WMDs factory found in Iraq

Chat about anything and everything... (well almost anything) Whether it be the front porch or the pot belly stove or news of interest or a topic of your liking, this is the place to post it.

Moderator: S2k Moderators

Message
Author
User avatar
sunny shine
Category 2
Category 2
Posts: 533
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:16 pm
Location: Destin, FL.

#21 Postby sunny shine » Sun Mar 23, 2003 10:16 pm

One must wonder why Hans Blix failed to find this.
0 likes   

User avatar
weatherwunder
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1098
Age: 62
Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2003 2:21 pm
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Contact:

#22 Postby weatherwunder » Sun Mar 23, 2003 10:25 pm

Too old maybe?
0 likes   

User avatar
vbhoutex
Storm2k Executive
Storm2k Executive
Posts: 29112
Age: 73
Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2002 11:31 pm
Location: Cypress, TX
Contact:

#23 Postby vbhoutex » Sun Mar 23, 2003 10:38 pm

This plant was disquised with sandcast, a way of using sand sculpted to look like regular sandunes from above. And there are those that say it could just be a regular chemical plant?? GIMME A BREAK!! :roll: :grrr: :roll: :grrr: :roll: :grrr: :roll: :grrr: :roll: :grrr: :roll: :grrr: Try me again after the war!!! Blix didn't find it because it wasn't on any lists. Uh, who cares whether it was on a list? He was supposed to find these things, not rely soley on the lists the "cooperative " Iraqi's provided. Progress indeed!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

The Iraqi's will use any means at their disposal to try and stop our forces!! They are brainwashed and have no sense of right or wrong except what has been put in their heads. LOOK WHAT THEY ARE DOING TO OUR CAPTURED TROOPS!!! They have already violated almost every tenet of the Geneva accords!!
0 likes   
Skywarn, C.E.R.T.
Please click below to donate to STORM2K to help with the expenses of keeping the site going:
Image

User avatar
mf_dolphin
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 17758
Age: 68
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 2:05 pm
Location: St Petersburg, FL
Contact:

#24 Postby mf_dolphin » Sun Mar 23, 2003 11:30 pm

And the Iraqi's made a full and complete declaration...yeah right! :grrr:

Now they have no reason not to use the weapons they have. :o Their only remaining cover looks like it's been blown. Now the danger just keeps higher, Stay safe guys and kick their @ss!
0 likes   

User avatar
JQ Public
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 4488
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2003 1:17 am
Location: Cary, NC

#25 Postby JQ Public » Mon Mar 24, 2003 12:33 am

scary! keep us updated y'all!
0 likes   

User avatar
Arizwx
Category 2
Category 2
Posts: 503
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2003 7:03 am
Location: West Coast,U.S.A.
Contact:

Re: Wait A Moment...

#26 Postby Arizwx » Mon Mar 24, 2003 1:01 am

mf_dolphin wrote:
Arizwx wrote:
mf_dolphin wrote:This is great news! STUFF IT FRANCE! Is there a link to the story?


HOW is this GOOD NEWS?It is fine for making a Political POINT,however,Political Points don't interact directly with our troops safety,and those of the Iraqi people and the Middle East as a whole.
This means,IF it is what I beleive it is,the 100 acre plant that 'Chemical Ali' used for the proliferation of developed VX and Mustard.This is VERY dangerous,as the WMDs are already PRODUCED.Which means,we have to find the 1000s of Litres of Chems...presumeably,Saddam had plenty of time (thanks to the FRENCH and GERMANS and SWEDES and RUSSIANS!!!)to deliver the 'Product' to Republican Guard units(not necessarilty Divisions).This is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS,and changes the face of our March to Baghdad,we MUST be careful not to have a Rear Flank Missile (WMD) attack from the Dug In Rep Guard elite.
Remeber,just as the War started...the US GOV reported that Iraqi Troops had been observed LOADING WMDs into Missiles.


My point was that we may now have proof. The discovery of the plant doesn't increase the chance of a chemical attack on our troops. I don't think any reasonable person thinks that Saddam has destroyed his arsenal. The potential (strong likelyhood) has been there from the beginning and will increase as we approach Bagdad. I just have faith that our military commanders have taken this inot account and have planned for it. I agree that it is an extremely dangerous situation. I was stationed at Dugway Proving Grounds where our own chemical/biological weapons were developed and learned real quick just what those type of weapons can do.


Indeed Marshall,
I did concede your point.With all due respect,I believe an air of overconfidence and arrogance has corrupted our game plan.We did NOT expect to find,according to reports this Gold Mine of Death so close to Baghdad..a mere 90miles.Fortunately,we used DRONE aircraft to strike a protecting AAA Site just a few hundred yards away...once we did,the Genie was out of the Bottle.
I noticed a few remarks here that disturb me.One is this is NO laughing matter.Secondly,the French..the Russians and possibly Blix could be accused of major insurrection and conspiricy.
Furthermore..I was a Naval Officer,Aviator and Intel Officer in Vietnam.
I understand the dangers of a rear flank hit...and one MUST connect the dots.
I agree,that nothing is stopping the Iraqi Military from ordering a WMD strike(s).Look at the atrocities already committed against POWs.This is a hainus violation of Geneva Convention Accords...the same ones I saw violated over and over again in SEASIA.They do NOT play by the rules.
Period.
It is IMHO,a MUCH different situation,due to the proxomity of the WMD plant and the fact that the 'rumors' of WMDs are now a reality.Much different psychologically.
The Iraqis are desperados,with a still functioning Military,still recieving and carring out orders.Possibly,we thought that they would 'fold' under the thought of overwhelming force.
This has yet to become apparent.We must take the ENEMY seriously and stop the half throttled approach.
0 likes   

User avatar
vbhoutex
Storm2k Executive
Storm2k Executive
Posts: 29112
Age: 73
Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2002 11:31 pm
Location: Cypress, TX
Contact:

#27 Postby vbhoutex » Mon Mar 24, 2003 1:08 am

If I am reading you right Arizwx, you are advocating more "shock and awe" and I presume more troops on the ground who assume everyone is an enemy and therefore either take no prisoners or "arrest" and ask questions later. I am not questioning what you are advocating, but trying to get clarification. In other words what would you do differently?

I ask this question especially now that they have apparently found a second plant!!!
0 likes   
Skywarn, C.E.R.T.
Please click below to donate to STORM2K to help with the expenses of keeping the site going:
Image

User avatar
Arizwx
Category 2
Category 2
Posts: 503
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2003 7:03 am
Location: West Coast,U.S.A.
Contact:

The Bible

#28 Postby Arizwx » Mon Mar 24, 2003 1:58 am

vbhoutex wrote:If I am reading you right Arizwx, you are advocating more "shock and awe" and I presume more troops on the ground who assume everyone is an enemy and therefore either take no prisoners or "arrest" and ask questions later. I am not questioning what you are advocating, but trying to get clarification. In other words what would you do differently?

I ask this question especially now that they have apparently found a second plant!!!


I know that you are a devout and kind Christain Gentleman,possibly I am less forgiving of atrocities to Human Kind.The Lord above,himself..found it necessary to use 'Overwhelming Force' ie:Noah's Ark & the Flood.This is how and why we still,to this day use the Olive Branch and the Dove as signs of peace..HOWEVER..it should be noted that Peace cannot be achieved when dealing with Satan himself until that Dove has the chance to reap the Olive branch AFTER the fact.
I disdain the term 'Shock and Awe'.It sounds like something a Soccer Mom with a recently dusted off Marketing Degree cam up with.I do not like the insinuation that clever 'Tags' can fully describe the horrors of War.
I do not like the fact the TV Cams are present either.It reminds me of Court TV a Million Fold during the Menendez Trial.Judges,Juries and even Bailiffs can and do 'play' to the Cameras.
Let the world know that we fought valiantly,with honor without a Sony Cam in their faces!It compromises IMO,our efforts,and the fear of perception that we may be using force that is unfit for the Dinner hour in Des Moines.It has no place.This is WAR for OUR survival..and the free world.We must take appropraite action WHEN and WHERE we see fit to quote the President and his Administration.This is not 'Survivor',it is WAR.
Reality TV,has I suppose incredible ratings..however...the 'reality' of War is surreal.The Images of the POWs was so outrageous,the President is in shock.I say..WHY?This is WAR!NOTHING should shock anyone that has 'been there done that'.
After WWII,we the US,have been very careful with our use of force.Technically until 1991,no War was officially named or considered as such.Congress,again careful.War is not popular.Nor is the admission that diplomacy was not a viable solution.In this case,we should note:
Korea was a Police Action.Vietnam,a Civil Insurrection and so on.Possibly,the use of the 2 ThermoNukes against Japan had a profound affect on the US mindset.Although,justified and noted in History as such,and the fact that 10s possibly 100s of thousands of lives were saved,the fact reamins..we used the most powerful(at that time)WMD ever imagined.The H-(Hydrogen)Bomb that came shortly thereafter was deemed 'illegal' for any civilized Nation to ever consider using.The dessimation of the Bikini Atoll and her displaced culture of people,along with the still lingering environmental destruction illustrates the point.
The use Weapons,war,violence,ULTRA Violence and all it intimates are unpleasant.It goes without saying that much good will come from this.
It is a Noble Cause.It also is dirty.It is at times unpopular.It is SOBERING.
I do not advocate any use of force that goes beyond the realm of what we may consider Sane.However,IF we do not have a direct and decisive game plan that is also flexible,we risk not only our troops...a 3rd of a Million...but also 40Million Iraqis..inclusive of the Kurds.
I do advocate a positive assault of Baghdad...one with teeth.One that will take on Saddam's thugs and topple his regime.I am not interested so much in Political issues now,however,we must be careful..for that is how History will judge us as a Protector..or just another Invader of the Ancient Ottoman Empire..one which Saddam is unlikely to give up easily.
0 likes   

ColdFront77

#29 Postby ColdFront77 » Mon Mar 24, 2003 4:44 am

I have been listening or watching Fox News Channel most of the day (Sunday); I'd say 100 acres is huge! Great find for our mission in Iraq...
0 likes   

Steve H.
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 2146
Joined: Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:06 am
Location: Palm Bay, Florida

Liked What You Said Arizwx

#30 Postby Steve H. » Mon Mar 24, 2003 8:39 am

War is sobering, it is not a video game, but yet surreal. We cannot use half measures here. If we do we risk losing many more lives. Yet there is the tight rope that we must walk when trying not to kill innocents. The rear flank should have been better thought out concerning "surrenders," but as Americans we are trusting people. We were racing to keep up with the advancing ground forces and got out of sync. Need to protect the Engineering Corps moving in. Poor execution there IMO. But hindsight is 20/20. We must press on. It will be a heavy week. On the other point Arizwx use raise some interesting issues concerning christian doctrine and war. As a christian this war, as any, is difficult. Under the Law of Moses (Old Testament) entire family lines were wiped out right after Moses brought down the tablets and he saw the disobedience of the people to God. Under the New Covenant, war is hard to justify. "Give to Rome what is Rome's," simply meant to pay what you owed (taxes). "Serve your masters," means to be good workers and be loyal and humble servants, even if they are slave masters. But only to the point where the Word is not violated, i.e., don't participate in sexual imorality or murder if commanded by your leader. This is a tough situation as a christian. Sargeant York had this same dilemma. Through prayer about how he should serve he found his answers. It is through prayer we must find ours. :) Gotta get back to work, but this is a serious issue.
0 likes   

User avatar
streetsoldier
Retired Staff
Retired Staff
Posts: 9705
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:33 pm
Location: Under the rainbow

#31 Postby streetsoldier » Mon Mar 24, 2003 9:03 am

Another point to be made (thanks for bringing it up, Commander) is that this is only ONE plant we have found, and it was PRODUCING the weapons-grade stuff....which means that it has already been issued out to the "fedayeen", if not Al Qaida, Al Aqsa, Al Capone, etc. for future nastiness.

If Saddam "hid" this, it raises the stakes on what OTHER terror weapons he has, may have had, and may have already sold or distributed, and to whom...this ain't the worst of it yet.

As for France (technology and funding), Sweden (spares and tools), Russia (blatant selling of state-of-the-art optics and guidance/blocking systems) and Germany (more technoloical advantages, spares and tools), and Dr. Hans Blix himself (who OWNS stock in PetroFina (French oil interests) and SAAB-Volvo (Swedish auto-aeronautical engineering)...you do the math.

WE were, and are screwed...well before we went to the UN on Colin Powell's insistence.
0 likes   

User avatar
StormCrazyIowan
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 6599
Age: 42
Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2003 8:13 pm
Location: Quad Cities, IA
Contact:

#32 Postby StormCrazyIowan » Mon Mar 24, 2003 9:07 am

God bless us, we need it!
0 likes   

Rainband

#33 Postby Rainband » Mon Mar 24, 2003 10:48 am

StormCrazyIowan wrote:God bless us, we need it!
I agree... :wink:


Johnathan
0 likes   

User avatar
vbhoutex
Storm2k Executive
Storm2k Executive
Posts: 29112
Age: 73
Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2002 11:31 pm
Location: Cypress, TX
Contact:

#34 Postby vbhoutex » Mon Mar 24, 2003 12:53 pm

Great discussion Gentlemen!!!!

I must agree with all I have read!!

DJ, you probably read me better than I do!! As a Christian it is very difficult for me to justify violence as a means to an end. That being said, we are there and we are there for a GOOD purpose-TO RID THIS WORLD OF ONE OF THE WORST EVILS IT HAS EVER SEEN-IMO THIS MAN IS AS BAD AS OR WORSE THAN HITLER!! As a Christian I also know that we must sometimes resort to violence to stop ATROCITIES and EVIL which is what we are facing here. As you stated, this is not survivor, this is REALITY and the REALITY OF WAR IS THAT IT IS HELL ON EARTH!!! We are truly fighting, IMO, for the survival of FREEDOM, not just for ourselves but for billions in this world. To this end, violence or not, we must SUPPORT OUR LEADERS AND OUR TROOPS! What a great analogy DJ on the shock and awe!!! I agree fully!!! As intriquing as it all is to be up close and personal watching the war unfold, IMO, the imbedded journalists need to be taken out now and not allowed back. If there is any good that could come out of this coverage, it is that the rest of the population will realize what war really is, though I doubt it will get that graphic! And, finally to you DJ, I say you are also a good Christian Gentleman and nothing less. What you have that I don't is the personal experience of being at war and if that does not give you a different and probably better perspective on all of this, I don't know what would.

ABOVE ALL I ASK EVERYONE WHO READS THIS TO DOUBLE THEIR INTERCESSORY PRAYERS FOR OUR TROOPS AND LEADERS, THAT THEY MAY ALL BE GUIDED BY GOD'S OWN HAND AND PROTECTED BY THE SAME, COMING BACK HOME TO US SAFE AND UNHARMED. IF YOU ARE NOT A RELIGIOUS PERSON I ASK THAT YOU AT LEAST KEEP THE THOUGHT IN YOUR MIND FOR THE SAFE RETURN OF OUR TROOPS.
0 likes   
Skywarn, C.E.R.T.
Please click below to donate to STORM2K to help with the expenses of keeping the site going:
Image

User avatar
JQ Public
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 4488
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2003 1:17 am
Location: Cary, NC

#35 Postby JQ Public » Mon Mar 24, 2003 2:44 pm

any more info?
0 likes   


Return to “Off Topic”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests