Global model runs discussion

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#3681 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:21 am

NDG wrote:GFS and Euro are still not very consistent at all of a well organized area of low pressure developing in timing, an exact area & its track, they have been all over the place.
The best thing to do is to wait as we get closer in time and wait for moisture to build up and hopefully the models can become more consistent.
The retrograding positive tilted UL trough of low pressure that will be positioning near the SE US coast by the weekend will help with divergence but it will not give the best UL environment as far as shear.


its mostly been a land interaction problem with the two models and the development and location of convection. the fact the the 00z Euro is back to a system in the NW carrib which is inline with the rest of models is a indication there may be more of a carribean system.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3682 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:37 am

from the discussion ... That tropical wave is what the Nogaps quickly develops and the other models slowly develop once it reaches the NW carrib. its easily seen on TPW


CARIBBEAN SEA...
AN UPPER RIDGE EXTENDS ACROSS THE N PORTION OF SOUTH AMERICA
INTO THE E PACIFIC REGION OVER COSTA RICA GIVING THE CARIBBEAN
NEARLY ZONAL WESTERLY FLOW ALOFT. MODERATE SUBSIDENCE REMAINS
OVER THE BASIN BETWEEN 13N-17N. THE MONSOON TROUGH EXTENDS FROM
COLOMBIA N OF PANAMA INTO THE E PACIFIC REGION OVER COSTA RICA
GENERATING SCATTERED TO HEAVY SHOWERS WITH SCATTERED
THUNDERSTORMS S OF LINE FROM NICARAGUA NEAR 12N84W ALONG 12N79W
TO COLOMBIA NEAR 11N75W. ISOLATED SHOWERS/THUNDERSTORMS ARE
WITHIN 120 NM OF LINE FROM CUBA NEAR 20N76W TO THE GULF OF
HONDURAS NEAR 16N88W LEAVING THE REMAINDER OF THE CARIBBEAN
UNDER MOSTLY CLEAR SKIES THIS MORNING. THE SURFACE RIDGE OVER
THE W ATLC WILL MAINTAIN MODERATE TO FRESH EASTERLY TRADE WINDS
ACROSS THE BASIN THROUGH THU AND PRIMARILY OVER THE CENTRAL
CARIBBEAN LATE FRI AND SAT. THE TROPICAL WAVE WILL PASS THROUGH
THE CENTRAL CARIBBEAN TODAY AND TONIGHT INTO THE W CARIBBEAN WED
AND THU BEFORE MOVING OVER THE YUCATAN ON FRI.




......

Image
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3683 Postby HurricaneTracker » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:08 am

Hi, I'm new here! I'm a person interested in hurricanes and Tropical weather!


THE GFS Model 06UTC show a weak Tropical Depression moving northeast out of Carribean


http://mag.ncep.noaa.gov/GemPakTier/Mag ... precip.gif
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3684 Postby Ivanhater » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:13 am

Tuesday morning model roundup

06z Nogaps

Image

06z GFS

Image

00Z Euro

Image

00z Canadian

Image
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Re: Re:

#3685 Postby NDG » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:30 am

Aric Dunn wrote:
NDG wrote:GFS and Euro are still not very consistent at all of a well organized area of low pressure developing in timing, an exact area & its track, they have been all over the place.
The best thing to do is to wait as we get closer in time and wait for moisture to build up and hopefully the models can become more consistent.
The retrograding positive tilted UL trough of low pressure that will be positioning near the SE US coast by the weekend will help with divergence but it will not give the best UL environment as far as shear.


its mostly been a land interaction problem with the two models and the development and location of convection. the fact the the 00z Euro is back to a system in the NW carrib which is inline with the rest of models is a indication there may be more of a carribean system.


My point is that they have been inconsistent in timing and area of development, and they have gone from a well organized system to a broad area of low pressure. Not saying that there will not be tropical development, just saying to point a particular time and place to happen at this time is impossible.
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#3686 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:31 am

GFS is rolling in. things to look for.... the carribean off the mid atlantic and another area supposed to develop east of florida.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3687 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:45 am

GFS Low off NE florida and hatteras. should get left behind and drop SE. And some reflection in the western carribean.

Image
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3688 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:53 am

72 hours. well defined low east of florida. ( NOT THE CARRIBEAN SYSTEM as separate one) . multiple models now showing something off the SE coast.


Image
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3689 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:10 am

GFS has been sticking with the 15th-20th for development for nearly two weeks and this run is no different. 117 hours. development off florida, east pack system moves into BOC and then NW carribean system develops. 3 possible june systems ??? lol all within the short to medium range forecast which gives it better credibility.

Image
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#3690 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:13 am

Although the SE system may not transition. however all the phase diagrams show a warm core system.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3691 Postby floridasun78 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:22 am

ok what i be looking for building storms in nw carribbean because without that all models will be wrong
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3692 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:25 am

floridasun78 wrote:ok what i be looking for building storms in nw carribbean because without that all models will be wrong


yep thats the key. need convection. we should see it start to build as the tropical wave over the central carrib moves into the western carrib tonight and tomorrow.
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#3693 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:27 am

nogaps sticking with the earlier development in the SW carrib in about 48 to 60 hours.

https://www.fnmoc.navy.mil/wxmap_cgi/cg ... t=Tropical
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#3694 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:59 am

full 12z nogaps.

same deal except it interacts with the epac system. not likely...

https://www.fnmoc.navy.mil/wxmap_cgi/cg ... t=Tropical

12z CMC . not showing much of anything. lowering pressure in the western carrib and the east pac system crossing into the BOC but dying right away.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3695 Postby floridasun78 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:13 pm

i think we need see how storm build in carribbean take it from their after that models will be need watch as MJO move in
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#3696 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:14 pm

12z euro coming in.... interesting feature in the gulf tomorrow ... guess from the very large t'storm complex over the south moving into the gulf tonight and tomorrow.. dont think anything will come from it.. but its the euro

Also the epac system is stronger this run and the east coast system


http://raleighwx.americanwx.com/models/ ... _loop.html
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3697 Postby cycloneye » Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:17 pm

Here is todays discussion by Rob of Crown Weather about the possible developments in the next few days and the different model scenarios.

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http://www.crownweather.com/?page_id=4557


Mischief Possible Off Of US Southeast Coast By Late This Week; I Continue To Believe That Tropical Development Is Very Possible In The Northwest Caribbean Or Southern Gulf Of Mexico Within The Next 7 to 9 Days

Tuesday, June 12, 2012 6:07 am

by Rob Lightbown


The overall weather pattern for the rest of this week into this weekend consists of a frontal system passage across the Florida Peninsula on Thursday into Friday, across the Florida Straits on Saturday and into the northwestern Caribbean late this weekend into early next week. At the same time, an area of low pressure is forecast to develop about halfway between the US Southeast coast and Bermuda from Friday into this weekend. This particular low pressure system is then forecast to shoot off to the northeast into the open Atlantic by early next week. There is some chance for this low pressure system to acquire sub-tropical characteristics and it will be something that will be monitored in the coming days.

Now, the entire pattern, including the fact that the upward motion pulse of the Madden Julian Oscillation will be moving into Octants 8 and 1 starting around June 18th indicates that the atmosphere may be setting up in a way that leads to tropical development in the western Caribbean and Gulf of Mexico within the next week. The Tropical Precipitable Water loop from CIMSS clearly shows a surge of energy tracking across the central Caribbean. This surge of energy is expected to reach the western Caribbean by early Wednesday morning. I think that the environment is more favorable in the western Caribbean and an increase in thunderstorm activity is expected across the western Caribbean by Wednesday.

The overall wind shear forecast is for a more favorable environment in the western Caribbean and southern Gulf of Mexico by this weekend into next week. All of these factors, the favorable phase of the Madden Julian Oscillation, increasing energy and moisture and lowering wind shear values leads me to believe that tropical cyclone development is quite possible by this weekend or early next week.

The NOGAPS model is the most aggressive by far as it forecasts the development of a tropical storm by Thursday of this week in the western Caribbean. It then forecasts this tropical storm to quickly become a hurricane in the northwestern Caribbean by Saturday and aim its sights towards western Florida and the Florida Panhandle early next week. I want to be blunt and say that I DO NOT believe this particular model solution and have thrown it out of my forecast reasoning process.

The Canadian model forecasts the development of a tropical storm in the western Caribbean by about next Tuesday and forecasts this tropical storm to be located in the western Gulf of Mexico in about 10 days from now.


The GFS model guidance hints at tropical development in the northwestern Caribbean by late this weekend and eventually splits into two low pressure systems. One near the northwestern Bahamas and other in the western Caribbean by about next Tuesday.

Finally, the European model guidance forecasts the development of a low pressure system in the northwestern Caribbean early next week and forecasts this system to get into the southeastern Gulf of Mexico by about next Wednesday and the central Gulf of Mexico by next Thursday.

I may be stubborn in saying that I strongly believe that tropical development will occur in the western Caribbean sometime between Sunday and Tuesday (June 17th and June 19th). There is just too much evidence with current data to not ignore this possibility and call it the way I see it. I continue to monitor this potential closely and will keep you all updated on the latest.
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#3698 Postby somethingfunny » Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:46 pm

You know, I can no longer say with certainty that Chris will form within the next two weeks (though I feel pretty confident about Carlotta) ... but you know what I WOULD say with a pretty high amount of confidence? That Central America is going to get a LOT of rain within the next two weeks. Whether it's got a name or not, I suspect there's going to be some bad flooding.
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3699 Postby cycloneye » Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:20 pm

The 12z ECMWF has a ton of moisture in the GOM at 216 hours and in 240 hours but without development.

Image

Image
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Re: Global Model Runs Discussion

#3700 Postby Aric Dunn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:28 pm

cycloneye wrote:The 12z ECMWF has a ton of moisture in the GOM at 216 hours and in 240 hours but without development.

[img]http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6087/12zeurotropical850mbvor.gif[/mg]

[img]http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/6087/12zeurotropical850mbvor.gif[/mg]


yeah again just like last couple days except for last nights 00z run. it keeps all the energy over land as it migrates north till it reaches the gulf... none of the other models are really doing that.

better resolution.
http://www.meteo.psu.edu/~gadomski/ECMW ... floop.html
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