Bush Administration developing Total Information Awarenes

#1 Postby **coriolis** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 8:55 pm

Here's the address of a gov't site about the TIA system now being developed.

http://www.darpa.mil/iao/TIASystems.htm

Here's another good one:
http://www.geocities.com/totalinformationawareness

Just paste them in your browser or do a search for Total Information Awareness. You'll get a ton of links.

Apparantly the gov't is developing this system to gather all manner of electronic information about people, including motor vehicle records, criminal records, credit card information, telephone bills, tax records, birth and death records, medical records, and bank records, internet usage, etc. etc. This is intended to create profiles and enable the gov't to identify "potential" terrorists. It's being done in great secrecy.

Well, this may well catch a few terrorists, but it's not worth the loss of privacy of the rest of us law abiding citizens.

This is a crucial part of the infrastructure needed for an out of control government to gain total control of the governed. This administration may have good intentions about providing safety for the public, but once it's in place it will never go away. A future admministration may not be so interested in our safety. Once we are all logged in the system, the next step is a national identity card or an implanted chip, or a tatoo. You know what I'm getting at!

This is a misguided effort. We must oppose it.

Everyone has heard Ben Franklin's quote "they that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

I've been supportive of this war against terrorism and Iraq. But this is one weapon that we don't need.

#2 Postby **wx247** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:02 pm

That is scary! What happens if the terrorists hacked into that?

mf_dolphin · #3 Postby **mf_dolphin** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:20 pm

Commercial companies have been gathering that kind of information on all of us for decades. It's a system that could very well be abused and probably will be sometime in the future. I have very mixed feelings about it myself but haven't made up my mind yet.

#4 Postby **Stephanie** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:22 pm

I'm surprised that even Majority leader Tom Delay is a part of the "concerned" list!

It always amazed me that our personal information wasn't already easily accessible for the government. I stated in a post yesterday that as our nation becomes more paranoid about the war and terrorism, "Big Brother" will become more and more involved in our daily lives.

mf_dolphin · #5 Postby **mf_dolphin** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:31 pm

If you think those annoying phone calls are just a coincidence think again. Telemarketing firms are very very targeted anymore. They build call lists on lifestyle profiles based on your home value, credit history, purchasing patterns, debt ratio...... sound like familiar information :?:

#6 Postby **coriolis** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:40 pm

That's true that much of this information is already available. But not in one place! One aim of this program is to make the information available in real time, analyze it, and draw conclusions. The system would be able to tell the difference between me renting a moving van because I got a new job, and a middle east immigrant with a lot of recent suspicious telephone calls trying to rent a moving van. In that case, ther rental would be denied, and the police would close in immediately. So some day, if I was deemed a "troublemaker" they could come after me. While Bush is intending to use this for good use, in the future it could make us all into managed sheep. Things could get very interesting for someone who dares to think differently.

mf_dolphin · #7 Postby **mf_dolphin** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:44 pm

More of it is available "in one place than you realize. The government just doesn't have it. I agree that the system is well intentioned but wide open to abuse in the future. Definitely something to be wary of but I'd still rather have the screws tightened down some and not have the security that could be gained.

#8 Postby **coriolis** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 9:49 pm

One other component of the population management system will be a cashless society.

The gov't is already planning the next generation of redesigned paper money. That is a bad sign. It means that the counterfeiters are gaining ground again. At some point they will just give up on cash.

When that happens, look out!

#9 Postby **streetsoldier** » Fri Mar 07, 2003 11:46 pm

I do detest acting in a sophomoric, juvenile manner, but...

"TOLD YA SO!!!"

#10 Postby **coriolis** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 9:23 am

And again, going to the cashless society will be done in the name of "security." This all seems to be so scripted. America, land of the free, home of the brave? Make it so!

mf_dolphin · #11 Postby **mf_dolphin** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 9:53 am

I'm a little confused Coriolis, on one hand you say that a cashless society is a bad thing and yet you also alude to the fact that the Government is getting ready to release a new type of currency is also bad news....

#12 Postby **coriolis** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 10:38 am

MF, the existing "new' currency is only a few years old. When it came out it was touted as having all these cool features to thwart counterfieiters, such as the watermark, the portrait that can only be viewed when held up to a light, the security strips (i think that they glow under an ultraviolet light), increased microprinting etc. But if the gov't is proposing new currency again after such a short time, it means that counterfeiters are again making gains. It seems to me that with computer printing, it is getting harder and harder to make "secure" currency, and the new colorful currency may have an even shorter life span. This will undermine confidence in our money and create the perception of a crisis. The gov't will impose (or the public may demand) a secure way to conduct our transactions. Hence the cashless society. It could turn into some sort of personal debit account. This already exists as an option but it will become mandatory. At least now, it's controlled by an individual bank. With the on-line verification system that's already in place, it wouldn't take much of a transition to go totally cashless. Many employers (including my own) have mandatory direct deposit, again done in the name of "security and efficiency." That's another piece of the puzzle. It doesn't help that these stupid retailers use those stupid markers to check the bills. They ignore the real ways to verify them.

Did you notice that the largest denomination is the $100. There used to be larger bills. I suspect that they were done away with in the name of security. Did you know that cash transactions above a certain value must be reported?

With all these things happening in the financial realm, plus the security threats from our war on terrorism, all this could accelerate. My concern is trading anonymous transactions for tracked transactions. They will argue that cashless transactions will hurt the drug trade and other illegal transactions. Don't underestimate the ability of criminals to keep up with the technology. There wll become a black market of electronic credits too, causing increased centraliazation. At that point all we need is another crisis for the gov't to gain complete control.

These things have happened in the past, like in the McCarty era when they were exposing communists among us. There were dirty tricks and illegal things done in that effort. Can you imagine what would have happened if the FBI had all these forms of virtual monitoring and control over the money back then? The electronic era doesn't change human nature, it just allows bad people to do bad things faster and more efficiently.

sunny shine · #13 Postby **sunny shine** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 10:42 am

Hackers have already been able to access Government computer files. Someone hacked into the Navy computers and downloaded about 700 Navy personnel's personal information. So it can be done!!

Financial Institutions already have the ability to contact authorities if you make a large cash deposit if they feel it is not legitimate money. It happened to a friend of mine not too long ago. She refinanced her home with a large "cash-out" and her bank contacted the authorities.

mf_dolphin · #14 Postby **mf_dolphin** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 11:03 am

Bank's must report all cash transactions over $10,000. This was inacted to track money laundering activities usually associated with organized crime and the drug trade.

sunny shine · #15 Postby **sunny shine** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 12:31 pm

mf_dolphin wrote:Bank's must report all cash transactions over $10,000. This was inacted to track money laundering activities usually associated with organized crime and the drug trade.

That explains it then. :roll:

M2 · #16 Postby M2 » Sat Mar 08, 2003 5:24 pm

mf_dolphin wrote:

More of it is available "in one place than you realize...

Marshall right again as usual :wink:

And the transaction amount is actually only $1500.00 - that's fifteen-hundered. "1984" has been around for quite sometime as they can know everything about anyone given enough time. That's all we're discussing here is "time"; the ability has been in place. If you don't do anything 'bad' then you shouldn't worry. Everthing is already known: where you've been, what you do, where you surf, what you buy, where you live/work/eat/sleep/hang. Civil liberties have been long gone for a long time. The questions you should be asking - loudly - is how is all of this information going to be protected. Who's minding the databases? Can they guarantee the information cannot be compromised? What is the risk and if info is compromised, how are they going to help YOU restore your credit, your identity. How are YOU protected now legally? Hummm.....

mf_dolphin · #17 Postby **mf_dolphin** » Sat Mar 08, 2003 7:37 pm

Thanks for the confidence M2 but the mandatory point for reporting is $10,000.01. This requires a CTR (Currenct Transaction Report) mandated but the Federal Government. This rules applies to any cash transaction or set of transactions in one day that reach that dollar value. This prevents someone from making several smaller transactions in the same day. The bank is also supposed to report any suspicious transactions even if they don't exceed $10,000. My wife's been a banker for 20 years

Bush Administration developing Total Information Awarenes

Bush Administration developing Total Information Awarenes

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