WONDERFULLY Patriotic Legal Immigrants website

[GalvestonDuck]

Great site, from what I've read so far, and there's still more to read but I had to share. I found this after reading a FoxNews article about an uncle who forwarded a paper that his nephew wrote to several dozen coworkers. The paper was called "Is Islam Really Peaceful?" and cited Islamic scripture as a source for his thoughts on how violent the Islamic religion can be.

I figured I'd try a Yahoo search and see if I could find what this "Is Islam Really Peaceful?" paper might have said (since they didn't publish it on the webpage). I got several hits and one that I clicked on was this one http://www.immigrantsforamerica.com/our_values.html

After that, I was a bit sidetracked and still haven't made it back to my original search.

Although I already knew that there are very patriotic, loyal first-generation newbies in our country, it really helped to see that. If only we could tighten the borders and know that we're just letting in these guys....

This is just part of it, but it says alot:

Our Values
We believe in:
One Nation: Under God
One Language: English as Official Language
One Allegiance: Supporting America, not bashing it
Energy Independence: A Self-Reliant Source of Energy
Responsible Immigration: Measured & Practical, with secure borders
E Pluribus Unum: "Out of the Many... One". Assimilate and unite, not divide
(Click on the above motto words to go to the page)


America is our Country
- It is Dear and Special to Us
- We love America
- We love Freedom
- We pledge allegiance to the flag
- We believe in God. In God We Trust
- We are proud to be Americans

[coriolis]

That's interesting Duck. Many immigrants come here for the right reasons, but it is worrysome that there are also some here for the wrong reasons.
Let us know about your original search, I would be very interested in what you find. I want to do some homework too. I was hearing Michael Savage give his interpretation of the history of Islam, as an evangelistic movement, intent on converting everyone, contributing to many wars over the centuries. Some are saying that Islam is a peaceful religion, but others are saying that Islam justifies any means convert or defeat the inifdels.

[GalvestonDuck]

Still looking, although it may not be online yet.

Here's an article from the Baltimore Sun:

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/ ... 2996.story

More than 30 senators and delegates issued a public rebuke to Del. Donald H. Dwyer Jr. yesterday over what they described as a "prejudicial and hateful" e-mail he sent to all General Assembly members last week questioning whether Islam is a peaceful religion.

The lawmakers, all Democrats, released a statement criticizing the Anne Arundel County Republican's use of the Assembly's computer system to circulate an essay concluding that Muslims practice a warlike religion.

Separately, the Maryland chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a leading advocacy group for Muslims' civil rights, announced that it will hold a news conference today to call on the Joint Committee on Legislative Ethics to conduct an inquiry into Dwyer's conduct.

[Guest]

In my opinion men are the big deal, the big difference.
Never seen a God descending on the Earth and killing those not believing in him, just men brandishing their swords, their books, their thruts...

I have not much faith in mankind, we tend too much to destruction.
We've lost our feeling with the nature, and the nature will take his revenge.

[timNms]

In my opinion men are the big deal, the big difference.
Never seen a God descending on the Earth and killing those not believing in him, just men brandishing their swords, their books, their thruts...

I have not much faith in mankind, we tend too much to destruction.
We've lost our feeling with the nature, and the nature will take his revenge.

Although I wasn't there to see, I recall reading in the Bible of a city that was destroyed by God because the people had turned their backs on him. I also recall reading in the Bible about a flood that destroyed all but a handful of people.

[Willh]

In my opinion men are the big deal, the big difference.
Never seen a God descending on the Earth and killing those not believing in him, just men brandishing their swords, their books, their thruts...

I have not much faith in mankind, we tend too much to destruction.
We've lost our feeling with the nature, and the nature will take his revenge.

Although I wasn't there to see, I recall reading in the Bible of a city that was destroyed by God because the people had turned their backs on him. I also recall reading in the Bible about a flood that destroyed all but a handful of people.

Then again, due to the popularity of this story around the world in mythology, most likely it is merely another myth that seeks no end other than destruction and other similarly typical human concepts.
Creating stories that display God destroying people or whole cultures are an effective way of controlling the public and enforcing morals or profiting off of the guilt they induce.

[stormraiser]

Paolo, I understand what you are saying, but..... What's a thrut?

[GalvestonDuck]

I think it was a typo -- maybe should have been "truths?"

[timNms]

will, call it a myth or whatever you want. Still doesn't change the fact that it all happened just as it is written.

[Willh]

will, call it a myth or whatever you want. Still doesn't change the fact that it all happened just as it is written.

Be that as it may, there is no proof of the reality of your religion. If one were to study the worlds religions and myths you'd come to the same conclusion...
Interesting to note, as well, that prior to, say, 300 ad there were numerous forms of Christianity...some of which were polytheistic, etc. The current version is simply the version backed with the most brute strength. It's not very good to know, either, that many of the facets of the religion you put your faith in were created as political compromises over 1500 years ago...or that many ideas, saints, etc were drawn from other religions to encourage conversion due to familiarity.

[GalvestonDuck]

Proof of the reality of religion?

There's a world of difference between proof and faith. Faith serves as "proof," if you will, for those who believe in the higher power of their religion, be it the Christian God, the Muslim Allah, or the polytheistic gods of Greece or Roman mythology.

Faith is just that -- a strong, hopeful belief in something positive (for me, my faith is in God). You don't have to prove a belief. However, it can show itself in ways that can't always be physically handled, photographed, or observed. It appears sometimes as a coincidence (non-believers would call it that) when things work out the way a person was hoping (praying) they would. It appears as a miracle when someone is saved by being at the right place at the right time or being at the wrong place at the right time (such as missing one of the 9/11 flights). But in whatever mysterious way it appears, the "proof" is strong enough for those of us who believe.

[Willh]

Proof of the reality of religion?

There's a world of difference between proof and faith. Faith serves as "proof," if you will, for those who believe in the higher power of their religion, be it the Christian God, the Muslim Allah, or the polytheistic gods of Greece or Roman mythology.

Faith is just that -- a strong, hopeful belief in something positive (for me, my faith is in God). You don't have to prove a belief. However, it can show itself in ways that can't always be physically handled, photographed, or observed. It appears sometimes as a coincidence (non-believers would call it that) when things work out the way a person was hoping (praying) they would. It appears as a miracle when someone is saved by being at the right place at the right time or being at the wrong place at the right time (such as missing one of the 9/11 flights). But in whatever mysterious way it appears, the "proof" is strong enough for those of us who believe.

Which is why Christianity cannot be considered a universal fact.

[Willh]

I believe there is a higher power...based on many personal experiences.
However, I simply don't feel Christianity is anything different than any other attempt made by humans to explain their plight.
It's not new, it's not original...and it makes no objective sense to me.

I'm sick of always being equated with atheists simply because I don't respect or agree with Christianity, which I find to be harmful to humanity. Perhaps it was good in history, especially in its introduction of a welfare system of sorts...however now it seems to bring mostly pain, segregating others, creating strife, and even driving some to suicide, as it does with many homosexuals, several of who were my friends. Christianity drives apart families based on its fundamentals. Something like this is not the creation of a loving god, it's the creation of fallible, fearful man
I hope that it is soon abandoned...

[timNms]

Will, whether you choose to believe or not, is up to you. I'm not going to try to change your beliefs. However, I will say this. What happens if you are wrong when you die?

[Willh]

Will, whether you choose to believe or not, is up to you. I'm not going to try to change your beliefs. However, I will say this. What happens if you are wrong when you die?

Dunno, perhaps I'll have to come back and work on my chakras a bit more...

[GalvestonDuck]

Which is why Christianity cannot be considered a universal fact.

If I understand you correctly, do you actually mean to say that the Bible cannot be considered universal fact?

I can understand that because not everyone will believe as Christians believe. However, why can't Christianity be accepted as a universal fact? For the most part, we all accept Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, and other religions. That doesn't mean we believe in that particular faith. But we can study and gain an understanding of what they believe and what the differences are between our faith and theirs. Not having faith in something does not necessarily make it a myth and it doesn't necessarily make it wrong. Nevertheless, we can try to debate it at times in an effort to gain a clearer understanding of what someone else believes.

[WEATHER53]

Overwhelmingly I do not buy into the concept that people are driven to suicide. To proffer such is another abdication of personal responsibility. Nobody drives anyone to anything. Now mental illness can preclude this but the idea of you drove me to drink, you drove me to hit you, you drove me to kill you, you drove me to kill me, is babble designed to lay the blame/responsibility somewhere other than where it rightfully belongs.

[Willh]

Overwhelmingly I do not buy into the concept that people are driven to suicide. To proffer such is another abdication of personal responsibility. Nobody drives anyone to anything. Now mental illness can preclude this but the idea of you drove me to drink, you drove me to hit you, you drove me to kill you, you drove me to kill me, is babble designed to lay the blame/responsibility somewhere other than where it rightfully belongs.

I knew a person kicked out of their family because they were gay. He was 18, had no way to attend college and no money saved up. The fact that his parents would never love him again, that he would never be able to afford college and that he was not prepared to face life drove him to kill himself.
If not for the prejudice incited by the bible this would not have happened.

[GalvestonDuck]

I'm sorry about your friend, Will, and I'm sad that he felt that was the only way out.

Been there, done that...tasted the barrel of a pistol.

However, the Bible helps in more ways than it hurts. Again, I'm talking about faith and it's hard to "show" everything that I'm talking about and what I've felt without getting really, really lengthy.

Perhaps if your friend had read the Bible himself instead of someone preaching to him about how "God hates f***" and so forth, he might had been encouraged to keep living and see what the future had in store for him.

I'm appalled by those who actually strive to turn people away from God by telling them that He hates them. That's not what Christianity is about.

[timNms]

I'm appalled by those who actually strive to turn people away from God by telling them that He hates them. That's not what Christianity is about.

You got that right, Duck!