection plus it took the NHC so long to call TD4. Plus they won't have visible until after the 5am update. So I will say no.
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#204 Postby Stormcenter » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:41 pm

Tampa Bay Hurricane wrote:Appears that there will be development:
shear is low and oceanic heat content is high...
A tropical storm is possible out of this.
In fact a category 1 hurricane is possible.
Texas should watch it closely,
as the wunderground.com tropical
models show it going there:
http://www.wunderground.com/tropical/tr ... model.html
In fact the models are on tight agreement for South Texas.



I think it will be further north up the coast in TX.
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Derek Ortt

#205 Postby Derek Ortt » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:42 pm

it's in the GOM... GOM systems have far more lax standards than CV storms for being upgraded
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Re:

#206 Postby RL3AO » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:43 pm

Derek Ortt wrote:it's in the GOM... GOM systems have far more lax standards than CV storms for being upgraded


Which I don't like. There should not be different standards because a system is near land or not near land.
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#207 Postby HouTXmetro » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:47 pm

What are the chances and implications of a LLC relocation closer to the convection?
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#208 Postby Sambucol » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:51 pm

I think it will be further north up the coast in TX.


why?
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#209 Postby Stratosphere747 » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:51 pm

HouTXmetro wrote:What are the chances and implications of a LLC relocation closer to the convection?


If you are talking back down by the Yucatan Channel? Then it would a bit longer before impacting the WGOM, which could conceivably give it more time to get its act together.
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM

#210 Postby HouTXmetro » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:53 pm

Thanks, I remember Cindy's LLC relocated but she was over land and relocated to convection over water. In this case that LLC is over water so I doubt we have a reformation unless the the LLC remains convectionless.
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM

#211 Postby weatherrabbit_tx » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:54 pm

Matagorda Bay to Freeport landfall? mostly depends on the ridge and how it sets up, imo
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#212 Postby Aric Dunn » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:55 pm

I would say so, it could be a TD later if some more convection starts .. if the pressure keeps falling the way it is right now!!!
cancun pressure now down to 1008mb 3mb away from TD 4

http://weather.noaa.gov/weather/current/MMUN.html

could easily be a cat one by land fall if this upper gets just far enough away to put it in that key spot

and it look to be doing that


last few obs from there

6 PM (22) Aug 13 82 (28) 75 (24) 29.78 (1008) S 6
5 PM (21) Aug 13 82 (28) 73 (23) 29.78 (1008) SSE 9
4 PM (20) Aug 13 80 (27) 75 (24) 29.81 (1009) Calm
3 PM (19) Aug 13 77 (25) 75 (24) 29.83 (1010) Calm
2 PM (18) Aug 13 80 (27) 75 (24) 29.83 (1010) WNW 8
Last edited by Aric Dunn on Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#213 Postby Aric Dunn » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:00 pm

oh and that is not at the center .. its about 80 to 100 miles from there

so pressure could be 1007 or close to
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM

#214 Postby Extremeweatherguy » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:01 pm

this system definitely has me more concerned than TD4 right now. The trends for this thing are pretty scary. It is getting slower, the environment is getting better and it looks like it might try to push further north than first thought (if it continues going slower). I will be watching this closely.
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#215 Postby RL3AO » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:02 pm

Unless some serious convection forms over the low, I think the NHC will wait for recon.
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Re:

#216 Postby Aric Dunn » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:04 pm

RL3AO wrote:Unless some serious convection forms over the low, I think the NHC will wait for recon.


with a LLc as defined as that and getting better they would most likely send it!

agreed convection would need to increase before we could really see and significant development

but if you go by definition closed llc and winds of 30kt
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Re:

#217 Postby Stratosphere747 » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:05 pm

RL3AO wrote:Unless some serious convection forms over the low, I think the NHC will wait for recon.


Recon is not scheduled until tomorrow. Plenty of time before they would need to make a decision to "wait."
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Re: Re:

#218 Postby RL3AO » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:06 pm

Aric Dunn wrote:
RL3AO wrote:Unless some serious convection forms over the low, I think the NHC will wait for recon.


but if you go by definition closed llc and winds of 30kt


If you went on definition, TD 4 would be on advisory 4 or 5, not 2.
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#219 Postby Yankeegirl » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:16 pm

Even if it goes into the south part of Texas, it should (hopefully) give us (houston area) a break from this terrible heat! Whichever way it goes, I am still going to keep my eye on it.... you never know what way its going to go...
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Re: INVEST 91L: near W Carib/GOM=5:30 PM TWO Posted

#220 Postby tailgater » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:20 pm

HouTXmetro wrote:What are the chances and implications of a LLC relocation closer to the convection?

The 850mb and 700mb vorticities are a little farther NE of where surface is being depicted by the floater for 91L.
http://cimss.ssec.wisc.edu/tropic/real- ... g8vor4.GIF
http://cimss.ssec.wisc.edu/tropic/real- ... g8vor3.GIF
As far as implications, probably about the as forecasted.IMHO
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