Explosions in subway system & bus in London

[TexasStooge]

(Sighs) Those terrorists just can't leave EVERYTHING alone can they?
They're not happy unless we're all dead.

[stormie_skies]

It is wonderful to see that there haven't been as many injuries & fatalities this time, though I cannot imagine this will help the nerves of people who were just starting to get over being gunshy (or tube-shy)...

There is apparently also concern over a possible suicide bomber at University College Hospital ... police are there, but no word on the outcome....I don't have TV right now so maybe someone here can let us know if its been cleared up....

They may have been copycat attacks, but I don't find any comfort in that. The original London terrorists were surely copying what they saw in Madrid, and the Madrid terrorists were copying what they saw in Iraq and in Israel. Copycat or not, all of these attacks are very dangerous and very scary - and its only a matter of time before one of our transit systems faces the same fate.

One thing I have to say has really, really impressed me with the Brits: they are incredibly good at keeping their cool through terrible times. Even after the monstrocity of the first attacks, people collected themselves and got on with things like they normally would - with the exception of the pictures taken at the scene of the attacks, I saw very little in the way of panic or hysteria. People who couldn't get to work because of the tube closures or couldn't get home went to the pub like they normally did....they ate dinner, had drinks, watched the cricket match. Its not that they didn't care, or didn't want to fight....its that they wanted to prove to these monsters that nothing they could do would ever change the way people live in London. I love the message that kind of determination sends. I wish Americans were more predisposed to it.

I wish my grandfather, who was a pilot in the Royal Air Force during WWII, was alive to see the way his fellow Brits have handled themselves. I'm sure he would be proud.


A great bit from the London News Review from July 7 (edited slightly):

"What the %#$@ do you think you're doing? This is London. We've dealt with your sort before. You don't try and pull this on us.
Do you have any idea how many times our city has been attacked? Whatever you're trying to do, it's not going to work.
All you've done is end some of our lives, and ruin some more. How is that going to help you? You don't get rewarded for this kind of crap.
And if, as your MO indicates, you're an al-Qaeda group, then you're out of your tiny minds.
Because if this is a message to Tony Blair, we've got news for you. We don't much like our government ourselves, or what they do in our name. But, listen very clearly. We'll deal with that ourselves. We're London, and we've got our own way of doing things, and it doesn't involve tossing bombs around where innocent people are going about their lives.
And that's because we're better than you. Everyone is better than you. Our city works. We rather like it. And we're going to go about our lives. We're going to take care of the lives you ruined. And then we're going to work. And we're going down the pub.
So you can pack up your bombs, put them in your arseholes, and get the #@$% out of our city."

[JTD]

Subways expected to reopen shortly... I'm thinking it was a copycat. Explosions were small and only one injury.

Maybe even some "pranksters" because the guy arrested outside of 10 downing street looked Caucasian to me.

[alicia-w]

(Sighs) Those terrorists just can't leave EVERYTHING alone can they?
They're not happy unless we're all dead.

they dont necessarily want to kill people as much as they want to totally disrupt everything. (not that killing people doesnt do that...)

remember those two guys shooting at people in virginia a couple of years ago? they almost singlehandedly created such a wave of fear... that's what the terrorists want to achieve. they want to affect your everyday routine.....

[stormie_skies]

(Sighs) Those terrorists just can't leave EVERYTHING alone can they?
They're not happy unless we're all dead.

they dont necessarily want to kill people as much as they want to totally disrupt everything. (not that killing people doesnt do that...)

remember those two guys shooting at people in virginia a couple of years ago? they almost singlehandedly created such a wave of fear... that's what the terrorists want to achieve. they want to affect your everyday routine.....

Exactly - which is why I find the Brits inclination to just carry on so sublime. Terrorists want to get a reaction....they remind me of little infants doing the most annoying things over and over ad nauseum, waiting for someone to pay attention to them. The trick certainly worked in Madrid, and in some ways, I think the political hysteria here in the US after 9/11 gave the terrorists some satisfaction as well. But in London, people are determined to ignore the attacks and prove that their way of life will not be changed. That's their silent way of flipping off the terrorists, telling them to bugger off and making them seem truly insignificant .....and I will bet it makes them more angry than any presidential speech or bombing campaign ever could...

[GalvestonDuck]

http://www.werenotafraid.com/

[deb_in_nc]

Man at hospital and another man have been taken into custody.

Debbie

[banshee]

How sad. I was at the dr's office when I saw it on the news. Thankfully no one has been killed. I had to wonder as I watched the news if it wasnt a copy cat or a wannabe with little experience with explosives. Either way, they deserve the same swift justice any terrorist would receive. My next thought is with these trial explosions in London...... are they headed here next. Any thoughts?

[Portastorm]

That is what I wonder ... why hasn't this happened here? You would think it would be rather easy to do the same thing here ... maybe I'm not having enough confidence in our law enforcement officials.

Americans keep hearing its only a matter of time before the "other shoes drops." I dunno. I feel for our British friends.

[P.K.]

Good thing they didn't go off properly.

London attackers 'meant to kill'


Emergency services in protective clothing were deployed at the bus site

The people behind the latest attacks in London meant to kill, the head of the Metropolitan Police has said.

But Sir Ian Blair said evidence left at the scenes could be very helpful to police and added "the intention of the terrorists has failed".

Attempts were made to set off explosives at four locations, including three Tube stations and on one bus.

Mayor Ken Livingstone praised the emergency services and said the people of London would "get through this".

Police sources say the blasts may have been near-simultaneous and that they are being linked with the 7 July bombs.

They say a number of fugitives are being sought. Two people have been arrested in Whitehall.

'Unexploded' devices

Sir Ian said there was a "resonance" with the bomb attacks two weeks ago, but that it was too early to draw any conclusions about whether they were linked.

Police forensic experts are examining the scenes, at Tube stations in Oval, Warren Street and Shepherd's Bush, and on a bus in Shoreditch, east London.

He said important information could be recovered. "From what I understand, some of the devices remain unexploded," he said.

The Met commissioner warned against "smearing" any particular community with the blame for Thursday's attacks.

"These are criminal acts and we are in pursuit of a set of criminals," he said.

Police cordons

Eyewitnesses heard bangs and saw abandoned rucksacks at the sites of the incidents at Warren Street and Oval tube stations as well as the number 26 bus, which was travelling from Waterloo towards Hackney and had just entered Hackney Road.

There was an attempt to cause an explosion at Shepherd's Bush Hammersmith and City line, police said.

Police told reporters that a man had threatened to blow himself up and then ran off.

At Warren Street and Oval a man was seen running away from the scene.

On the bus, there were no injuries and the bus suffered no structural damage.

Large areas around all four sites were cordoned off. Tests for chemical, biological and radiological weapons proved negative.

One person was injured at Warren Street. There were reports the injured person may have been holding a rucksack containing the detonator.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4705117.stm

[BritBob]

Police shot and killed an Asian man on one of the London stations this morning.

[P.K.]

The police were apparently searching everyone's bags but he just ran off which wasn't a sensible idea if he wasn't doing anything wrong. Other people have reported he was wearing some sort of bomb belt.

They are saying the explosives may have a limited lifespan, hence why they didn't explode yesterday, so they are trying to use them up. They have also released pictures of who they think tried to set of the bombs yesterday so they better be caught and locked up soon.

[streetsoldier]

What I heard was that the timing devices were faulty; the people they're looking for have a very short 'half-life" now.

It's a shame we can't do this in the USA (video cams everywhere)...someone's "right to privacy" trumps our ability to identify and respond to terrorists.

[HurryKane]

The police were apparently searching everyone's bags but he just ran off which wasn't a sensible idea if he wasn't doing anything wrong. Other people have reported he was wearing some sort of bomb belt.

He was also wearing a thick, heavy long coat that appeared to be padded. Not so much the comfortable fashion in July.

[P.K.]

It's a shame we can't do this in the USA (video cams everywhere)...someone's "right to privacy" trumps our ability to identify and respond to terrorists.

You don't?? They are everywhere here, you just get used to them. I'm sure I heard at some point we have more here per land area than anywhere else in the world, especially in central London.

To answer the post above well it isn't exactly hot today, at around 19C, but I know what you mean.

[streetsoldier]

P.K., the "American Civil Liberties Union" (ACLU) would have a field day filing lawsuits on behalf of people who don't like the idea of being "watched".

However, our local Wal-Mart has surveillance cams and video screens (viewable by employees and customers!) all over the store, and in the parking lot; and I don't have any problem with it.

[stormie_skies]

P.K., the "American Civil Liberties Union" (ACLU) would have a field day filing lawsuits on behalf of people who don't like the idea of being "watched".

However, our local Wal-Mart has surveillance cams and video screens (viewable by employees and customers!) all over the store, and in the parking lot; and I don't have any problem with it.

Given your opinion on video surveillance (I won't go into it, except to say that I have long thought the Euro use of video cameras and facial recognition was, well, creepy), I'm curious - what do you think about the random search policy being implemented in the NYC transit system? We do submit to searches before flights.....but airplanes are privately owned (and thus not held to the governments constitutional bounds concerning searches, correct?), and besides, most of us fly only occasionally. In NYC, many - probably most - people don't even own a car, and mass transit is a staple of life and pretty much the only way to get around...

Can random searches in and around subways be squared with the protection against unreasonable search and seizure? Or - better yet - is the risk so high that we will benefit more in the way of safety from such an action than we will lose in net freedom from government interference?

[streetsoldier]

"...is the risk so high that we will benefit more in the way of safety from such an action than we will lose in net freedom from government interference?"

Yes. Don't think we don't have cells-in-hiding/training here, just itching for their chance to get at those promised "70 virgins, on a golden bed encrusted with jewels" (as was promised to one Islamic guy in the UK who turned them down).

[stormie_skies]

"...is the risk so high that we will benefit more in the way of safety from such an action than we will lose in net freedom from government interference?"

Yes. Don't think we don't have cells-in-hiding/training here, just itching for their chance to get at those promised "70 virgins, on a golden bed encrusted with jewels" (as was promised to one Islamic guy in the UK who turned them down).

Oh, no doubt we do. I wouldn't argue that at all. But in a free society, is there any way to eliminate that risk? And if there was a way, would it be worth doing?

Most things in life involve some sort of danger....we as human beings have to come to grips with that, and live like the danger doesn't exist, or we would be paralyzed with fear. How could we drive, or ride a bike, or live near the coast during hurricane season if we didn't?

Terrorists do what they do to create a new, extremely terrible fear ....and hope that by doing so, they can gain some bargaining power. If we give the government more and more control over our lives....if we become less free....all because some jack$@# blew up a train somewhere, aren't we giving terrorists the reaction they want? Aren't we legitimizing their actions by proving that what they do can and will change our way of life?

[streetsoldier]

"Aren't we legitimizing their actions by proving that what they do can and will change our way of life?"

No...we are potentiating our ability to incarcerate the (expletive unwritten)s, and by extension, get at their support systems, hideouts, funding, etc.

I'm not one to sit on his hands and do nothing...I want to be PRO-active, not RE-active.